Causing Men to Lust

[Aaron]

I have to ask - even though I already know the answer.. Would you be comfortable if a man talked to YOUR wife like that and used the exact words that this pastor did and told the story of the young man who wanted to slip his hand down the back of a woman when she bent over and he saw her panties?

You would be comfortable with a man talking TO your wife like that in your presence?

He's not speaking to any one woman. He's speaking to the public, and his manner was eminently appropriate. Didn't you all applaud Mark Driscoll's explicit sex advice of late? I know Ann defended Driscoll, and the phrases and manners of this sermon is Victorian in comparison.

So what's the difference? One is telling you to dress modestly, and the other would probably prefer the good looking ones among you came to church naked.

 

[annsni]

To be quiet honest---women and men get "turned on" in ways that are 180degrees different than each other

Men are turned on primarily(and I repeat) primarily by what they see

Women are turned on primarily(and I repeat) primarily by what they hear

So a woman wears some item of clothes that a man catches with his eyes

And a man---well---its what he says to a woman that catches her attention

Both must put on the ritz in order to attract---she by what she wears--he by what he says

Now---I say--primarily

Sometimes you see women arroused by what a man wears or how he looks---but the majority of the time it is from what she hears

Sometimes a man is arroused by what he hears---but the majority of the time it is from what he sees

(HEY---I listened to a lot of Dr. Dobson before his retirement from radio!!)

Thats why it was the BB women in the 16 or so pages of this thread who were "turned off" by what Martin had to say---because he didn't say anything that would arouse them---and they let everybody KNOW they were not amused-------------but how many of us men spoke up and said anything about what Martin used to describe the settings??

:type::type:

See what I'm saying??

Now----------if it were ME preaching the sermon----here's what I would have said instead of what Martin said

It would be useless to elaborate or describe to the extent he did---mercy---because you and I both know he was preaching to the choir---------but hey----the choir needs preaching to every now and then!!!!!!!

I would say something like---------Ladies---men are aroused by what you wear---so be careful about what you wear Ladies-----YOU are aroused by what you hear-------so be careful of the way you converse with another man who is not your husband--------MEN---------have eyes for your wife only!!!!

Something along those lines-----not exactly all I would say but something to that order

I once heard the late Dr. Adrian Rogers say------Do you want to affair proof your marriage??? Do you???? Well---if you do---stay fervantly in love with the Lord Jesus Christ!!!

Interesting to note---------I've had people get up and leave during a message I've been preaching along those lines---and they left for far less than what Martin said----I feel bad about it---but shake it off as---well---those leaving must have had to go to the bathroom or something----or had some kind of roast in the oven and it was burning---or something------------of course, people leave and never come back--regardless of what I'm preaching sometimes!!

If you gave that message with me in the congregation, you'd be getting hearty "AMEN"s from me.

 

[annsni]

Ha ha, not me..... Im one of the biggest sinners you will ever meet. I may be reformed & redeemed but there is zero calling.... Seriously Im not your man.

Move to Long Island then. We can use some help in Holtsville.

 

[saturneptune]

I will tell you what you do then...that particular denom is in Carlile Pa....place a call to them.

I got a news flash for you, it does not work that way. That local church called him, voted him into office, and they can deal with the situation. Maybe before someone starts a thread lifting up someone with this mindset as on fire for the Lord, they should stop and think first.

 

[annsni]

He's not speaking to any one woman. He's speaking to the public, and his manner was eminently appropriate. Didn't you all applaud Mark Driscoll's explicit sex advice of late? I know Ann defended Driscoll, and the phrases and manners of this sermon is Victorian in comparison.

So what's the difference? One is telling you to dress modestly, and the other would probably prefer the good looking ones among you came to church naked.

You're saying that Driscoll wants people to come to church naked? Could you show me that quote? I DO applaud Driscoll's advice. I don't see it as explicit at all. Again, could you show it to me?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Move to Long Island then. We can use some help in Holtsville.

Actually trying for the Florida Keys & Tampa as a fall back.
Benefits, No Snow, Tropical climate & water, state that is nicer to the elderly, fresher fruit , no more winter coats. I say this as it is again snowing.

 

[Aaron]

It was hyperbole, Ann. The real objection to Martin isn't the alleged explicity, it's the fact that a man is telling a woman how to dress.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

You're saying that Driscoll wants people to come to church naked? Could you show me that quote? I DO applaud Driscoll's advice. I don't see it as explicit at all. Again, could you show it to me?

