Believing Into Christ based on God crediting your faith as righteousness

[kyredneck]

Here is the deal folks.

Lol…surely you’re not trying to steal Van’s audience!

 

[Silverhair]

Lol…surely you’re not trying to steal Van’s audience!

Liked that did ya.

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

You claim to be citing scripture. Which version is this?

This version is The King James in 1 John 4:3;

"And every spirit which does not confess Jesus is not of God; and this is the spirit of the antichrist,
of which you have heard that it is coming and now is already in the world."

"Believing Into Christ based on God crediting your faith as righteousness,"​

is a false statement IMPLYING salvation as being initiated by the lost sinner and not The Savior, JESUS CHRIST.

This is a sentence fabricated with the sin-cursed reasoning in a mind that is under the curse of the Law. ​

And, it is Antichrist.​

​

I do not know of any evidence that there is writing anywhere in the history of mankind where a statement exists that is similar to this
and I do not believe any evidence exists that this sentence can be found anywhere on earth, except in Van's head. Period.

 

[Silverhair]

This version is The King James in 1 John 4:3;

"And every spirit which does not confess Jesus is not of God; and this is the spirit of the antichrist,
of which you have heard that it is coming and now is already in the world."

"Believing Into Christ based on God crediting your faith as righteousness,"​

is a false statement IMPLYING salvation as being initiated by the lost sinner and not The Savior, JESUS CHRIST.

This is a sentence fabricated with the sin-cursed reasoning in a mind that is under the curse of the Law. ​

And, it is Antichrist.​

​

I do not know of any evidence that there is writing anywhere in the history of mankind where a statement exists that is similar to this
and I do not believe any evidence exists that this sentence can be found anywhere on earth, except in Van's head. Period.

Do you not have these verses in your bible?

Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

Act 16:30 He then brought them out and asked, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Act 16:31 They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved--you and your household."

Rom 10:9 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

We do, cannot save ourselves but God has set the condition of our salvation, faith in His son.

You are in error when you say that view is from the ANTICHRIST. You are actually denying clear scripture.

As we are told by Paul
Rom 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.

 

[David Lamb]

You have been unmasked Sir, everyone knows you chose not to answer.

No unmasking was needed. I openly stated my reason for posting what I did. It was to question your accusation of being off-topic. If I had claimed to be answering a question from you, and then failed to address that question, that would be a different matter, but I made no such claim, and did not intend to answer a question from you. I hope that is clearer.

 

[kyredneck]

Believing Into Christ based on God crediting your faith as righteousness,"​

is a false statement IMPLYING salvation as being initiated by the lost sinner and not The Savior, JESUS CHRIST.

Agree. 100%.

 

[Ben1445]

Why so secretive Van? Which version?

You’ve got to love how he always quotes Al Gore.

“From the internet:”
"To believe Him is to believe that He is true and real, but to believe into Him is to receive Him and be united with Him as one. The former is to acknowledge a fact objectively; the latter is to receive a life subjectively."

It is very hard to take these quotes seriously.

 

[Ben1445]

Off topic, unless you are so ignorant you did not know John repeatedly uses "believers into Him" in his gospel. Are we to suppose you do not know how to goggle, or use a Reverse Interlinear, or a Lexicon?

Lets see if you have a shred of integrity, how does a lost person, separated from God due to his or her unholiness go from being in the realm of darkness to being "in Christ." Romans 3:24, Romans 16:7, 1 Corinthians 15:22

The answer of course is that they believed into Him, which refers to God's action of transferring them into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness.

Since it seems to be irrelevant to you which version you use, why do you make such a big deal about the words. You want everyone to listen to you but you hide your sources as if they couldn’t stand up to scrutiny.
No good teacher tells anyone to figure out what is the textbook and get it on your own. If you want to teach something, you will need to do it openly and honestly.

 

[Ben1445]

is a false statement IMPLYING salvation as being initiated by the lost sinner and not The Savior, JESUS CHRIST.

There is too much going on in this thread, but the way you state this is as if you think that someone is implying that they are thinking the Saviour into existence. Jesus came into the world to save sinners. What more initiation do you require?

 

[Van]

Van do you forget what you have posted?

