A New Type of Christian Political Discussion

[Revmitchell]

This is what Bush said in the ABC News interview.

Oct. 26, 2004 - While the president often refers to God during public addresses to his supporters, Bush's religious convictions don't always seem to reflect those of the conservative Christians who make up his political base.

In an exclusive interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson, Bush said he believes that both Christians and Muslims worship the same God.

"I think we do. We have different routes of getting to the Almighty," Bush said. "But I want you to understand, I want your listeners to understand, I don't get to get decide who goes to heaven. The Almighty God decides who goes to heaven and I am on my personal walk," he said.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you believe that there are different ways of "getting to the Almighty" I think YOU need to seriously examine your own beliefs.

He may have said it. He may even be lost. But it is not unforgivable.

 

[Palatka51]

Originally Posted by JustChristian
This is what Bush said in the ABC News interview.

Oct. 26, 2004 - While the president often refers to God during public addresses to his supporters, Bush's religious convictions don't always seem to reflect those of the conservative Christians who make up his political base.

In an exclusive interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson, Bush said he believes that both Christians and Muslims worship the same God.

"I think we do. We have different routes of getting to the Almighty," Bush said. "But I want you to understand, I want your listeners to understand, I don't get to get decide who goes to heaven. The Almighty God decides who goes to heaven and I am on my personal walk," he said.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you believe that there are different ways of "getting to the Almighty" I think YOU need to seriously examine your own beliefs.

Well don't all eventually get to God? Some by way of salvation through Jesus alone or by way of the Great White Throne and eternal judgment.

 

[JustChristian]

Well don't all eventually get to God? Some by way of salvation through Jesus alone or by way of the Great White Throne and eternal judgment.

Yes, we will. Some will be standing on His right hand and some on His left. But Bush was referring to eternal salvation.

 

[Palatka51]

Yes, we will. Some will be standing on His right hand and some on His left. But Bush was referring to eternal salvation.

Hasn't Obama said the same thing?

 

[Bible-boy]

Hasn't Obama said the same thing?

Yes he has. The point is that error on this point is not an unforgivable sin. As I read the text of Scripture there is only one unforgivable sin and it is blaspheming the Holy Spirit. The context of that passage reveals that Jesus was teaching that blaspheming the Holy Spirit is when one gives credit to the devil for the work of the Triune God.

"Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation"--because they said, "He has an unclean spirit" (Mark 3:28-30, NKJV).

Jesus said this in response to the fact that the scribes from Jerusalem said, "He has Beelzebub," and "By the ruler of the demons He casts out demons" (Mark 3:22, NKJV).

Jesus made it clear that the only unforgivable sin is blaspheming the Holy Spirit (i.e. attributing the work of the Triune God to that of the devil). Now, since Christians and Muslims do not worship the same God it is in fact impossible to be attributing the work of the Triune God to the devil by claiming that Muslims and Christians worship the same God. It is a false statement, but it does not attribute the work of the Triune God to the devil. It only speaks of the worship of men. The statement says nothing about the work of God.

Likewise, for someone speaking of Christians and Mulsims to say: "We have different routes of getting to the Almighty" again says nothing about the work of the Triune God. It only speaks of the religon of men (one true and one false). No one has ever been saved (i.e. born again) by the false teachings of Islam. Therefore, it is impossible to ever attribute true eternal salvation to the works and false teachings of Islam and thereby give credit for the devil for the work of the Triune God.

So, neither President Bush nor President-elect Obama balsphemed the Holy Spirit when that made similar universalist comments. Here again, this is an off-topic subject for another thread.

 

[Bible-boy]

Either you are refusing to admit what your side is doing, Bible-boy, or else you are blind to it.

Well of course there is another answer. You have fallen prey to a formal fallacy here. Your two suggested either/or options are not the only two possible options. It could be that we have not done anything that violates the BB Posting Rules and/or User Agreement (or the tried and true methods of orderly discourse and debate) and that you are simply wrong in your conclusion(s). However, like I said please feel free to report any bad posts that you feel somehow violate the BB Posting Rules and/or User Agreement and wait for the forum Mods/Admins to act on the issue.

 

[JustChristian]

Yes he has. The point is that error on this point is not an unforgivable sin. As I read the text of Scripture there is only one unforgivable sin and it is blaspheming the Holy Spirit. The context of that passage reveals that Jesus was teaching that blaspheming the Holy Spirit is when one gives credit to the devil for the work of the Triune God.



Jesus said this in response to the fact that the scribes from Jerusalem said, "He has Beelzebub," and "By the ruler of the demons He casts out demons" (Mark 3:22, NKJV).