Really....what did I miss...:laugh:

 

[Aaron]

Even the Baptist Press wouldn't print all Driscoll's terminology.

 

[annsni]

Actually trying for the Florida Keys & Tampa as a fall back.
Benefits, No Snow, Tropical climate & water, state that is nicer to the elderly, fresher fruit , no more winter coats. I say this as it is again snowing.

Tampa is where we got our sailboat (Bradenton specifically) and we sailed through the Keys at Marathon. It was fun but I prefer the seasons.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

It was hyperbole, Ann. The real objection to Martin isn't the alleged explicity, it's the fact that a man is telling a woman how to dress.

What stones this man has:tonofbricks:

 

[blackbird]

No I dont see your point

EW&F

You mean to tell me you are in the forest but you can't see the trees??????:wavey::wavey: Start sawing down the tree you're standing behind so you can see the tree I'm standing in front of!!!

 

[pinoybaptist]

almost twenty pages and still going strong.....beep, beep....zwinnnngg!! (roadrunner disappears round the bend)

 

[annsni]

It was hyperbole, Ann. The real objection to Martin isn't the alleged explicity, it's the fact that a man is telling a woman how to dress.

To me it's both. If he had addressed it in a more - honorable way, I would have been right with him. However, I don't believe that it should be a man addressing this with women. I really see Scripture saying that it should be the older women teaching the younger women to be pure - not the men. I absolutely think modesty should be addressed from the pulpit but it should not be the direct issue of dress but instead the heart that is addressed. Teach the underlying Biblical teaching and you will have people who don't need inches and rulers to know what to wear but can have a discerning heart instead. It's the "teach a man to fish" principle.

 

[annsni]

Even the Baptist Press wouldn't print all Driscoll's terminology.

His sermon transcripts are on his site.

 

[Amy.G]

Didn't you all applaud Mark Driscoll's explicit sex advice of late?

I didn't applaud it since I have no idea what you're talking about. Post it and we'll critique his sermon also.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

EW&F

You mean to tell me you are in the forest but you can't see the trees??????:wavey::wavey: Start sawing down the tree you're standing behind so you can see the tree I'm standing in front of!!!

Ok dont get hit with the blade

 

[webdog]

Wow, 20 pages in 24 hours!

I thought his terminology was quite offensive and out of place for a sermon

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

To me it's both. If he had addressed it in a more - honorable way, I would have been right with him. However, I don't believe that it should be a man addressing this with women. I really see Scripture saying that it should be the older women teaching the younger women to be pure - not the men. I absolutely think modesty should be addressed from the pulpit but it should not be the direct issue of dress but instead the heart that is addressed. Teach the underlying Biblical teaching and you will have people who don't need inches and rulers to know what to wear but can have a discerning heart instead. It's the "teach a man to fish" principle.

Perhaps he was doing it from a fatherly perspective. He has been there 40 years & I'm sure he knows all the women. Perhaps they gave him the permission to address the church as a fatherly, or better yet at his age, a grandfatherly type figure. He is an old man in his 80's. He has lived with them, worshiped with them, baptized them, buried them. We aren't talking about a guy that comes to the pulpit, stays there & leaves for better hunting grounds. No, he was there when the church was built, there every step of the way.....in good times & bad & so they love him like a father. Perhaps it was poppa telling his daughters to be .... what did he say.... lovely image bearers of God. I doubt seriously that he was being a degenerate.

 

[annsni]

Perhaps he was doing it from a fatherly perspective. He has been there 40 years & I'm sure he knows all the women. Perhaps they gave him the permission to address the church as a fatherly, or better yet at his age, a grandfatherly type figure. He is an old man in his 80's. He has lived with them, worshiped with them, baptized them, buried them. We aren't talking about a guy that comes to the pulpit, stays there & leaves for better hunting grounds. No, he was there when the church was built, there every step of the way.....in good times & bad & so they love him like a father. Perhaps it was poppa telling his daughters to be .... what did he say.... lovely image bearers of God. I doubt seriously that he was being a degenerate.

But even my husband would not talk to my daughters that way. I don't see a father speaking that way to his children. I'm sorry but I just think it was addressed quite in the wrong way.