A Response to Why I am #NeverTrump

[Calminian]

I have 5 kids. What I don't understand is, why don't Christians care about the Supreme Court anymore? That used to be the main issue Christians were concerned with. That is the future for our next generation. Now it's a secondary issue in the Church. Now we're worried about Trump maybe not turning his cheek as much as he should. Have we really become this legalistic?

At this time, we have one candidate that can keep the Court from going full blown anti-Christian. He has provided a list that's been praised by Christians and Conservatives. We have another candidate that's promising to put in the most anti-Christian judges imaginable on the bench. Yet the modern Church (not all of us, mind you, but a large portion of it) can't get over a little tough talk and salty language. Are we really going to throw our kid's future away because we got our feelings hurt? God have mercy on our kids if we do.

 

[Use of Time]

I'm more concerned with my kids having to endure World War III.

 

[InTheLight]

I'm more concerned with my kids having to endure World War III.

This, right here.

Throw in the smothering tariffs Trump wants, his plan to spend $1 trillion on a public works project running the debt even higher, his plan to "rebuild" the military, his tax cuts for the rich, and you have a recipe for economic disaster. When unemployment hits 10%, inflation is running rampant, interest rates are raised through the roof, and we're at war with whatever country Trump feels slighted him, the last thing I'm going to be worrying about is SCOTUS.

 

[Calminian]

This, right here.

Throw in the smothering tariffs Trump wants, his plan to spend $1 trillion on a public works project running the debt even higher, his plan to "rebuild" the military, his tax cuts for the rich, and you have a recipe for economic disaster. When unemployment hits 10%, inflation is running rampant, interest rates are raised through the roof, and we're at war with whatever country Trump feels slighted him, the last thing I'm going to be worrying about is SCOTUS.

And I think this sums up the difference between the Church in the 80s, and the church today. Reagan preached strength, while the born-again pacifist Sunday school teacher preached weakness and appeasement. As our hostages were held in Iran, Reagan spoke of lowering taxes and building up our military. Carter spoke of socialism and cutting down our military.

The church at that time chose Reagan, who cared a great deal about the american worker. He even used tariffs in certain situation like Trump wants to. They elected Reagan and the hostages in Iran were immediately released. A time of peace and prosperity followed and eventually, in his wake, the debt went down as well. He was strong, and the church that elected him was strong.

Because of this, we live today under many good judges that have kept the court balanced. We, the children of the 80s have benefited greatly. Now we're going to turn around and throw away our kid's futures away because we're scared to be strong. We're scared to build up our military. We're scared to be tough. The truth is, we're cowards, and we're going to try to elect the Jimmy Carter of our time, which is Hillary Clinton. We've gone back to the silly notion that peace comes through weakness. It's the folly the proverbs speak of often.

 

[InTheLight]

The church at that time chose Reagan, who cared a great deal about the american worker. He even used tariffs in certain situation like Trump wants to.

I remember the tariff on semiconductor chips from Japan and also motorcycles from Japan. These were targeted tariffs in particular products. Trump is talking about a broad-brush approach to tariffs, slapping tariffs on whole countries instead of particular products from certain countries.

They elected Reagan and the hostages in Iran were immediately released. A time of peace and prosperity followed and eventually, in his wake, the debt went down as well.

No, the debt did not go down under Reagan, it went up.

Because of this, we live today under many good judges that have kept the court balanced. We, the children of the 80s have benefited greatly. Now we're going to turn around and throw away our kid's futures away because we're scared to be strong. We're scared to build up our military. We're scared to be tough. The truth is, we're cowards, and we're going to try to elect the Jimmy Carter of our time, which is Hillary Clinton. We've gone back to the silly notion that peace comes through weakness. It's the folly the proverbs speak of often.

I'm all for having the strongest military in the world, but let's be smart about how we build it up.

 

[Calminian]

I remember the tariff on semiconductor chips from Japan and also motorcycles from Japan. These were targeted tariffs in particular products. Trump is talking about a broad-brush approach to tariffs, slapping tariffs on whole countries instead of particular products from certain countries.

Trump hasn't put a single tariff in place yet. He's merely talked about using them if necessary. He may not have to use them at all, just as Reagan never had to use our military in any significant way. If China starts playing by fair rules, no tariffs will be necessary. But I'm glad they are on the table.

No, the debt did not go down under Reagan, it went up.

