NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I can't see that. He rejected the virgin birth, the miracles of Christ, the resurrection, and all of Paul's writings. It is difficult for me to see an embracing of what the Bible taught.
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As an American and a Believer....
- Thread starter righteousdude2
- Start date
Sorry, I can't see that. He rejected the virgin birth, the miracles of Christ, the resurrection, and all of Paul's writings. It is difficult for me to see an embracing of what the Bible taught.
While I don't believe that the United States of America was/is a "Christian" nation in the strictest sense that all of its Founders were devout Bible believers and practicers, most of them at least tried to adhere to the principles that God set forth in the Ten Commandments and other applicable OT and NT passages.
Many of our nation's earliest settlers who came to our shores to exercise their God-given rights to worship Him as they saw fit to do.
Of course, this is not to say that everyone who wound up on what's now the USA came for purely religious/spiritual reasons.
There were other factors that played a role in drawing people to our country such as wanting to simply provide for a better way of life for themselves and their posterity.
Many of those that did come seeking refuge from religious oppression that was very evident in many of the areas of what was then called the "Old World" experienced varying degrees of religious persecution once they settled on our shores.
One of the principal reasons for this was because those who occupied positions of political and/or religious power here in America never seemed to divorce themselves from the unbiblical notion that the Government and the Church ought to be separate from each other.
Our history documents many cases of people who were severely persecuted by either the "Established" Puriitan Church in the New England colonies or by the "Established" Church of England ["Anglican'] in many of our Southern colonies.
A casual reading of our Baptist forefathers in the American colonial and subsequent eras will show the extent of persecutions they had to endure.
While many of our Presidents and Congressional leaders may have given lip service to the basic principals we find in God's Word, what they actually either did or enacted into legislation in many cases leads me to believe that much of their actions were not, by any means, ones that God Almighty would approve or even condone.
The same holds true even in our modern times.
Even the so-called "Idol" of right wing Bible-believers, President Ronald Reagan, did very little to stop such things as abortion or the increasing extent of our federal government interfering with matters such as imposing questionable "National Standards" on our public (I prefer to call them "Government Controlled Brainwashing Institutions") schools.
The Department of Education has no business setting forth mandates with which our Government-Controlled Schools must comply!
There are other very important issues that we face today that also need to be confronted by our do-nothing Congress in Washington and most of our statehouses that I don't see very many of our elected officials being willing to tackle such as the growth of government spending (much of it on rather useless or otherwise ill-advised boondoggles) and that of a sane approach to the problems that the ever-growing menace of illegal immigration of "undocumented aliens" within our nation's borders.
Merely "throwing money" at such problems as these has done nothing to actually solve any of them.
Will we ever rise up as a society and seek to resolve these issues?
If current trends are any indication, I, for one, do not see this happening.
I sincerely hope that my pessimistic assessment of our nation's future will prove to be wrong.
But, alas, I seriously doubt it.
(....Sigh!.... :tear
Many of our nation's earliest settlers who came to our shores to exercise their God-given rights to worship Him as they saw fit to do.
Of course, this is not to say that everyone who wound up on what's now the USA came for purely religious/spiritual reasons.
There were other factors that played a role in drawing people to our country such as wanting to simply provide for a better way of life for themselves and their posterity.
Many of those that did come seeking refuge from religious oppression that was very evident in many of the areas of what was then called the "Old World" experienced varying degrees of religious persecution once they settled on our shores.
One of the principal reasons for this was because those who occupied positions of political and/or religious power here in America never seemed to divorce themselves from the unbiblical notion that the Government and the Church ought to be separate from each other.
Our history documents many cases of people who were severely persecuted by either the "Established" Puriitan Church in the New England colonies or by the "Established" Church of England ["Anglican'] in many of our Southern colonies.
A casual reading of our Baptist forefathers in the American colonial and subsequent eras will show the extent of persecutions they had to endure.
While many of our Presidents and Congressional leaders may have given lip service to the basic principals we find in God's Word, what they actually either did or enacted into legislation in many cases leads me to believe that much of their actions were not, by any means, ones that God Almighty would approve or even condone.
