Can a believer sin?

[DHK]

Luke 17:

20: And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
21: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
22: And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.
23: And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.
24: For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.
25: But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation.

You hang your hat on one or two Scriptures in the Bible ignoring all others, even all others that speak about the kingdom. You ignored the passages I gave you in Isaiah and Zechariah, especially the ones in Isaiah where the literal Kingdom is so specifically described it cannot be ignored.
But even in your own Luke passage you ignore verse 24:

24: For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.

When did this event happen? Who witnessed it? When did the Son of Man as lightning comes out of heaven, giving the indication of suddeness, quickly, brightness, in the glory of His Father with the Holy angels, as it also says here:

Mark 8:38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

and here:
2 Thessalonians 1:7-8 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Exactly when did this event happen? Who can verify it? Who saw it happen? It is not recorded as a past event in the Scriptures Bob.

 

[Brother Bob]

jne; Are you talking about me using history? If so, Give an example of me using it to back up a doctrinal stand. I never said it is wrong to study history. I said it is wrong to use what you find as a back up for ANY doctrine. Who cares if it is not found in history? If the Bible teaches something. Believe it.

No, wasn't talking about you. I tried to answer your questions and it seemed you were not aware that others on here was using history also.

 

[Brother Bob]

24: For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.

The second coming of Christ to get His believers and pass judgement upon the world.

Mark 8:38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

and here:
2 Thessalonians 1:7-8 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

same, second coming. No where in there is mentioned a thousand years. As a matter of fact, confirms my post of him passing judgement upon the world.

You say, I hang my belief on a couple of scripture.
Those scripture is by Jesus Himself and you ignore them as if they are not there and place all your belief on a literal thousand year reign. What purpose is this thousand year reign anyway? What does it serve?

Jesus must of known that you and others would be making this claim of a literal thousand year kingdom, so He knocked the wheels out from under you while He was here.

 

[James_Newman]

The second coming of Christ to get His believers and pass judgement upon the world.

same, second coming. No where in there is mentioned a thousand years. As a matter of fact, confirms my post of him passing judgement upon the world.

You say, I hang my belief on a couple of scripture.
Those scripture is by Jesus Himself and you ignore them as if they are not there and place all your belief on a literal thousand year reign. What purpose is this thousand year reign anyway? What does it serve?

Jesus must of known that you and others would be making this claim of a literal thousand year kingdom, so He knocked the wheels out from under you while He was here.

The thousand year reign is a time of reward for faithful servants.

 

[jne1611]

No, wasn't talking about you. I tried to answer your questions and it seemed you were not aware that others on here was using history also.

OK. No problem. I'll leave you to the ML debate. Talk to you later Lord Willing.

 

[Brother Bob]

The thousand year reign is a time of reward for faithful servants.

Have you ever wondered why Jesus never spoke of it. Also, I thought our reward was eternal life, are some going to get two eternal lifes? But what do I know.

 

[DHK]

The second coming of Christ to get His believers and pass judgement upon the world.

same, second coming. No where in there is mentioned a thousand years. As a matter of fact, confirms my post of him passing judgement upon the world.

You say, I hang my belief on a couple of scripture.
Those scripture is by Jesus Himself and you ignore them as if they are not there and place all your belief on a literal thousand year reign. What purpose is this thousand year reign anyway? What does it serve?

Jesus must of known that you and others would be making this claim of a literal thousand year kingdom, so He knocked the wheels out from under you while He was here.

It is the fulfillment of Scriptural prophecy--both OT and NT--both of which you ignore.
You ignore the fact that all the Jews were expecting Christ to set up His kingdom at that time. One of the reasons they rejected him was because he didn't. He wasn't who they were expecting. They were expecting a King, a Messiah, not a suffering "Messiah."
You ignore all the times in Scripture that the exact word "thousand" is used. You allegorize it. If that is done you may as well as allegorize the entire gospel message. Why not make the entire Bible read as a myth?
If you want the purpose take it to the Lord. It is His plan; His program. He set up the sequence of the events in history.
It will demonstrate that even after a thousand years after perfect bliss and harmony, rule by Christ himself, that there will be enough unsaved on the earth for Satan to gather an army to mount one final attack against Christ.
There are many other reasons. If a curse was put on the earth because of the action of the first Adam; it will be removed by the Second Adam.
You simply need to study the Scriptures and see what it has to say about a literal kingdom. It is all there. It is God's plan. He set it up. The Jews were expecting it. Nicodemus was expecting it. Peter and James was expecting it.

Matthew 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

They were wondering when he would set up his kingdom, and thus Jesus launched into the Olivet Discourse in Mat. 24 and 25.

Luke 19:11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear.

They thought that the kingdom should immediately appear, but Jesus taught the opposite.

 

[James_Newman]

Have you ever wondered why Jesus never spoke of it. Also, I thought our reward was eternal life, are some going to get two eternal lifes? But what do I know.

No, your free gift is eternal life, why don't you stop trying to earn it.