I never said it did. Read carefully.

I'm all for having the strongest military in the world, but let's be smart about how we build it up.

There's nothing smart about trusting Hillary to build our military. There's only one candidate that is good with money and budgeting and will build it in a smart way. Trump's economic plan is praised by virtually all Reagan economists. What do they say of Hillary's plan?

But it appears the church of this generation, the one that's benefited by wisdom of the prior generation, has truly become foolish. Hope I'm wrong.

 

[InTheLight]

I never said it did. Read carefully.

You said:

A time of peace and prosperity followed and eventually, in his wake, the debt went down as well.

True, the debt went down slightly between 1997 and 2000, but Reagan had been out of office for 9 years. The debt increased under Reagan.

 

[StefanM]

The church at that time chose Reagan, who cared a great deal about the american worker. He even used tariffs in certain situation like Trump wants to. They elected Reagan and the hostages in Iran were immediately released. A time of peace and prosperity followed and eventually, in his wake, the debt went down as well. He was strong, and the church that elected him was strong.

Because of this, we live today under many good judges that have kept the court balanced. We, the children of the 80s have benefited greatly. Now we're going to turn around and throw away our kid's futures away because we're scared to be strong. We're scared to build up our military. We're scared to be tough. The truth is, we're cowards, and we're going to try to elect the Jimmy Carter of our time, which is Hillary Clinton. We've gone back to the silly notion that peace comes through weakness. It's the folly the proverbs speak of often.

It's not about being tough. Hillary Clinton is a hawk. She voted for the Iraq War, as Trump likes to point out. Bernie Sanders's supporters have been apoplectic over Hillary's propensity to support intervention.

It's not force--it's what you use the force to accomplish. Trump needs to show he has the temperament to use force fully when necessary and to back off when unnecessary.

But, most importantly, any comparisons to Reagan are very hard to make. Trump may be a lot of things, but he's not a 1/3 of the man Reagan was. I wouldn't trust him to pick my Pop Tarts. Why should we trust him to pick SCOTUS nominees?

The GOP should have nominated Rubio. I'll say that a thousand times.

 

[StefanM]

You said:

A time of peace and prosperity followed and eventually, in his wake, the debt went down as well.

True, the debt went down slightly between 1997 and 2000, but Reagan had been out of office for 9 years. The debt increased under Reagan.

That's a bit like giving Carter credit for the Reagan tax cuts.

 

[Calminian]

...Trump needs to show he has the temperament to use force fully when necessary and to back off when unnecessary....

The same was said of Reagan. "he wants war" is what I heard all the time.

And comparisons are impossible not to make. Reagan, just like Trump, was questioned about his past liberalism, about his Hollywood career and his astrology believing wife, and his failed prior marriage. It's all the same stuff. The only difference is the lack of wisdom in today's church, willing to throw away our supreme court. If you're willing to do that, you truly are foolish.

 

[Calminian]

You said:

A time of peace and prosperity followed and eventually, in his wake, the debt went down as well.

True, the debt went down slightly between 1997 and 2000, but Reagan had been out of office for 9 years. The debt increased under Reagan.

yes, and that's deftly in the wake of Reagan and Bush. We have much to be thankful for.

 

[StefanM]

The same was said of Reagan. "he wants war" is what I heard all the time.

And comparisons are impossible not to make. Reagan, just like Trump, was questioned about his past liberalism, about his Hollywood career and his astrology believing wife, and his failed prior marriage. It's all the same stuff. The only difference is the lack of wisdom in today's church, willing to throw away our supreme court. If you're willing to do that, you truly are foolish.

My desires don't matter. Arkansas is so red that you can poke the ground with a stick and red water comes up. It wasn't this way until the Obama administration, but now anyone who runs statewide with an R next to his her name wins. Both senators are Republican, and our entire House delegation is Republican. Our governor is Republican, and both houses of our state legislature are Republican.

We couldn't be more Republican if we tried. Trust me. Trump is going to win this state, and he wont even have to try to do it. The R next to his name is sufficient.

For me, I voted for Rubio in the primary, and I'm planning to vote third party in the general election because my vote won't matter either way.

If Trump loses Arkansas, Clinton will have a Reaganesque landslide victory, and my vote still wouldn't matter.

 

[InTheLight]

yes, and that's deftly in the wake of Reagan and Bush. We have much to be thankful for.

