A Fresh Blossom on the TULIP

[MB]

Ok Van

let me help you

In Christ

we have been justified

we have been redeemed

we were once dead, but now alive

we are now alive to God

we have now been freed from the law of sin and death

we are now loved of God

made one with other believers

I am sure that you have some kind of problem with my post, so please let us know what is wrong here?

No where in all this is your Love of Christ and no conviction of your sins. No confession of your sins no repentance and no faith.
No where in scripture is it ever said God saves with out these requirements. These all come before Salvation.
MB

 

[Marooncat79]

No where in all this is your Love of Christ and no conviction of your sins. No confession of your sins no repentance and no faith.
No where in scripture is it ever said God saves with out these requirements. These all come before Salvation.
MB

I honestly do not know how to respond to this

anyone else?

 

[MB]

I honestly do not know how to respond to this

anyone else?

Your Judgement of me not knowing scripture and now we see it is you who doesn't know. Hypocrites are a dime a dozzen.

MB

 

[Van]

Totally in Adam; 1 Corinthians 15:22
Unlimited Reconciliation; 1 Timothy 2:6
Limited Redemption; John 3:16
In Christ; 1 Corinthians 1:30
Protected Faith;

These are the on topic issues. See if anyone cites verses that support these teaching

Ask yourselves, why Calvinists turn every bible doctrine thread into petty personal insults?

 

[thomas15]

There is an observation in scripture that God is a Sovereign God who rules entirely over the affairs of men. There is no observation of co-rulership as free will philosophers promote.

I don't know of anyone who takes the actual words of the Bible seriously who would argue that Jehovah is not sovereign. Perhaps you do but I don't. A sovereign God, for your information, sets the conditions to become a child of God and, and incidentally, it is those who trust in His name John 1:12.

 

[AustinC]

I don't know of anyone who takes the actual words of the Bible seriously who would argue that Jehovah is not sovereign. Perhaps you do but I don't. A sovereign God, for your information, sets the conditions to become a child of God and, and incidentally, it is those who trust in His name John 1:12.

Yet, every free-will proponent demands that God not act in any fashion against their own determinant will. This demand is a declaration of autonomy and sovereignty that requires God to be no greater than an equal to themselves. Thus, demanding equality, the free-will proponent requires the God of the universe to go no further than they allow and thus, in that act, they make themselves their own god and declare the Creator to be their personal genie who does only what they will him to do.

Follow free-will to its foundation and you find human pride oozing and declaring its own sovereignty over God.

 

[AustinC]

Totally in Adam; 1 Corinthians 15:22
Unlimited Reconciliation; 1 Timothy 2:6
Limited Redemption; John 3:16
In Christ; 1 Corinthians 1:30
Protected Faith;

These are the on topic issues. See if anyone cites verses that support these teaching

Ask yourselves, why Calvinists turn every bible doctrine thread into petty personal insults?

The desert island of Van...

 

[thomas15]

Yet, every free-will proponent demands that God not act in any fashion against their own determinant will. This demand is a declaration of autonomy and sovereignty that requires God to be no greater than an equal to themselves. Thus, demanding equality, the free-will proponent requires the God of the universe to go no further than they allow and thus, in that act, they make themselves their own god and declare the Creator to be their personal genie who does only what they will him to do.

Follow free-will to its foundation and you find human pride oozing and declaring its own sovereignty over God.

What you are doing is classifying people into groups of your own making and ascribing to them negative characteristics with an authoritative tone when in-fact you actually don't really know what you are talking about because I really haven't taken any kind of classic offensive position. I'm not saying you are a liberal but you use liberal tactics in particular the personal insults to make your case which is not as strong as you seem to think it is with the hope that those of us who oppose you will just give up after all because in the grand scope of things in world of internet no one really case what either of us thinks. Sad really you should spend more time studying the Bible and taking the words of the Scriptures seriously instead of trying to make a case for your imperfect theological stance.you might find it refreshing. Problem for you is it requires faith in the word that is at odds with what most consider academic.

 

[percho]

No where in all this is your Love of Christ and no conviction of your sins. No confession of your sins no repentance and no faith.
No where in scripture is it ever said God saves with out these requirements. These all come before Salvation.
MB

I believe they come after God calls one unto salvation according to his purpose.

I believe that is what took place with Saul going down the road to Damascus.

Saul was not seeking God, the Father nor the Son. God was seeking Saul according to his purpose.

 

[percho]

I honestly do not know how to respond to this

anyone else?

I gave it a shot.

 

[MB]

I believe they come after God calls one unto salvation according to his purpose.

I believe that is what took place with Saul going down the road to Damascus.

Saul was not seeking God, the Father nor the Son. God was seeking Saul according to his purpose.

Saul was a murderer of Christians. He must of thought he was doing God a favor. He was a member of the Sanhedrin. It wasn't as if he was ignorant of who Jesus was. When Saul realized who he was speaking with it must have shocked him..It would have scared me half to death. Pauls Salvation went like this

Act 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
Act 9:5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
Act 9:6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.
In verses 4 and 5 Saul was convicted in verse 6 Saul surrendered to Christ asking Him what He wanted Saul to do

It wasn"t zap he was saved. He was convicted and he surrendered. Paul was definitely not looking for Christ He thought Christ was already dead. We have to admit that Paul was already a believer in God. He just didn't believe in Jesus. When he asked the Lord what He would have him do as underlined above Saul had already surrendered when he asked that of Christ.

