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2 Peter 2:1

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Van

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Reformed1689 said:
Right and 1 Timothy 2:6 is not talking about all individuals. Jesus said he gave his life as a ransom for many, not all.
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LOL, this poster claims ransom for all means ransom for some. I kid you not...
In the idiom contrasting the many with the one, the many refers to everyone except the one. Thus the claim that the many does not mean all is biblically illiterate.
 
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Van

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What does John 6:39 actually say? 'This is the will of the Father who snt Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing but raise it up at the last day.'
Nothing here about anyone being 'transferred into Christ's spiritual body.' You are reading that in. Those referred to are theey whom the Father has chosen for salvation before the foundation of the world and given to Christ to redeem (Ephesians 1:4). And they come to Christ in time although their salvation was determined 'before time began' (Titus 1:2). 'All that the Father gives Me will come to Me.' It is then, when they come that they are justified by faith alone and transferred into the kingdom of the beloved Son (Colossians 1:13)

Where in Scripture is it said that the Good Shepherd gave His life for the goats? If every single person is ransomed by Christ, then they are indeed ransomed, and unless there is some deficiency in the blood of Christ, they will be saved. But in the context of 1 Timothy 2:1-6, 'all' means kings and commoners, Jews and Gentiles, rich and poor, pharisees and sinners, 'as many as the Lord shall call' (Romans 2:39).
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Talk about being biblically illiterate! A person must be "in (within) Christ in order to not be cast out (of Christ). Duh

How does a person get to be in (within) Christ's spiritual body. They are transferred in, Colossians 1:13, they are baptized in (Romans 6:3) they are put in (1 Corinthians 1:30) and so forth and so on.

Since scripture says individuals are chosen through faith in the truth, no individual was chosen for salvation before creation. Since scripture says everyone chosen once was not a people, no individual was chosen before they existed (during their lifetime) as not a people.

Was an individual's salvation "determined" before time began? Nope, as no one was chosen before they were once not a people who had not yet received mercy.

Did God plan to redeem believers before time began? Yes, He chose Logos to be His lamb. Does this plan pick individuals, or is the choice made though faith in the truth? Faith in the truth.

Here is the actual biblical sequence. God chooses an individual based on crediting their faith as righteousness and places (transfers, gives, baptizes) the individual spiritually into Christ's spiritual body. Once within Christ, they are made alive together with Christ, which is the washing of regeneration, where their body of sin is removed. Thus every born anew believer is justified, not by imputation but by the blood of the Lamb.
 
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AustinC

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Van said:
Since scripture says individuals are chosen through faith in the truth, no individual was chosen for salvation before creation. Since scripture says everyone chosen once was not a people, no individual was chosen before they existed (during their lifetime) as not a people.
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Here I read the assertion according to Van, which the Bible does not declare, but Van certainly interprets the Bible into saying this.

Was an individual's salvation "determined" before time began? Nope, as no one was chosen before they were once not a people who had not yet received mercy.
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Here is an outright ignoring of Ephesians 1 as Van interprets the Bible in a way that only he does

Did God plan to redeem believers before time began? Yes, He chose Logos to be His lamb. Does this plan pick individuals, or is the choice made though faith in the truth? Faith in the truth.
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Van adds faith as though it was a human asset that God reviews before He will choose someone. Again, this is a Van interpretation of the Bible that only Van holds to.

Here is the actual biblical sequence. God chooses an individual based on crediting their faith as righteousness and places (transfers, gives, baptizes) the individual spiritually into Christ's spiritual body. Once within Christ, they are made alive together with Christ, which is the washing of regeneration, where their body of sin is removed. Thus every born anew believer is justified, not by imputation but by the blood of the Lamb.
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This is the Van interpretation of sequence that Van certainly holds to and believes, but this is only because his interpretation is incorrect as He rejects how Faith is distributed by God to God's elect.

It is certainly an interpretation, but it is certainly an interpretation that I personally find God dishonoring
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

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Van said:
LOL, this poster claims ransom for all means ransom for some. I kid you not...
In the idiom contrasting the many with the one, the many refers to everyone except the one. Thus the claim that the many does not mean all is biblically illiterate.
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No, unlike you I just read in context. Why did Jesus say many instead of all? Hmm?
 
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Van

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AustinC said:
Here I read the assertion according to Van, which the Bible does not declare, but Van certainly interprets the Bible into saying this.


Here is an outright ignoring of Ephesians 1 as Van interprets the Bible in a way that only he does


Van adds faith as though it was a human asset that God reviews before He will choose someone. Again, this is a Van interpretation of the Bible that only Van holds to.


This is the Van interpretation of sequence that Van certainly holds to and believes, but this is only because his interpretation is incorrect as He rejects how Faith is distributed by God to God's elect.

It is certainly an interpretation, but it is certainly an interpretation that I personally find God dishonoring
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1) This post denies 2 Thessalonians 2:13 which "declares" God chooses individuals through faith in the truth. And God would not choose those whose faith He does not credit as righteousness.

2) I do reject views precluded by scripture, such as God does not choose individuals through faith, but chooses them and gives them faith. That view nullifies James 2:5, 2 Thessalonians 2:13, John 3:16, Ephesians 2:8 and every verse that says "through faith." See Romans 3:25 and so forth.
 
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Van

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Reformed1689 said:
No, unlike you I just read in context. Why did Jesus say many instead of all? Hmm?
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I just explained when we see Christ died for the many think all!!!!!! Since God desires all people to be saved, to claim Christ only provides redemption for some of them is ludicrous.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

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Van said:
I just explained when we see Christ died for the many think all!!!!!! Since God desires all people to be saved, to claim Christ only provides redemption for some of them is ludicrous.
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In case you did not know, many and all are not the same thing.
 
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AustinC

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Van said:
This poster has deleted 1 Timothy 2:4 from his bible.
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No, but perhaps you have removed 1 Timothy 2:1-3 from your Bible?

*1 Timothy 2:1-6*

First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way. This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all, which is the testimony given at the proper time.
 
V

Van

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AustinC said:
No, but perhaps you have removed 1 Timothy 2:1-3 from your Bible?

*1 Timothy 2:1-6*

First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way. This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all, which is the testimony given at the proper time.
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This supports my view!!!
 
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AustinC

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Van said:
This supports my view!!!
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I know you think so, yet you are wrong...and the verses reveal you to be wrong.

In previous threads I have gone through this passage and pointed out what Paul is saying. You simply reject the context of the passage and force your interpretation and pretext onto the passage which means you use poor hermeneutics.
 
Salty

Salty

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