From your OP post
“The one who believes into Him is not judged;

Your the one that keeps claiming "εἰς" has to be translated as "into" and you have been shown a number of bible translations that do not do so. You have also been shown that "εἰς" can be translated as "in".

So this is not off topic.

It would seem that you do not like having someone disagree with your ideas and show you your errors.

More false claims from someone who knows the truth.

1) Deflection by asking an irrelevant question, did you forget....
2) Did I ever claim eis has to be translated as into? No, of course not. Such a obvious falsehood. What did I claim? See post #4. I claimed I was citing a version of scripture that translates "eis" as into.
3) The idiotic claim I do not know of the many ways "eis" is translated is again an effort to deflect.
4) Addressing my claimed poor behavior rather than the topic is off topic.
5) Of course I like people who post disagreements with my views and show me where I am mistaken in my view.

But

The false claims about my attitudes are a waste of time, and hinder discussion of biblical doctrine.

The one who believes into Him, who is positionally sanctified within Christ, is not judged, is a true statement.

 

[Van]

No unmasking was needed. I openly stated my reason for posting what I did. It was to question your accusation of being off-topic. If I had claimed to be answering a question from you, and then failed to address that question, that would be a different matter, but I made no such claim, and did not intend to answer a question from you. I hope that is clearer.

Those who ask questions but do not intend to answer them are unmasked as lacking integrity.

Would it not be easier for everybody just to name the translation you mean?​

​

 

[Silverhair]

More false claims from someone who knows the truth.

1) Deflection by asking an irrelevant question, did you forget....
2) Did I ever claim eis has to be translated as into? No, of course not. Such a obvious falsehood. What did I claim? See post #4. I claimed I was citing a version of scripture that translates "eis" as into.
3) The idiotic claim I do not know of the many ways "eis" is translated is again an effort to deflect.
4) Addressing my claimed poor behavior rather than the topic is off topic.
5) Of course I like people who post disagreements with my views and show me where I am mistaken in my view.

But

The false claims about my attitudes are a waste of time, and hinder discussion of biblical doctrine.

The one who believes into Him, who is positionally sanctified within Christ, is not judged, is a true statement.

You are the one that keeps posting the same thing over and over Van.

We believe "in" Christ Jesus and God places us "into" Christ Jesus.

Since you want to read "eis" as into then do so but it does not have to be translated as such does it?

The one who believes in Him, who is positionally sanctified within Christ, is not judged, is a true statement.

 

[Van]

Since it seems to be irrelevant to you which version you use, why do you make such a big deal about the words. You want everyone to listen to you but you hide your sources as if they couldn’t stand up to scrutiny.
No good teacher tells anyone to figure out what is the textbook and get it on your own. If you want to teach something, you will need to do it openly and honestly.

More false claims!

1) Is it irrelevant to Van which version you use? This claim has no support, as I have posted which versions I think best provide insight into the actual gospel. NASB ring a bell?

2) I make a big deal of correctly translating the OT text and NT text into English.

3) I do not hide my sources. See post #26

4) Good teachers remove those whose intent is to disrupt actual discussion of biblical doctrine.

5) Have you supported the biblical doctrine of Positional Sanctification, that God alone transfers individuals into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness?

 

[Van]

You are the one that keeps posting the same thing over and over Van.

We believe "in" Christ Jesus and God places us "into" Christ Jesus.

Since you want to read "eis" as into then do so but it does not have to be translated as such does it?

The one who believes in Him, who is positionally sanctified within Christ, is not judged, is a true statement.

Good grief! The issue is what was the intended meaning, to believe things about Christ, or to believe such that God transfers the individual into Christ?

To believe in someone, is the action of the believer, but to believe into someone refers to action by the believer AND God!

Lets consider your statement,

​

The one who believes in Him, who is positionally sanctified within Christ, is not judged, is a true statement. ​

Not everyone who believes things about Christ is positionally sanctified! Recall Matthew 7 and those who said Lord, Lord, or those of Matthew 13 who believed but fell away.

I wonder if you deny it is God alone who decides whether a person's belief should be credited as righteousness, and on that basis to transfer the individual into Christ, or whether you believe if a person puts their faith in Christ, they are automatically saved?