What do you suppose Jesus was talking about here?
Revelation 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

 

[Brother Bob]

It is the fulfillment of Scriptural prophecy--both OT and NT--both of which you ignore.
You ignore the fact that all the Jews were expecting Christ to set up His kingdom at that time. One of the reasons they rejected him was because he didn't. He wasn't who they were expecting. They were expecting a King, a Messiah, not a suffering "Messiah."
You ignore all the times in Scripture that the exact word "thousand" is used. You allegorize it. If that is done you may as well as allegorize the entire gospel message. Why not make the entire Bible read as a myth?
If you want the purpose take it to the Lord. It is His plan; His program. He set up the sequence of the events in history.
It will demonstrate that even after a thousand years after perfect bliss and harmony, rule by Christ himself, that there will be enough unsaved on the earth for Satan to gather an army to mount one final attack against Christ.
There are many other reasons. If a curse was put on the earth because of the action of the first Adam; it will be removed by the Second Adam.
You simply need to study the Scriptures and see what it has to say about a literal kingdom. It is all there. It is God's plan. He set it up. The Jews were expecting it. Nicodemus was expecting it. Peter and James was expecting it.

Matthew 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

They were wondering when he would set up his kingdom, and thus Jesus launched into the Olivet Discourse in Mat. 24 and 25.

Luke 19:11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear.

They thought that the kingdom should immediately appear, but Jesus taught the opposite.__________________
DHK

Are you Jewish? You are making the same mistakes.

 

[Brother Bob]

No, your free gift is eternal life, why don't you stop trying to earn it.

What do you suppose Jesus was talking about here?
Revelation 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Jeepers, where is the Father's Throne? You all confuse people so much, all they can do is pull their hair out. Soul going one place, body going another, spirit going another. Again, what rewards are you going to receive in the thousand years? Will it be the whole man receiving it, or just the soul? But what is it, and are you working to earn it?

 

[James_Newman]

Jeepers, where is the Father's Throne?

He didn't say you would get to sit in the Father's throne.

 

[DHK]

Are you Jewish? You are making the same mistakes.

You are missing the boat here. That is one of the main purposes for the Millennial Kingdom. At the end of the Tribulation Jesus will come for His own, the Jews. "So then all Israel shall be saved" (Rom.11:26). He will defeat the armies that are attacking her, and set up the kingdom at that time. But the Christians will have a part in that kingdom and will rule and reign with Christ.

 

[Brother Bob]

You are missing the boat here. That is one of the main purposes for the Millennial Kingdom. At the end of the Tribulation Jesus will come for His own, the Jews. "So then all Israel shall be saved" (Rom.11:26). He will defeat the armies that are attacking her, and set up the kingdom at that time. But the Christians will have a part in that kingdom and will rule and reign with Christ.__________________
DHK

I am sorry DHK; but the boat set sail over 2000 years ago. If God is going to save all of Israel, he does not need a 1000 year reign to do it, He can just do it.

 

[Brother Bob]

He didn't say you would get to sit in the Father's throne.

He did say, if you seen me you have seen the Father though.

 

[James_Newman]

He did say, if you seen me you have seen the Father though.

We believe in this thing called the trinity, would you like me to try and explain it to you? It's kind of complicated.

 

[DHK]

I am sorry DHK; but the boat set sail over 2000 years ago. If God is going to save all of Israel, he does not need a 1000 year reign to do it, He can just do it.

He can, but he hasn't. So why hasn't he done it? Why did the Jews suffer through the holocaust if what you say is true? Why was Israel once again established as a nation in 1948 after being a scattered people since 70 A.D. when their Temple was destroyed? They weren't saved; they were destroyed and scattered. Just the opposite of what you say happened to the Jewish nation. Why hasn't God saved them and set up his Kingdom for them? These questions, though asked many times of you, remain unanswered.

 

[Brother Bob]

We believe in this thing called the trinity, would you like me to try and explain it to you? It's kind of complicated.

You ignorance is showing

1Cr 15:24Then [cometh] the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

 

[Brother Bob]

He can, but he hasn't. So why hasn't he done it? Why did the Jews suffer through the holocaust if what you say is true? Why was Israel once again established as a nation in 1948 after being a scattered people since 70 A.D. when their Temple was destroyed? They weren't saved; they were destroyed and scattered. Just the opposite of what you say happened to the Jewish nation. Why hasn't God saved them and set up his Kingdom for them? These questions, though asked many times of you, remain unanswered.
__________________
DHK

God will graft them back in when it His time.

Rom 11:23And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.

Rom 11:24For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural [branches], be graffed into their own olive tree?

Rom 9:6¶Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel:


Why does it say this DHK;?
Rom 9:27Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

 

[charles_creech78]

We believe in this thing called the trinity, would you like me to try and explain it to you? It's kind of complicated.

Yes explain it to me.

 

[James_Newman]

Yes explain it to me.

God was on His throne when Christ was on the cross. Should it be strange to think Christ would have a throne in His kingdom on earth even while God sits on his throne in heaven?