Alter Calls

[preachinjesus]

The biblical case for altar calls is sketchy at best. There is a slight case in Nehemiah 8-9 for one, but it is a rough exegetical task.

In terms of the New Testament, I don't see one. Of course how the Gospel was presented in the New Testament is much different than how we do it today. Paul didn't offer an invitation (as we understand it) in his address at the Areopagus.

To say that it is a biblical mandate for a New Testament church is just out of bounds exegetically imho.

Interestingly, as I went over this thread I see lots of argumentation about the biblicism of altar calls but very little actual interaction with the Bible or a presentation of the biblical evidences.

 

[Tom Bryant]

I would say that there was a call to people to respond to the Gospel message. (Acts 2:40-41)

Of course, I am not sure about the Spurgeon quote being about the altar that is being talked about in this thread.

 

[paul wassona]

Is there any biblical support for them. I am not saying that they are wrong, if done right I think it can be a good idea, but I cannot find it in the bible.

There are many altar calls in the Bible: God call Israel immediately to build an altar after crossing the Red Sea, Abraham built an altar on Mt Moriah as commanded by God, Abraham was called back to Bethel to the altar, the tabernacle wasn't complete without an altar and many built altars were built by others following the same example set by their predecessors.

We don't question why people go to the altar and it is always open, we're just glad people use it!

 

[paul wassona]

The biblical case for altar calls is sketchy at best. There is a slight case in Nehemiah 8-9 for one, but it is a rough exegetical task.

In terms of the New Testament, I don't see one. Of course how the Gospel was presented in the New Testament is much different than how we do it today. Paul didn't offer an invitation (as we understand it) in his address at the Areopagus.

To say that it is a biblical mandate for a New Testament church is just out of bounds exegetically imho.

Interestingly, as I went over this thread I see lots of argumentation about the biblicism of altar calls but very little actual interaction with the Bible or a presentation of the biblical evidences.

John the baptist demanded meats worthy of repentence be fore he'd baptize. They would be brought to an altar and that wouldn't be a "rough" exegetical task.

 

[Tom Bryant]

Paul,
I think you are stretching it quite a bit to equate the altars of the OT and the "altar" in a Baptist church.

The building in which we worship doesn't have anything like that except in the spiritualized sense. The temple of God is now the body of the believer rather than a physical location.

 

[paul wassona]

Paul,
I think you are stretching it quite a bit to equate the altars of the OT and the "altar" in a Baptist church.

The building in which we worship doesn't have anything like that except in the spiritualized sense. The temple of God is now the body of the believer rather than a physical location.

No stretch. What we offer to God now is bloodless because Jesus paid all the blood that will ever need be offered from here on out!:godisgood:

Many times the priests, which we all are in Jesus, would go to the altar and refuse to let go of the horns until hearing from God. Would that we'd all do the same.:thumbs:

 

[abcgrad94]

An altar is anywhere we offer God praise or thanks and/or ask for forgiveness. It is not a place, but a spiritual point where we meet with God.

 

[paul wassona]

An altar is anywhere we offer God praise or thanks and/or ask for forgiveness. It is not a place, but a spiritual point where we meet with God.

And our church provides a place for that point called the altar. The reason is for those who have the message fresh in their hearts and minds. It is not legalism to provide a fixed point and call it an altar, but it does sound like legalism when anyone asks for specific scriptures to show biblical support for having one!:type:

I preach a message when God nudges called, "God tells you when and where to build an altar". Are you saying that churches haven't been led of God to construct a place for the church as a body to come together and pray?

Since Jesus said His Father's house is a house of prayer, did not the Temple have altars for praying? I believe it is caled the Bemah. Many Jews made the family table the bemah after the Temple was destroyed, yet we find altars in synagogues today as well as in churches.

 

[abcgrad94]

And our church provides a place for that point called the altar. The reason is for those who have the message fresh in their hearts and minds. It is not legalism to provide a fixed point and call it an altar, but it does sound like legalism when anyone asks for specific scriptures to show biblical support for having one!:type:

I am not disputing any of that. I have no problem calling the front of a platform an altar if that is where people come to do business with God. I'm only pointing out that an altar does not have to be on Sunday mornings next to the platform in a church building. It can be anywhere.

While having a specific altar is not mandated in scripture it is a custom (tradition) that many use. I've read no scripture forbidding it or enforcing it, so I must conclude it's a matter of preference and liberty.:thumbs:

 

[paul wassona]

No, on the contrary I do believe it is mandated to have a personal as well as an altar for the church to come and pray.

I haven't looked up the specific passages today, but there is one that says something about when we come together to pray. Then there is that one that says when ye come together to pray.

"Ye' meaning all we.

 

[Grasshopper]

Paul,
I think you are stretching it quite a bit to equate the altars of the OT and the "altar" in a Baptist church.

:laugh::laugh: Isn't that called an anachronism?

Gosh, what did all those Christians do for 300 years before church buildings were used?

The building in which we worship doesn't have anything like that except in the spiritualized sense. The temple of God is now the body of the believer rather than a physical location.

Our modern churches would be more in line with the synagogue system not the Temple.