I can only imagine how bad Paul must have felt when Christ told Paul who was speaking to Him. The very person he hated and was trying to kill all of the followers of Jesus.
MB

 

[AustinC]

What you are doing is classifying people into groups of your own making and ascribing to them negative characteristics with an authoritative tone when in-fact you actually don't really know what you are talking about because I really haven't taken any kind of classic offensive position. I'm not saying you are a liberal but you use liberal tactics in particular the personal insults to make your case which is not as strong as you seem to think it is with the hope that those of us who oppose you will just give up after all because in the grand scope of things in world of internet no one really case what either of us thinks. Sad really you should spend more time studying the Bible and taking the words of the Scriptures seriously instead of trying to make a case for your imperfect theological stance.you might find it refreshing. Problem for you is it requires faith in the word that is at odds with what most consider academic.

I am saying that the concept of free-will is a philosophy of men, not explicitly taught in the Bible.

I am taking free-will philosophy to its conclusion. When you take the philosophy of atheism to its conclusion, you end up with nihilism and meaninglessness. When you take free will to its conclusion, you end up with human pride and self as god, while the Creator becomes a side-kick assistant.

Many free-will thinkers refuse to follow the philosophy to its conclusion and prefer to ignore the obvious contradictions. It's the same with atheists. They refuse to follow their philosophy to its conclusion and thus live in contradiction.

 

[Van]

The desert island of Van...

The sheer idiocy of ad hominems is found on the island of blind Calvinists.

 

[percho]

Saul was a murderer of Christians. He must of thought he was doing God a favor. He was a member of the Sanhedrin. It wasn't as if he was ignorant of who Jesus was. When Saul realized who he was speaking with it must have shocked him..It would have scared me half to death. Pauls Salvation went like this

Act 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
Act 9:5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
Act 9:6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.
In verses 4 and 5 Saul was convicted in verse 6 Saul surrendered to Christ asking Him what He wanted Saul to do

It wasn"t zap he was saved. He was convicted and he surrendered. Paul was definitely not looking for Christ He thought Christ was already dead. We have to admit that Paul was already a believer in God. He just didn't believe in Jesus. When he asked the Lord what He would have him do as underlined above Saul had already surrendered when he asked that of Christ.

I can only imagine how bad Paul must have felt when Christ told Paul who was speaking to Him. The very person he hated and was trying to kill all of the followers of Jesus.
MB

Was this an absolute must?

wherefore, I give you to understand that no one, in the Spirit of God speaking, saith Jesus is anathema, and no one is able to say Jesus is Lord, except in the Holy Spirit.

Did Paul renew is own mind or did he have a renewing of his mind? What renewed his mind? Was Paul zapped according to the purpose of God? Was Jeremiah zapped before he was born, according to purpose?

but what saith the divine answer to him? 'I left to Myself seven thousand men, who did not bow a knee to Baal.' So then also in the present time a remnant according to the choice of grace there hath been;

 

[Van]

Totally in Adam; 1 Corinthians 15:22
Unlimited Reconciliation; 1 Timothy 2:6
Limited Redemption; John 3:16
In Christ; 1 Corinthians 1:30
Protected Faith; 1 Peter 1:5

This fresh TULIP sprouted from scripture, with multiple supporting passages for every part of the flower.

 

[Van]

If the T of the needing reform TULIP were true;
it would not be hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom. Luke 18:24
If the T of the needing reform TULIP were true,
the people of Matthew 23:13 would not have been entering the kingdom.
If the U of the needing reform TULIP were true,
God would not have chosen those "rich in faith, those that love God" James 2:5
If the U of the needing reform TULIP were true,
God would not choose people for salvation by reason of faith in the truth. 2 Thessalonians 2:13
If the L of the needing reform TULIP were true,
Christ would not lay down His life as a ransom for all, 1 Timothy 2:6
If the L of the needing reformTULIP were true,
Christ would not have "bought" those heading for swift destruction, 2 Peter 2:1
If the I of the needing reform TULIP were true,
the people of Matthew 23:13 could not have been prevented from entering the kingdom.
If the I of the needing reform TULIP were true,
it would not be hard for rich men to enter the kingdom. Matthew 19:23

It is past time to replace the wilted flower of old with a fresh TULIP, one that actually presents biblical doctrine.

 

[AustinC]

MB wrote:
No where in all this is your Love of Christ and no conviction of your sins. No confession of your sins no repentance and no faith.
No where in scripture is it ever said God saves with out these requirements. These all come before Salvation.
MB

I honestly do not know how to respond to this

anyone else?

MB just declared a gospel of merited salvation...but he cannot fathom that he has made such a declaration.

 

[Van]

MB just declared a gospel of merited salvation...but he cannot fathom that he has made such a declaration.

Notice how the same Calvinists make the same false charges against all non-Calvinist posters.

 

[MB]

Notice how the same Calvinists make the same false charges against all non-Calvinist posters.

Pitiful isn't it they can't deal with scripture it might change there minds. It's just plain pitiful to see them give us there best hateful remarks It all slides off like water off a ducks back. Absolutely no humility.
MB

 

[AustinC]

Notice how the same Calvinists make the same false charges against all non-Calvinist posters.

Pitiful isn't it they can't deal with scripture it might change there minds. It's just plain pitiful to see them give us there best hateful remarks It all slides off like water off a ducks back. Absolutely no humility.
MB

Notice how I quoted you directly, word for word, regarding the requirements (merit) you demand before God can save.

Indeed, I hate a graceless gospel because it is not what God teaches and it is anathema to Christ Jesus.

I desire that you repent of your unsound teaching.