A woman teaching men?

[Silverhair]

LETS KEEP THE DISCUSSION ON THE OP

ie: A lesson plan written by a female to be used in a mens class?

We are NOT talking about a lady preaching or teaching --- if you want to discuss that - then please start a new thread.

If, as I had said re women that God could call them, then I do not see that using something that has been written by a woman should be a problem. I have not found anywhere in the bible that says God would not use a woman for the furtherance of His kingdom.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

Truth is truth, regardless of who wrote it down. Leaving a church because a Godly woman wrote the curriculum is a sure sign of a person having a "wish dream" that has become an idol in place of the body of Christ. (Read Bonhoeffer's "Life Together", chapter one on Community.)

The godly woman is free to use her curriculum to teacher other women, and to teach children as God commands.

She is not free to teach her curriculum to other men as God commands her not to.

Following God's orders is not creating an idol.

 

[JamesL]

He is saying God gave no specific command on the issue but He, as God’s anointed Apostle, has been given the authority from God to speak on God’s behalf. His words are God’s inspired truth and should be followed as if God Himself spoke directly to them.

If that were the case, then it would have, in fact, come from God. Too much of a reach

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

If, as I had said re women that God could call them, then I do not see that using something that has been written by a woman should be a problem. I have not found anywhere in the bible that says God would not use a woman for the furtherance of His kingdom.

But you will find the following in the Bible, which clearly shows that a woman should not be teaching. God does not restrict that to the pulpit as in the position of a Pastor, but to all teaching within the Church, Sunday School included.

"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." 1 Timothy 2:11-12

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:34-35

Christians cannot ignore the parts of the Bible we don't like because it doesn't fit our cultural norm. God commands it. God says it through inspired word. Period. End of story.

 

[Salty]

Where is the biblical basis for the question?

The Biblical basis - are the verses that say a women should not teach men

So would this also apply to a lesson developed by a women - but taught
by a man?


So far an interesting discussion (for the most part)

 

[Salty]

She is not free to teach her curriculum to other men as God commands her not to.
.

This is NOT about a lady teaching HER curriculum to men- ITs about a man teaching a curriculum written by a lady. Big difference.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

This is NOT about a lady teaching HER curriculum to men- ITs about a man teaching a curriculum written by a lady. Big difference.

I am well aware of that. There is no difference at all.

Hence my original comment:

A man would be parroting a woman's teachings...

Just because a woman isn't in-person teaching her thoughts doesn't mean a woman has not assumed authority over men.

The test isn't "Is there a woman present in the room teaching?".
The test is "Are the teachings of a woman being disseminated?".

That's why watching a recorded video of Beth Moore when she isn't present in the room is bad.
That's why a man teaching out of a Beth Moore book is bad.

If a woman writes a speech and a man reads it word for word whose ideas are being disseminated? Clearly the woman's ideas. The Bible prohibition is not on the presence of a woman, but the teachings of women.

 

[canadyjd]

But you will find the following in the Bible, which clearly shows that a woman should not be teaching. God does not restrict that to the pulpit as in the position of a Pastor, but to all teaching within the Church, Sunday School included.

"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." 1 Timothy 2:11-12

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:34-35

Christians cannot ignore the parts of the Bible we don't like because it doesn't fit our cultural norm. God commands it. God says it through inspired word. Period. End of story.

The 1 Timothy passage is referred to as a “pastoral epistle” because Paul is specifically giving Timothy instructions for leadership within the church. It does not speak to women teaching outside the assembly as evidenced when both Aquila and his wife Priscilla instructed Apollos after he spoke in the assembly.

The 1 Corinthian passage is concerning orderly worship services. Most likely former pagan worshippers (women in particular but not exclusively) would disrupt the services with questions, speaking in tongues, or other out burst.

Clearly, women are not allowed to serve as elders or Pastors. Nor are they allowed to teach men in the assembly as that would usurp the authority of men in the assembly.

It does not apply outside the assembly and certainly does not speak a man considering woman’s views on scripture as in the case of the OP.

However, let each be convinced in their own minds and act accordingly.

peace to you

 

[AustinC]

This is NOT about a lady teaching HER curriculum to men- ITs about a man teaching a curriculum written by a lady. Big difference.

I would challenge @Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin and @Reynolds to read Nancy Guthrie's 5 study books on Seeing Jesus in the Old Testament and then tell us if Nancy failed to teach them anything or that she taught falsely. Her intended audience is women, but men could stand a steady dose of teaching from Nancy Guthrie. She and her husband, David, have also established "Grief Share", a Bible based group meeting place to process grief and loss. It is outstanding curriculum.

 

[Reynolds]

Ok, so my exact words were "THE WHOLE CHAPTER..."

and that somehow inspires you to try to accuse me of saying "the Pauline epistles" ??

There's either some serious lack in your mental function, or you are deliberately committing libel.

Which is it? We'll wait

Self explanatory.

 

[Reynolds]

No. He did not.

