I think that however we interpret this passage, the important consideration is that the term cannot be rendered as gods, as the scripture hold to their being only 1 true God!
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Arrogance of changing Scripture
- Thread starter loDebar
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Elohyim does not only mean one true God but All spiritual beings residents of Heaven. God is the ultimate elohyim
It is a plurality of the heavenly Host, but there is still but 1 God, correct?
I don't either. And, I suspect, neither does he.
elohyim is used as gods 2260 times in the KJV, 5 times as rulers or judges.
It goes not mean Supreme Being GOD but a spiritual being as resident of Heaven, a angels, cherubim etc. and fallen angels
Yes, look at whom the questions are being referred
yes He did.
verse 7 of Psalms 82
Psa 82:7
But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
They are not divine but spiritual beings, more than a body.
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I don't either. And, I suspect, neither does he.
It is the errors and bias inherit in humanistic teaching that has become within Christianity. It is difficult when we have been taught our self importance
I never use the multi-quote feature. I simply highlight what I wish to quote, and then go up to the little "plus sign," and click on it, then click on "Quote."
I am a professor of ancient languages. My specialty is Greek, and my son teaches Hebrew. I took Hebrew long ago from a leading scholar in the field, but nowadays don't read it directly. However, as a linguist I am perfectly at home discussing the semantics of Hebrew, which is what we are doing on this thread.
Again, look at the context of Ps. 82. According to v. 3-4, God is talking to people on earth, not in Heaven.
"3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy. {Defend: Heb. Judge} 4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked." (KJV)
The only way to interpret elohim in v. 6 as "angels" or someone else in Heaven is to say that there are poor people in heaven that the angels need to take care of. Do you actually mean to say that?
Again, look at the context of the whole Psalm. It has to be people on earth being addressed, since there are no poor people in Heaven. Also, it has never been the job of angels to take care of the poor. You can't find that anywhere in the Bible.
Aramaic
34 Eshu {Yeshua} said unto them, “Isn't it thus written in your Namusa {Law} that “I have said that you are alahe {gods}.”
ܐܢ ܠܗܢܘܢ ܐܡܪ ܐܠܗܐ ܡܛܠ ܕܠܘܬܗܘܢ ܗܘܬ ܡܠܬܐ ܕܐܠܗܐ ܘܠܐ ܡܫܟܚ ܟܬܒܐ ܕܢܫܬܪܐ
35 If He called those ones "alahe" {“gods”}, on account that The Miltha d’Alaha {The Word of God} was with them, and The Kathaba {The Scripture} isn’t able that it might be broken,
34 Eshu {Yeshua} said unto them, “Isn't it thus written in your Namusa {Law} that “I have said that you are alahe {gods}.”
ܐܢ ܠܗܢܘܢ ܐܡܪ ܐܠܗܐ ܡܛܠ ܕܠܘܬܗܘܢ ܗܘܬ ܡܠܬܐ ܕܐܠܗܐ ܘܠܐ ܡܫܟܚ ܟܬܒܐ ܕܢܫܬܪܐ
35 If He called those ones "alahe" {“gods”}, on account that The Miltha d’Alaha {The Word of God} was with them, and The Kathaba {The Scripture} isn’t able that it might be broken,
I'm concluding as much, looking at the post he just put up answering you (supposedly) and accusing someone (Me? Not sure.) of humanistic teaching.I don't either. And, I suspect, neither does he.
What are some of those bias and errors within Christianity?
Thank you,I remember now
It is not money poor , it is powerless, weak,
look at verse 6 and compare it to Gen 1:2
now consider you too are elohyim, restored to God as a saved individual.
Jhn 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
The power is in our hands, or our decision
Col 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
2Co 5:18
And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us tohimself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation
It is not money poor , it is powerless, weak,
look at verse 6 and compare it to Gen 1:2
now consider you too are elohyim, restored to God as a saved individual.
Jhn 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
The power is in our hands, or our decision
Col 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
2Co 5:18
And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us tohimself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation
not you,, usI'm concluding as much, looking at the post he just put up answering you (supposedly) and accusing someone (Me? Not sure.) of humanistic teaching.
