Calvinism, God's Mercy

[Steadfast Fred]

They weren't Jews. They were the elect of God, that is Christians from various backgrounds. Many of them may have had a Jewish background; some not. But that would not matter. Once converted to Christ, they are no more Jew. They are in Christ.

When a Muslim turns to Christ, he is no more a Muslim. He gives it up. He is now a Christian. So it is with a Jew. He leaves his Judaism and becomes a Christian. That is what the Apostle Paul did. That is what Peter and John did. They became Christians. They were no longer Jews. The epistles, all of them, were written to the elect, Christians.

Paul recognized Peter as being a Jew in Galatians 2.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Brother, what would be the point in going out of my way to seperate Jew and Gentile when Paul declares they are one? So I can tell Calvinist they cannot be elect? What would believing in this do for my walk with CHrist?

There is no separation between Jew and Gentile as far as "in Christ" is concerned.

But it is evident that it was the Jews who were the elect, the chosen of God. The article lays out all that deal with the term "elect"

Read it before you judge me to be wrong.

 

[steaver]

There is no separation between Jew and Gentile as far as "in Christ" is concerned.

But it is evident that it was the Jews who were the elect, the chosen of God. The article lays out all that deal with the term "elect"

Read it before you judge me to be wrong.

You didn't answer my questions....

Brother, what would be the point in going out of my way to seperate Jew and Gentile when Paul declares they are one? So I can tell Calvinist they cannot be elect? What would believing in this do for my walk with CHrist?

 

[DHK]

Paul recognized Peter as being a Jew in Galatians 2.

Paul sternly rebuked Peter as siding with the Jewish "Judaizers", those who said circumcision and keeping the law should be required for salvation. These things had already been settled in Acts 15, and not only that, Peter knew better for the Lord had clearly taught him in a vision in Acts 10. Peter was being hypocritical. He was not mixing with the Gentile Christians but avoiding them, and Paul sternly rebuked him: "withstood him to the face."

That is not a recognition of being a Jew. It is a rebuke.

 

[steaver]

The epistles are written to all Christians. If I am to believe that the elect Paul and Peter speak of are only the Jews then I would have to ignore all they have written.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

As I said, once one comes to Christ, there is no difference.

The point is, the Jews are the elect where man is concerned. Not elect to Salvation, but chosen for a specific service for God.

After Salvation, all are to do something for the Lord, but that is not election.

 

[steaver]

As I said, once one comes to Christ, there is no difference.

The point is, the Jews are the elect where man is concerned. Not elect to Salvation, but chosen for a specific service for God.

After Salvation, all are to do something for the Lord, but that is not election.

What would believing in this do for my walk with CHrist?

 

[Steadfast Fred]

What would not believing it do?

Are we not to walk in truth? I cannot in good conscience call myself elect since Scripture does not.

 

[DHK]

There is no separation between Jew and Gentile as far as "in Christ" is concerned.

But it is evident that it was the Jews who were the elect, the chosen of God. The article lays out all that deal with the term "elect"

The elect are no more the chosen of God. Even Paul recognized that.
Here Paul lays it out very simply:

1 Corinthians 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

1. The Jews. They are unsaved. They have a false religion. They are obligated to come to Christ just the same way that we are today, and that any other pagan must come to Christ--by faith alone in the shed blood of Christ. That is the only way.

2. The Gentile. Everyone else. We all must come to Christ by grace through faith and not of works, trusting in his shed blood as the payment of our sins. It is the only way: for the Jews and for us, the Gentiles.

3. The church of God: the saved, the elect of God. Those who have come to Christ and put their trust in him.

These are the three groups of people identified in the NT for today.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

The elect are no more the chosen of God. Even Paul recognized that.
Here Paul lays it out very simply:

1 Corinthians 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

1. The Jews. They are unsaved. They have a false religion. They are obligated to come to Christ just the same way that we are today, and that any other pagan must come to Christ--by faith alone in the shed blood of Christ. That is the only way.

2. The Gentile. Everyone else. We all must come to Christ by grace through faith and not of works, trusting in his shed blood as the payment of our sins. It is the only way: for the Jews and for us, the Gentiles.

3. The church of God: the saved, the elect of God. Those who have come to Christ and put their trust in him.

These are the three groups of people identified in the NT for today.