Jesus made it clear that the only unforgivable sin is blaspheming the Holy Spirit (i.e. attributing the work of the Triune God to that of the devil). Now, since Christians and Muslims do not worship the same God it is in fact impossible to be attributing the work of the Triune God to the devil by claiming that Muslims and Christians worship the same God. It is a false statement, but it does not attribute the work of the Triune God to the devil. It only speaks of the worship of men. The statement says nothing about the work of God.

Likewise, for someone speaking of Christians and Mulsims to say: "We have different routes of getting to the Almighty" again says nothing about the work of the Triune God. It only speaks of the religon of men (one true and one false). No one has ever been saved (i.e. born again) by the false teachings of Islam. Therefore, it is impossible to ever attribute true eternal salvation to the works and false teachings of Islam and thereby give credit for the devil for the work of the Triune God.

So, neither President Bush nor President-elect Obama balsphemed the Holy Spirit when that made similar universalist comments. Here again, this is an off-topic subject for another thread.

Can you just TRY to be even-handed? I responded to a post that said that everyone who voted Democratic in not a Christian. What does that have to do with having mor appropriate discourse? But it didn't seem to bother you. Why not?

 

[Bible-boy]

Can you just TRY to be even-handed? I responded to a post that said that everyone who voted Democratic in not a Christian. What does that have to do with having mor appropriate discourse? But it didn't seem to bother you. Why not?

I am a Moderator on the BaptistBoard. However, I am not a Moderator of this specific forum (meaning I can't edit or delete other's posts in this forum). I don't have the abillity to do what you are asking me to do with respect to the post you reference. Likewise, you have no way of knowing whether or not I reported the post you are referencing as a bad post to the Mods/Admins of this forum. Furthermore, when I pointed out that we were getting off-topic from the OP at the conclusion of my post, which you quoted above, I did so in attempt to get everyone to stop that line of discussion and return to the subject of the OP. Finally, my post was responding to Palatka51 not to you so I don't know why you have reacted toward me in this way. I understand that you may not know exactly how the Baptist Board Moderator/Administrator team works. However, now that I have enlightened you a bit in that regard I'll graciously accept your apology, in the spirit of the topic of this thread, for implying that I have not moderated with an even hand.

 

[windcatcher]

I am a Moderator on the BaptistBoard. However, I am not a Moderator of this specific forum (meaning I can't edit or delete other's posts in this forum). I don't have the abillity to do what you are asking me to do with respect to the post you reference. Likewise, you have no way of knowing whether or not I reported the post you are referencing as a bad post to the Mods/Admins of this forum. Furthermore, when I pointed out that we were getting off-topic from the OP at the conclusion of my post, which you quoted above, I did so in attempt to get everyone to stop that line of discussion and return to the subject of the OP. Finally, my post was responding to Palatka51 not to you so I don't know why you have reacted toward me in this way. I understand that you may not know exactly how the Baptist Board Moderator/Administrator team works. However, now that I have enlightened you a bit in that regard I'll graciously accept your apology, in the spirit of the topic of this thread, for implying that I have not moderated with an even hand.

Don't hold your breath, Bible Boy! This kind doesn't apologize.......except after much prayer and fasting....

Appropriate for this section (i.e. Politics)........ many promises are made but no change.:laugh:

 

[Spinach]

Me thinks me should rethink joining here?

 

[Bible-boy]

Me thinks me should rethink joining here?

Naw,

Stick around and see if the folks who promised in this thread to post in a more Christ-like fashion live up to the agreement or not.

Oh... welcome aboard.:wavey:

 

[JustChristian]

I am a Moderator on the BaptistBoard. However, I am not a Moderator of this specific forum (meaning I can't edit or delete other's posts in this forum). I don't have the abillity to do what you are asking me to do with respect to the post you reference. Likewise, you have no way of knowing whether or not I reported the post you are referencing as a bad post to the Mods/Admins of this forum. Furthermore, when I pointed out that we were getting off-topic from the OP at the conclusion of my post, which you quoted above, I did so in attempt to get everyone to stop that line of discussion and return to the subject of the OP. Finally, my post was responding to Palatka51 not to you so I don't know why you have reacted toward me in this way. I understand that you may not know exactly how the Baptist Board Moderator/Administrator team works. However, now that I have enlightened you a bit in that regard I'll graciously accept your apology, in the spirit of the topic of this thread, for implying that I have not moderated with an even hand.

I think it's confusing to post as a moderator and tell someone is off topic and then come back later to say "Hey I'm not on duty." Why should I apologize for asking someone I perceived to be the Moderator showing bias?

 

[LadyEagle]

Folks, this thread has reached the 10 page limit & is now being closed.

LE