Capital Punishment -- Proof it should be eliminated

[Crabtownboy]

Here again you wander off into absurdity. I do not know anything about the guilt or innocence of particular murderers. I know that we have a legal system designed to try people and upon conviction to execute them. There is nothing that you have ever written to show that it is not Biblical to execute murderers.

Does the Bible say it is permissible to execute innocent people?

 

[Bro. Curtis]

just two weeks ago C.T.Boy wanted to start killing people based solely on what they had said.

 

[Zaac]

I can agree with this in the scope of eternity, and eternal destination. Where I diverge is in the earthly realm. Sin is sin, and all deserve Hell for it. However, while stealing an $.80 candy bar is enough to send you to Hell, it will not get you 45 years to life. On earth, we have a scaling punishment system. Even as parents we do the same thing with our children. You stayed out 5 minutes past curfew? You might get grouned for a while. You went out with your friends and got drunk? You're probably going to get something more than grounded, and not be able to hang out with those friends.

This being said, that's why I believe the death penalty is appropriate for some crimes. If you destroy a (earthly) innocent life, then your life is no longer (earthly) innocent, and is forfeit.

But that is the point I've attempted to make for years now :laugh: It may be the proper punishment when looking through earthly, human eyes. And like divorce, God allows it. But is it so from a BIBLICAL perspective?

Which worldview should take precedence in the life of the Christian? The one that sees things through a worldly prism first? Or the one that sees things through a Christ prism first?

Your comment shows that you understand the difference between the two and thus should understand why the default of the Christian has to be life, grace and mercy in lieu of The Cross.

I am not going to discuss the Biblical portion of it, and how I believe the command still stands. This is an area in which we obviously disagree. I know the arguments saying it's not Biblical anymore, and I have come to a different conclusion.

Of course the command still stands. But where are the prophets, the Moses's the Samuels, the Joshuas who are in authority receiving a decree from God HIMSELF to righteously carry out said final earthly punishment?

The Jews aren't stoning people for not keeping The Law.

The reason its still sinful is because no one on earth can righteously make such a decision in lieu of The Cross and what the NT says.

 

[Revmitchell]

Supporting PLanned Parenthood and being against Capital Punishment is nothing but hypocrisy.

 

[church mouse guy]

Does the Bible say it is permissible to execute innocent people?

We have already discussed this issue and noted that you cannot show that the Bible says that it is permissible to execute innocent people.

However, you cannot show that it is not Biblical to execute guilty people.

Your problem is that you are apparently neo-orthodox and believe only in the Fatherhood of God, the Brotherhood of Man, and the Neighborhood of Martha's Vineyard.

 

[Zaac]

What I find hypocrtical is those who demonize Capital Punishment under a flawed system because it is believed some innocent may die but are willing to support Planned Parenthood even though under their system many do die innocently. They will justify supporting Planned Parenthood because of other things PP does they believe are good but demonize those who support CP for the same reasons.

Now I don't know about anyone else, but I know CTB has said he's against abortion. I'm sure he can express his feelings on PP if needed.

I've often wondered why a group that calls itself Planned Parenthood would take part in the killing of babies? YUCK!

Now as for me, I am against the taking of a human life PERIOD.

 

[Crabtownboy]

We have already discussed this issue and noted that you cannot show that the Bible says that it is permissible to execute innocent people.

However, you cannot show that it is not Biblical to execute guilty people.

Your problem is that you are apparently neo-orthodox and believe only in the Fatherhood of God, the Brotherhood of Man, and the Neighborhood of Martha's Vineyard.

Is it a sin to execute convicted innocent people?

 

[Crabtownboy]

Now I don't know about anyone else, but I know CTB has said he's against abortion. I'm sure he can express his feelings on PP if needed.

I've often wondered why a group that calls itself Planned Parenthood would take part in the killing of babies? YUCK!

Now as for me, I am against the taking of a human life PERIOD.

You and I agree. We are pro-life. Some are only partly pro-life ... pro-life for the unborn, but not for those alive.

Bringing in Planned Parenthood is simply a tactic trying to divert the subject of the thread ... which is executions should not take place as long as there are innocent people on death row.

 

[Crabtownboy]

Supporting PLanned Parenthood and being against Capital Punishment is nothing but hypocrisy.

Being against abortion and pro capital punishment knowing that innocent people will die is hypocrisy.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

]You and I agree. We are pro-life. Some are only partly pro-life ... pro-life for the unborn, but not for those alive.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Disturbing Truths/terri_schiavo_5.jpg

 

[Zaac]

We have already discussed this issue and noted that you cannot show that the Bible says that it is permissible to execute innocent people.

It's permissible. Scripture tells us that all things are permissible. The sin enters in when those things aren't necessarily beneficial or to God's glory. They executed Jesus. But permissible does not mean "not sinful".

However, you cannot show that it is not Biblical to execute guilty people.

Of course it's Biblical. But that doesn't mean that doing so is not sinful. The only times it was not sinful was when God gave the decree to His prophets, or His chosen leader or specifically to the Jewish people to keep them separate.

After The Cross, you simply don't see it.

 

[Zaac]

You and I agree. We are pro-life. Some are only partly pro-life ... pro-life for the unborn, but not for those alive.

Bringing in Planned Parenthood is simply a tactic trying to divert the subject of the thread ... which is executions should not take place as long as there are innocent people on death row.

If people's reason for being against abortion is the innocence angle, it really doesn't make much sense to not use the same angle with capital punishment.

Which again is why I say they can't really say this is about morality because morality should be based in the absolute truth of God's word that does not produce confusion or disorder.

 

[Crabtownboy]

If people's reason for being against abortion is the innocence angle, it really doesn't make much sense to not use the same angle with capital punishment.

Which again is why I say they can't really say this is about morality because morality should be based in the absolute truth of God's word that does not produce confusion or disorder.

Exactly. The unborn are innocent. If anti-abortion but pro capital punishment folk are going to use the innocent defense for the unborn then it is hypocritical not to extend the same defense to protect the innocent living. They are not truly pro-life, but selective pro-life.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/pix/schiavo_terri050318.jpg

 

[carpro]

The stance of people on here seems to be that abortion should be eliminated because innocent lives are being taken but capital punishment should remain an option even though innocent lives are being taken.

Name one innocent person that was executed. Just one.

 

[Zaac]

Name one innocent person that was executed. Just one.

Jesus Christ

 

[Crabtownboy]

Name one innocent person that was executed. Just one.

Carpro, as you like to say, we have discussed that in other threads and names were given. It has happened and will continue to happen as long as capital punishment is permitted.

Since 1973 over 140 individuals have been found innocent and released from death row.

 

[carpro]

Carpro, as you like to say, we have discussed that in other threads and names were given. It has happened and will continue to happen as long as capital punishment is permitted.

Since 1973 over 140 individuals have been found innocent and released from death row.

Give me a name. Just one innocent person that has been executed.

 

[Use of Time]

Name one innocent person that was executed. Just one.

You can't possibly be this stupid. This information was readily available via the world wide web and it took approximately 4 seconds to find this answer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_execution#United_States

 

[Don]

So is the life of the many more important than the one? Again, one of the reasons I believe Scripture points to the default of the Christian needing to be life and not death.

We are told to speak life.

As I've said before Don, the issue gets disordered when politics is infused with Christianity. Can you love your neighbor as yourself and want him to die?

Zaac - do you ascribe to "love the sinner, hate the sin"?