Apostle John that us becoming children of God was NOT due to our will, but due to the Will of God!
it can be summed up as over importance for the Human condition, no importance in the spiritual, It is inverted. We are spiritual beings assigned a human body , place and time, to hear the Gospel. We all agree we will continue to exist as spirits after death, I believe we existed before humanity as spirits. This bias is very entrenched, especially in translations or explanations of scripture.
As an example, TCassidy has commented on the disparity shown in Gen 1:1 that the original Hebrew scripture DOES NOT start with a mention of the creation of the universe or the earth but we all have been taught it does.. WHY? Because the spiritual sinful beings were here exiled here before man existed.. It becomes important when acceptance of elohyim is understood
the verse says it is our power, God set the plan or offered the pardon, It is in our power or decision to accept it... or not.
And those are still people on the earth that angels are not tasked with helping. And what about the rest of the passage: fatherless people, those who need justice, etc. Again, these are the things judges are tasked with, not angels.
I see absolutely no connection. What's your point?
It is absolutely false that a human person becomes elohim when they are saved. This is akin to the "manifest sons of god" heresy of the Latter Rain movement, the precurser of the modern Charismatic movement. This doctrine is extremely dangerous.
Are you a Charismatic Baptist, believing the "manifest sons of god" doctrine?
This is exactly the false doctrine of the "manifest sons of god" heresy of the Latter Rain movement: that we are "little gods" running around on earth doing exactly the same things Jesus could do. The Latter Rain heresy was so bad that they were kicked out of the classical Pentecostal groups.
"John 10:34-35, with Psalm 82:6. Those who embrace the 'little gods' doctrine almost universally cite these verses, wrested from their contexts" (Michael Horton, ed., The Agony of Deceit, p. 95).
All becomes clear. You are a Charismatic, aren't you? That's what this whole thread is about, right?
These verses are irrelevant to the discussion.
Absolutely not me. I am not humanist in any way, shape or form. Don't include me in your "us."
I want to add ....this is very diffi0cult...... to question all we have been taught.
We are obedient believers, we accept and defend what was taught to us in Church..
I have been taught more conservatively than most here,, I appreciate the knowledge I have encountered here, especially the Hebrew and Greek explanations. But I learned to not accept contradictions based on man's explanations of Scripture I can also read, some translation anyway. We cannot accept explanations that are against God's character,
Here is the most ignored verse(s)
Act 10:34
Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons
yet we all know God has not provided a way of Salvation for fallen angels, but the Bible does not say anything about this.
This cannot be true, or God is a respecter of persons.
How arrogant of a Human to call God a liar and man extra special.
atpollard
Well-Known Member
HUMANIST
noun
1. a person having a strong interest in or concern for human welfare, values, and dignity.
2. a person devoted to or versed in the humanities.
3. a student of human nature or affairs.
4. a classical scholar.
5. (sometimes initial capital letter) any one of the scholars of the Renaissance who pursued and disseminated the study and understanding of the cultures of ancient Rome and Greece, and emphasized secular, individualistic, and critical thought.
6. (sometimes initial capital letter) a person who follows a form of philosophical or scientific humanism.
1. a person having a strong interest in or concern for human welfare, values, and dignity.
2. a person devoted to or versed in the humanities.
3. a student of human nature or affairs.
4. a classical scholar.
5. (sometimes initial capital letter) any one of the scholars of the Renaissance who pursued and disseminated the study and understanding of the cultures of ancient Rome and Greece, and emphasized secular, individualistic, and critical thought.
6. (sometimes initial capital letter) a person who follows a form of philosophical or scientific humanism.
Not in "any way, shape or form"?
[just teasing]
As a Baptist, I've always been taught to question what I've been taught, since a Baptist distinctive is "The Bible as the sole rule of faith and practice."
You start out by accusing someone of arrogance. (I'm not sure who, but apparently whoever disagrees with you that we are little elohim, or gods.) I say the arrogance resides in any teacher of the Latter Rain/charismatic "little gods" doctrine. How arrogant to say we are "little gods" just like Jesus.
I ask again. Are you a Charismatic Baptist?
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