The same holds true even in our modern times.
Even the so-called "Idol" of right wing Bible-believers, President Ronald Reagan, did very little to stop such things as abortion or the increasing extent of our federal government interfering with matters such as imposing questionable "National Standards" on our public (I prefer to call them "Government Controlled Brainwashing Institutions") schools.
The Department of Education has no business setting forth mandates with which our Government-Controlled Schools must comply!
There are other very important issues that we face today that also need to be confronted by our do-nothing Congress in Washington and most of our statehouses that I don't see very many of our elected officials being willing to tackle such as the growth of government spending (much of it on rather useless or otherwise ill-advised boondoggles) and that of a sane approach to the problems that the ever-growing menace of illegal immigration of "undocumented aliens" within our nation's borders.
Merely "throwing money" at such problems as these has done nothing to actually solve any of them.
Will we ever rise up as a society and seek to resolve these issues?
If current trends are any indication, I, for one, do not see this happening.
I sincerely hope that my pessimistic assessment of our nation's future will prove to be wrong.
But, alas, I seriously doubt it.
(....Sigh!.... :tear
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NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Excellent and well thought out post, the whole thing that is, not just the section I quoted.
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Where is that 'Like' button?
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
While I don't know the hearts of these men I do agree with the thought here. That is why, IMNSHO, this kind of video is misguided at best.
Actions speak a lot louder than symbols, and it has been a long, long, long time since the United States has acted like a nation based on Christian principles. I am still a young guy, not even 60 yet, but I don't think I have ever seen the United States as a nation act Christian.
I know I am not the student of history that some here are, but I am hard pressed to come up with more than a handful of presidents that could be considered devout, sold out, Spirit controlled believers.
Were all of the founders Chrsitian as the bible defines it, No, but almost ALl were believers in a real and living God, so while not all saved, about all of them would have had a culture and society that MUCH more aligned itself with the teachings and standatds of the bible than this current one does!
Can you imagine the bible in schoolrooms, children being taught the princples of marality from there, and praying in schools, and where there was Chrsitianity proper on display, and ACLU not protesting EVERY thing 'religious"?
thisnumbersdisconnected
New Member
Those memorials are not to recent presidents, either. That's the point of the video. The honor is given to the founders, not to those who came after, Lincoln being the only exception. We were founded by Christian men. The Mall serves to remind us of that. Since Lincoln, very little of Christianity has been exhibited in Washington, and Lincoln, in my opinion, while expressing Christian principles, utterly failed in living up to them.
salzer mtn
Well-Known Member
I wonder if Sally Hemings a black save and her children by Thomas Jefferson thought Thomas was a Christian.
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Christian men? Washington, very possibly. Jefferson, surely not. Now, if there were a Madison monument I might see the significance of the mall.
I am grateful for the Constitution. It recognised that sinful man needed laws and that sinful leaders needed checks and balances.
I am not so sure that God is honoured by statues or monuments to any man. The mall us also replete with symbols to pagan Greek and Roman gods.
You know, there are some people who rarely post anymore. Except when the subject of the biblical founding of this country comes up. Then they show up to try to prove otherwise. Sad
Well said....
..... I can't disagree with my brothers. Having Christian symbols on monuments is a long way from making this a Christian nation.
And what we are witnessing in DC today is something so far from be Christ-like, it would make the true believer sick!
Still, what is not being considered by the likes of CTB and C4K is that at the time, the majority of the men building this nation and leading it to its freedom from British oppression, HAD A HEART FOR GOD. Maybe not the same way that we'd say qualifies them today as being a believer, but still, they seemed to love God and wanted a nation founded on Godly principles.
Personally, I am not saying that our founders were evangelical Christians, or even Bible thumping Baptists. However, they loved the Bible and its teachings and principles enough to build the Constitution around the very words of the Word we call Gods. And I, quite frankly, am glad they did. It would have been a different America had our founders been holding to Catholicism, or Islam, or Buhda.
The basics of our laws were built around the principles of the Bible, and for that I thank God, because in HIS way, He had a to do with influencing our founders when they fought the British and led this nation forward from its birth!