2Co 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

 

[John Toppass]

I'd rather rehash this than those 40-leven threads arguing over Calvinism.

I think you have it about right.

AMEN Bro. Tom

 

[dcorbett]

We don't call the act of coming to the front and kneeling to pray - or responding to the message an "altar call" - I used that term because it is a familiar one to most here.

Pastor always invites those who want to be saved (and he says that many different ways) to come to the front and a counselor (well schooled in soul winning) will take that person out of the auditorium and explain how to be saved. The actual act of walking down is a step of obedience. It is good to take a step of obedience, dont you think?

 

[Tom Butler]

Why is the "altar" down there where the preacher is? Why isn't it where I am, over on the 3rd row, organ side, near the end of the pew?

Why can't I pray there? Does God hear my prayer only if it's prayed down there?

Don't get me wrong. Numerous times, our pastor has called us to the front, to gather around someone to pray for them. But that's not for God's benefit. It's sort of like a group hug for the one for whom we are praying.

I've been around long enough to know when a preacher gets desperate to get a response, any response, to the invitation. I've seen congregations berated as cold and hardened when no one "walks the aisle."

Exhorting people to "come to the altar" and pray is too often just a way to get a "decision," any decision, so he can rack us some notches in his belt.

I know, that sounds cynical, but I've seen it happen.

Apparently, I'm not alone.

...lots of church members go down and pray at the altar, and this seems to make it easier when a lost person wants to
step out and confess before men, as the scripture tells us to.

Can you say, uh, manipulation?

 

[dcorbett]

Why is the "altar" down there where the preacher is? Why isn't it where I am, over on the 3rd row, organ side, near the end of the pew? Why can't I pray there? Does God hear my prayer only if it's prayed down there?

Yes, God hears your prayer where you are. Nobody said anything to the contrary.

I've been around long enough to know when a preacher gets desperate to get a response, any response, to the invitation. I've seen congregations berated as cold and hardened when no one "walks the aisle."

not cold and hardened, but most certainly not performing the commandment of the Great Commission if people aren't getting saved.

Can you say, uh, manipulation?

I wouldn't, because I have gone to kneel and pray up there many times when convicted by the message, feeling the Holy Spirit tugging at me. By going forward, I am making a statement that I am working on something spiritual. Of course, you can twist any situation to look bad. So twist away, and we will continue to worship and serve our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

 

[paul wassona]

God only helps the broken and contrite. Coming to the altar in front of everyone is an indication of not caring what people think but that they need to get out of where they're at in the present and come to God for help. Hopefully the pulpit is more sacred and holy than the pews and the altar a connecting point with Heaven!

 

[Tom Butler]

Can you say, uh, manipulation

I wouldn't, because I have gone to kneel and pray up there many times when convicted by the message, feeling the Holy Spirit tugging at me. By going forward, I am making a statement that I am working on something spiritual. Of course, you can twist any situation to look bad. So twist away, and we will continue to worship and serve our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Debbie, when the Holy Spirit moves you, move. No problem with that. It was this comment that intrigued me.

...lots of church members go down and pray at the altar, and this seems to make it easier when a lost person wants to
step out and confess before men, as the scripture tells us to.

I drew from that that the going down and praying was to be seen by lost people, and make it easier for them to go down.

But I was willing to concede that I might have mis-interpreted until you said

I am making a statement that I am working on something spiritual

To whom are you making that statement? If it's to God, no problem here. If it's to the others in the church who see you go down, then we have your saying twice that you went down so others could see you do it.

Actually, Debbie, I believe your motives are the highest. I read from your posts that you strongly desire to see people saved, whatever it takes is okay. I admire that zeal.

My point is that whatever it takes is not always okay. Simply test it against the scriptures and if it passes, go for it.

 

[preachinjesus]

John the baptist demanded meats worthy of repentence be fore he'd baptize. They would be brought to an altar and that wouldn't be a "rough" exegetical task.

Hmmm...John the Baptist demanded meats...I don't see that in Scripture...probably were kosher...

on a more pointed, and serious note, I checked the narratives. There is no altar in John the Baptist' ministry. When people came forward they walked down, into the water and then confessed their sins and were baptized. (Mark 1:4-6; Luke 3:10-14)

It is interesting to note that at the "invitation" time in John the Baptist's sermon in Luke 3:7-9 he doesn't call them forward but rather when the crowds ask: "What then shall we do?" (vs. 10) John the Baptist answered them "The one who has two shirts must share with someone who has none, and the one who has food must do the same." (vs. 11)

Now after they had done this John the Baptist would baptize them.

Your exegetical point is shakey at best.

 

[preachinjesus]

It is interesting that so many people will state emphatically that "I won't do this" or "I won't attend a church that doesn't do that" yet they fail to cite and engage Scripture as their basis.

Seems to me that if Scripture isn't your basis of theology and practice its just old dead legalism.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Hopefully the pulpit is more sacred and holy than the pews and the altar a connecting point with Heaven!

Do you have any Bible basis for a sacred holy pulpit as compared to the pews?

Do you have any Bible basis for an 'altar' being a connection point to heaven?