Except that the economic gains of the mid-90's, late 90's were almost all attributed to the boom in technology and the start of the internet age (which led to capital equipment purchases and increased worker productivity), coupled with the Republicans tax cuts and welfare reform. In other words, Reagan had little to do with the debt going down for four years in the late 90's.

 

[Calminian]

...For me, I voted for Rubio in the primary, and I'm planning to vote third party in the general election....

Which unfortunately proves my thesis. We are are among the most foolish of generations in Church history. May our kids somehow escape our foolishness and not walk in our footsteps.

You may not like the guy, but Trump has put out a list of potential judges that his been praised by Christians and conservatives alike. Hillary is promising to do just the opposite. A vote 3rd party is helping her. Shame on you if you go through with that.

 

[Calminian]

Except that the economic gains of the mid-90's, late 90's were almost all attributed to the boom in technology and the start of the internet age (which led to capital equipment purchases and increased worker productivity), coupled with the Republicans tax cuts and welfare reform. In other words, Reagan had little to do with the debt going down for four years in the late 90's.

Which, again, came in Reagan's wake. He we not had the peace and strength he gave us in the 80s, we would never have enjoyed the advances of the 90s.

 

[InTheLight]

Which unfortunately proves my thesis. We are are among the most foolish of generations in Church history. May our kids somehow escape our foolishness and not walk in our footsteps.

You may not like the guy, but Trump has put out a list of potential judges that his been praised by Christians and conservatives alike. Hillary is promising to do just the opposite. A vote 3rd party is helping her. Shame on you if you go through with that.

Well, shame on you for voting for a prideful serial adulterer, a casino owner, a person that says he's never asked God for forgiveness just tries to do good all by himself.

 

[StefanM]

Which unfortunately proves my thesis. We are are among the most foolish of generations in Church history. May our kids somehow escape our foolishness and not walk in our footsteps.

You may not like the guy, but Trump has put out a list of potential judges that his been praised by Christians and conservatives alike. Hillary is promising to do just the opposite. A vote 3rd party is helping her. Shame on you if you go through with that.

Since you're basically calling me foolish, I'm going to be a little sarcastic.

Are you familiar with arithmetic?

Trump is so far ahead in Arkansas that my vote DOES. NOT. MATTER. It won't elect Hillary because Hillary won't win Arkansas under any circumstances. It won't elect anyone because Trump's lead is insurmountable. It's like a Democrat voting for the Green Party in California. They still won't spoil because the race is not even close.

There is absolutely no chance on earth that Hillary will win Arkansas, period. The numbers do not add up.

Literally the only reason I'm going to the polls this November is to vote on state constitutional amendments. The rest of the ballot, all the way down to state representative is either uncontested or ridiculously non-competitive.

I know it's not government-imposed, but I have as much candidate choice as an old Soviet citizen. Seriously. The Democrats don't even bother to field candidates in most of these races because it's not worth the filing fee.

 

[InTheLight]

Which, again, came in Reagan's wake. He we not had the peace and strength he gave us in the 80s, we would never have enjoyed the advances of the 90s.

Ridiculous.

 

[InTheLight]

Since you're basically calling me foolish, I'm going to be a little sarcastic.

Are you familiar with arithmetic?

Trump is so far ahead in Arkansas that my vote DOES. NOT. MATTER. It won't elect Hillary because Hillary won't win Arkansas under any circumstances. It won't elect anyone because Trump's lead is insurmountable.

Yes, the argument could be made that voting for Trump would be a wasted vote in Arkansas because he's going to win handily. Any vote above and beyond the vote that gives Trump the victory is technically a wasted vote.

It's nice that you are able to vote your conscience.

I'm in a little bit different situation. Being in Minnesota, it's going to go for Hillary and there is nothing Trump could do here to change that. So I can safely vote third party as well. Or not vote for President at all. I haven't decided yet.

 

[StefanM]

I'm in a little bit different situation. Being in Minnesota, it's going to go for Hillary and there is nothing Trump could do here to change that. So I can safely vote third party as well. Or not vote for President at all. I haven't decided yet.

I found out in the most recent Arkansas primary that I couldn't opt to vote for no one (electronic ballot, and I couldn't advance), and write-ins were not permitted. I don't know if that will hold true for the general election, but if I go to the polls to vote on things that actually do make a difference (amendments), then I may have no choice but to vote for someone. And that someone is Gary Johnson.