To those who don't love America, go ahead and say what you want. However, the truth is there; we have what we have today, because God did have more than a subtle influence on how America would move forward.
Unfortunately, like most denominations today. What started out one way, has been influenced by the sins of man, cultures and society itself, and we have a trainwreck of a nation, a nation of the brink of collapse, but can't that be said about most denominations today, because over the last 200+ years, there's been a lot of shady dealings with the devil, and we are witnessing the final product of a nation or church that has gotten away from, like Revelations 2:4 (NLT) says, "But I have this complaint against you. You don't love me or each other as you did at first!"
That basically sums up what has happened to this country, as much as what's happened with all those once well meaning denominations, that are now fighting and slandering each other because one is Calvinist and the other Armenian!
What a shame. Because as some of you have implied, it takes more than a "cross on the door" to make something a Christian!
Just like America has some real soul searching' to do if she is going to turn this mess around ... so do a lot of you who call yourself believers, but only if they believe EXACTLY as you!
I have to wonder why God hasn't come back yet and ended all this insanity? When I posted this video, it made me proud to be both an America and a believer. Even so, most of you have thrown a dark, wet blanket over that pride, and tore the sense of love I had within when I viewed this video.
Truly we are a sad bunch of sacks. I only hope there is time to save us from impending judgement. I believe Revleation 2:3-5 is a word for us as well as the church n Ephesus. The question is, will we spend the time arguing over how we think this should read or be applied, or take it for what it is" A Word of judgement, and our last chance to turn around??? :tear:
..... I can't disagree with my brothers. Having Christian symbols on monuments is a long way from making this a Christian nation.
And what we are witnessing in DC today is something so far from be Christ-like, it would make the true believer sick!
Still, what is not being considered by the likes of CTB and C4K is that at the time, the majority of the men building this nation and leading it to its freedom from British oppression, HAD A HEART FOR GOD. Maybe not the same way that we'd say qualifies them today as being a believer, but still, they seemed to love God and wanted a nation founded on Godly principles.
Personally, I am not saying that our founders were evangelical Christians, or even Bible thumping Baptists. However, they loved the Bible and its teachings and principles enough to build the Constitution around the very words of the Word we call Gods. And I, quite frankly, am glad they did. It would have been a different America had our founders been holding to Catholicism, or Islam, or Buhda.
The basics of our laws were built around the principles of the Bible, and for that I thank God, because in HIS way, He had a to do with influencing our founders when they fought the British and led this nation forward from its birth!
To those who don't love America, go ahead and say what you want. However, the truth is there; we have what we have today, because God did have more than a subtle influence on how America would move forward.
Unfortunately, like most denominations today. What started out one way, has been influenced by the sins of man, cultures and society itself, and we have a trainwreck of a nation, a nation of the brink of collapse, but can't that be said about most denominations today, because over the last 200+ years, there's been a lot of shady dealings with the devil, and we are witnessing the final product of a nation or church that has gotten away from, like Revelations 2:4 (NLT) says, "But I have this complaint against you. You don't love me or each other as you did at first!"
That basically sums up what has happened to this country, as much as what's happened with all those once well meaning denominations, that are now fighting and slandering each other because one is Calvinist and the other Armenian!
What a shame. Because as some of you have implied, it takes more than a "cross on the door" to make something a Christian!
Just like America has some real soul searching' to do if she is going to turn this mess around ... so do a lot of you who call yourself believers, but only if they believe EXACTLY as you!
I have to wonder why God hasn't come back yet and ended all this insanity? When I posted this video, it made me proud to be both an America and a believer. Even so, most of you have thrown a dark, wet blanket over that pride, and tore the sense of love I had within when I viewed this video.
Truly we are a sad bunch of sacks. I only hope there is time to save us from impending judgement. I believe Revleation 2:3-5 is a word for us as well as the church n Ephesus. The question is, will we spend the time arguing over how we think this should read or be applied, or take it for what it is" A Word of judgement, and our last chance to turn around??? :tear:
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
You ask, 'what say you?' but you only want those who agree with you?