 

[Reynolds]

I would challenge @Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin and @Reynolds to read Nancy Guthrie's 5 study books on Seeing Jesus in the Old Testament and then tell us if Nancy failed to teach them anything or that she taught falsely. Her intended audience is women, but men could stand a steady dose of teaching from Nancy Guthrie. She and her husband, David, have also established "Grief Share", a Bible based group meeting place to process grief and loss. It is outstanding curriculum.

I learned more about The Bible from a Seminary professor, who late in life became an atheist and traveled to churches to preach with his 25 year old girlfriend with him, than I learned from any other one person. Your point? People can have a natural ability to teach. That does not mean God called them.

Women are called and gifted to teach other women and kids. That does not mean they are permitted to teach men.

 

[canadyjd]

I learned more about The Bible from a Seminary professor, who late in life became an atheist and traveled to churches to preach with his 25 year old girlfriend with him, than I learned from any other one person. Your point? People can have a natural ability to teach. That does not mean God called them.

What an odd story. Why would you go to hear an atheist “preach” at a church? Why would any pastor allow an atheist to preach at his church?

Was the 25 year girlfriend also an atheist and did she help the atheist preacher study scripture for his sermon? Perhaps he used some of her books to preach atheism in the church that allowed the atheist preacher to preach.

Very curious story.

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

If that were the case, then it would have, in fact, come from God. Too much of a reach

It did come from God. That is Paul’s point. He is asserting his apostolic authority as a messenger from God to speak in the subject.

In no way is Paul telling anyone to ignore him if they want to. Just the opposite.

peace to you

 

[Reynolds]

 

[AustinC]

I learned more about The Bible from a Seminary professor, who late in life became an atheist and traveled to churches to preach with his 25 year old girlfriend with him, than I learned from any other one person. Your point? People can have a natural ability to teach. That does not mean God called them.

Women are called and gifted to teach other women and kids. That does not mean they are permitted to teach men.

So, despite the fact that Nancy Guthrie has a better grasp of God's word than you do and despite the fact that you can learn much from her curriculum, you would rather learn from an atheist.

That is just about the most glaring admission of pride I have seen in a long time. You would rather listen to an atheist rather than a woman of God.

 

[Reynolds]

So, despite the fact that Nancy Guthrie has a better grasp of God's word than you do and despite the fact that you can learn much from her curriculum, you would rather learn from an atheist.

That is just about the most glaring admission of pride I have seen in a long time. You would rather listen to an atheist rather than a woman of God.

I no longer learn from him. Haven't set under his teaching since I found that out about him.
The point is that because someone has a natural gifting to teach does not mean they are called to teach. Because a woman may be Spiritually gifted to teach women and kids, does not mean they are permitted to teach men.
You seem to mistake ability for permissibility. I have an outstanding ability to sin. That does not mean I am permitted to do so. As a friend of mine who is now in the ministry said "If you think sin is not fun then you didn't do it right." The fact one has an ability to excel at something, does not mean that it pleases God or is permitted by God.

 

[Salty]

So should Fundamental Baptist colleges have female instructors ?

Would that include secular subject ie English, science, math, ect
since "But you will find the following in the Bible, which clearly shows that a woman should not be teaching" (a man)

 

[Reynolds]

So should Fundamental Baptist colleges have female instructors ?

Would that include secular subject ie English, science, math, ect
since "But you will find the following in the Bible, which clearly shows that a woman should not be teaching" (a man)

They should not be professors at a Seminary. Professors exercise authority over students in doctrinal learning.
In non seminary general college curriculum I do not see the prohibition as applicable, but it might indeed be.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

The 1 Timothy passage is referred to as a “pastoral epistle” because Paul is specifically giving Timothy instructions for leadership within the church. It does not speak to women teaching outside the assembly as evidenced when both Aquila and his wife Priscilla instructed Apollos after he spoke in the assembly.

The 1 Corinthian passage is concerning orderly worship services. Most likely former pagan worshippers (women in particular but not exclusively) would disrupt the services with questions, speaking in tongues, or other out burst.

Clearly, women are not allowed to serve as elders or Pastors. Nor are they allowed to teach men in the assembly as that would usurp the authority of men in the assembly.

It does not apply outside the assembly and certainly does not speak a man considering woman’s views on scripture as in the case of the OP.

However, let each be convinced in their own minds and act accordingly.

peace to you

I've always seen that verse as Aquilla and Priscilla taking aside Apollos in the "parking lot" after Worship Service and correcting an error using the method that we are told to correct Brothers and Sisters in Peter.

R.C Sproul, being a Presbyterian, had a joke about that particular verse by the way. He claimed that Apollos was a Baptist and was merely doing the best with baptism he could until Aquilla and Priscilla told him to baptize babies. Sproul had a good sense humor haha.

I think our difference is what we consider "outside the assembly". I view Sunday School, small groups at Church member's houses and any other Church-sanctioned events that involve teaching as "in the assembly".