I see. So Paul was calling Peter unsaved when he called him a Jew.

 

[DHK]

I see. So Paul was calling Peter unsaved when he called him a Jew.

He rebuked him. He was calling him disobedient.

 

[webdog]

The epistles are written to all Christians. If I am to believe that the elect Paul and Peter speak of are only the Jews then I would have to ignore all they have written.

This is false. While 2 Timothy 3:16 is true, each book in the Bible was written to a specific audience for a specific purpose. This is the entire purpose of hermeunetics. It is all Gods Word that believers use and learn from, but to state the audience for each book are all believers is false.

 

[DHK]

This is false. While 2 Timothy 3:16 is true, each book in the Bible was written to a specific audience for a specific purpose. This is the entire purpose of hermeunetics. It is all Gods Word that believers use and learn from, but to state the audience for each book are all believers is false.

Is there a book written to unbelievers Webdog?

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Does this verse help?:saint:
Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

 

[DHK]

I see. So Paul was calling Peter unsaved when he called him a Jew.

Look at the context more carefully:

Galatians 2:15-16 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

--Paul includes himself while addressing Peter, and says "we who are Jews by nature." He simply means that they were born into the Jewish nation. They are Israelites and there is nothing that they can do to change their genetic make-up. Their heritage, in this case, did not dictate their Christian religion.

Thus Paul continues his rebuke in verse 16:
A man is not justified by the works of the law but by the faith of the Jesus Christ.
--The Judaizers were demanding that Christians keep the law. Peter got caught up in this hypocrisy and false teaching by siding with them.
--These false teachers, though Jews, are not the elect of God.

 

[webdog]

Is there a book written to unbelievers Webdog?

This is a non sequitur as I never even implied this. Repread my post.

I will say this, though...who was the book of Luke and Acts addressed to?

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Look at the context more carefully:

Galatians 2:15-16 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

--Paul includes himself while addressing Peter, and says "we who are Jews by nature." He simply means that they were born into the Jewish nation. They are Israelites and there is nothing that they can do to change their genetic make-up. Their heritage, in this case, did not dictate their Christian religion.

Thus Paul continues his rebuke in verse 16:
A man is not justified by the works of the law but by the faith of the Jesus Christ.
--The Judaizers were demanding that Christians keep the law. Peter got caught up in this hypocrisy and false teaching by siding with them.
--These false teachers, though Jews, are not the elect of God.

And context concerning election shows it is the Jewish nation that is elect, angels, and Jesus Christ. Gentiles are never said to be elect in the Word of God.

 

[DHK]

This is a non sequitur as I never even implied this. Repread my post.

I will say this, though...who was the book of Luke and Acts addressed to?

You need to re-read Steaver's post. Here is what you declared to be false:

The epistles are written to all Christians. If I am to believe that the elect Paul and Peter speak of are only the Jews then I would have to ignore all they have written.

Let it be noted that all the epistles of Paul were written either to churches or to pastors of churches. The general epistles also were written to Christians. There is not an epistle that was written that was written to a non-Christian.

 

[DHK]

And context concerning election shows it is the Jewish nation that is elect, angels, and Jesus Christ. Gentiles are never said to be elect in the Word of God.

You have been proven wrong on this many times. Why do you keep saying this.

1 Peter 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
--These are not Jews. They are Christians. Their background doesn't matter.
There is no way you can prove that those he is writing to are 100% Jewish background, even if that is your belief. You can't do it. They are believers in Christ, as addressed.

Romans 8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
--Paul was writing to the Gentile Christians at Rome.

Colossians 3:12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
--The Gentile Christians at Colosse.

2 Timothy 2:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.
--Timothy was the pastor of the church at Ephesus, a city in Asia Minor, known for its idolatry and paganism.
--The elect's sake--he is referring to the saved Gentiles in that church.

Titus 1:1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;
--Titus was the Pastor at Crete, another pagan nation. God's elect refers to the Gentile Christians which had been saved under his ministry.

2 John 1:1 The elder unto the elect lady and her children, whom I love in the truth; and not I only, but also all they that have known the truth;
--We know little about the "lady" spoken of. There is no evidence that she is a Jew.

Your assertion is wrong. Many Gentiles are called elect.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Sorry DHK, but I am not convinced.

I find no evidence that any of those verses referencing Gentiles as being the elect of God.