My love for America comes not because somebody walked a cross pattern on the national mall, or a bunch of man made statues and monuments, but because of her Constitution, the freedoms we all enjoy, her incredible diversity, and because of her ability to endure even the most difficult of times. Hey, I even have enough faith to believe that we will survive President Obama without an impeachment or armed rebellion.
But she is not perfect. We cannot Christianise a secular land based on misty eyed emotions. Sure, no one can doubt that she was founded on western Judeo/Christian principles, but she is not 'God's chosen people' or a 'city set on a hill.' She is a nation founded by and inhabited by sinners. Everything was not rosy in the garden when America was founded. Only white, land owning men could vote for example. Everyone else was less than a citizen. Do we want to go back to that, or just those things that bring a tear to our eyes?
There is a near adoration for President Jefferson in many Christian circles. However, how would those same people today respond to man who wanted to be president who said 'I like a lot about what the Bible says, but I reject that Christ was God, I reject His miracles and resurrection, and I reject all Paul's writings?'
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Soooooooorry.....
Didn't mean to crush you or question your love for America, but, hey, C4K, you are quite negative when it comes to this country! You remind me of my friends that attended one of those liberal universities, like UCLA, Harvard, Penn State, UC Berkley! :smilewinkgrin:
Those are the largest socialist producing universities in this country! :smilewinkgrin:
I know you love America, but I think you've been in Europe a wee bit too long :laugh: and let me be the first to tip my hat and wish you a happy saint pattys day!
Didn't mean to crush you or question your love for America, but, hey, C4K, you are quite negative when it comes to this country! You remind me of my friends that attended one of those liberal universities, like UCLA, Harvard, Penn State, UC Berkley! :smilewinkgrin:
Those are the largest socialist producing universities in this country! :smilewinkgrin:
I know you love America, but I think you've been in Europe a wee bit too long :laugh: and let me be the first to tip my hat and wish you a happy saint pattys day!
Yep..........................
NaasPreacher (C4K)
Well-Known Member
Negative? I'm the guy who has enough confidence in America to believe she will survive even President Obama and will have a peaceful transfer of power in 2017.
And thanks for the greetings! Don't like to pick nits, but I am here long enough I have to correct a common American error, Happy St Paddy's
Day to you as well.You know you have to wonder about those who show up to post only on specific issues. What is a growing common error is the downplaying of the true founding of this country. Shame on everyone who acts in such a way.
Doing that spits on the graves of those who have fought and died to protect the founding of this country.
Doing that spits on the graves of those who have fought and died to protect the founding of this country.
We have a constitution still worth defending to the death. Curious: so do those who are still fighting the Civil War.
We are still reaping what we sowed in terms of slavery and manifest destiny--and abortion. More than half of those who vote think abortion is a freedom of choice. Strange: this is the law of the land.
That God has allowed these things to continue is a testimony to His Grace and Longsuffering.
When all the urban legend is sorted, (not likely), "Let God be found True, and every man lying".
We just do not seem to understand the power of the god of this world and the total depravity of Man.
We do err in the understanding of the founders of religion and government.
John 14:6 is still in effect--forever.
Praise The Lord for His longsuffering.
Even so, come, Lord Jesus.
Bro. James
We are still reaping what we sowed in terms of slavery and manifest destiny--and abortion. More than half of those who vote think abortion is a freedom of choice. Strange: this is the law of the land.
That God has allowed these things to continue is a testimony to His Grace and Longsuffering.
When all the urban legend is sorted, (not likely), "Let God be found True, and every man lying".
We just do not seem to understand the power of the god of this world and the total depravity of Man.
We do err in the understanding of the founders of religion and government.
John 14:6 is still in effect--forever.
Praise The Lord for His longsuffering.
Even so, come, Lord Jesus.
Bro. James
Would it surprise you if you would meet some Calvinistic Armenians? Please,get it right. You're not the only one RD,but it is disconcerting when someone mixes up a nationality with a person's theology.
And the correct spelling for another word you messed up is:Buddha.