Champions of moderation- not abstinence

[saturneptune]

Who said they don't have a right to abstain?

What I am saying is that they should not preach against moderation.

In the Kingdom, they do NOT have the right to impugne Christian liberty.
They do not have the right to condemn what God commends.
They do not have the right to spread ignorance.

I don't think we ought to play patty-cake with such people.
They are a hindrance to Kingdom work.

A very good post, and would add, with all the lost folks on this earth, and the limited time we spend hearing the Word every week, that precious time should be spent on the Gospel and what Jesus Christ did for us on the cross. Pounding the podium about drinking, dancing, buying lottery tickets, or watching movies is a waste of the Lord's time, serves no purpose, and does nothing to advance the Kingdom of God.

 

[HisWitness]

A very good post, and would add, with all the lost folks on this earth, and the limited time we spend hearing the Word every week, that precious time should be spent on the Gospel and what Jesus Christ did for us on the cross. Pounding the podium about drinking, dancing, buying lottery tickets, or watching movies is a waste of the Lord's time, serves no purpose, and does nothing to advance the Kingdom of God.

The attitudes and actions of YAH's most HOLY LOVE flowing through us outwardly to others is how YAH speaks to people.

NOT bashing and banging them for breaking Man -made laws.
BUT they will need to know through that Love that they are breaking YAH's Laws.

SIN is still the transgression of YAH's Laws--NOT MAN'S LAWS.

 

[Greektim]

The attitudes and actions of YAH's most HOLY LOVE flowing through us outwardly to others is how YAH speaks to people.

NOT bashing and banging them for breaking Man -made laws.
BUT they will need to know through that Love that they are breaking YAH's Laws.

SIN is still the transgression of YAH's Laws--NOT MAN'S LAWS.

So why do you always use Yah and not Yahweh??? It was rarely ever used in the OT as a name in itself and most often attached to other words and names.

And why do you think the Father's name is Yah? YHWH can be applied to all members of the trinity, and I can offer Scripture to back that up... something you have yet to do w/ this whole "yeshua" fetish you are on.

 

[HisWitness]

So why do you always use Yah and not Yahweh??? It was rarely ever used in the OT as a name in itself and most often attached to other words and names.

And why do you think the Father's name is Yah? YHWH can be applied to all members of the trinity, and I can offer Scripture to back that up... something you have yet to do w/ this whole "yeshua" fetish you are on.

yes Yah is a shortened of Yahweh

Psalm 68-4 has his name as Yah or Jah

Yahshua is the Messiah's name--

 

[HisWitness]

So why do you always use Yah and not Yahweh??? It was rarely ever used in the OT as a name in itself and most often attached to other words and names.

And why do you think the Father's name is Yah? YHWH can be applied to all members of the trinity, and I can offer Scripture to back that up... something you have yet to do w/ this whole "yeshua" fetish you are on.

if you have a son---do you not name him after your-self---well maybe not in American tradition at times---but they did in Hebrew customs.

Point is the Son ALWAYS has a name corresponding to his Father's Name.

they are 2 persons---2 persons need a Name for each one to make them known who they are..

the Father--Yahweh
the Son--Yahshua

Just because your not use to the actual names doesn't mean someone is having a fetish over it.

whether you believe it or not--the Hebrews of Yahshua's day did not know him by our English translated name jesus.

Plus languages was changed around to come up with the translation we have today if you study hard enough--so I prefer to use the MORE accurate name of Yahshua instead of jesus--but by all means if you feel free to use that translated name go ahead---ill use the other in referring to the Son of the MOST HIGH--Yah.

 

[HisWitness]

So why do you always use Yah and not Yahweh??? It was rarely ever used in the OT as a name in itself and most often attached to other words and names.

And why do you think the Father's name is Yah? YHWH can be applied to all members of the trinity, and I can offer Scripture to back that up... something you have yet to do w/ this whole "yeshua" fetish you are on.

ask yourself a question friend--why is it that they took his name out over 6k times and replaced it with titles of Lord or God--these doesn't tell you who it is talking about--anyone or anything could be a lord or god---point is His name of YAH should have stayed in there in the place of putting lord or god in its place.

 

[Aaron]

Christ made fermented wine for those who were already intoxicated. If you don't think the wine was fermented, or that the drinkers were already intoxicated, you could be a (1) a fundamentalist, (2) don't have access to a concordance, or (3) have no desire to look up the original meanings of the words of Scripture; just to continue believing what you have been taught.

"And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there: And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage. And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come. His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim. And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it. When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew the governor of the feast called the bridegroom, And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk(to drink to intoxication), then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now. This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him" (John 2:1-11)

Where's your response to this, Luke?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

A very good post, and would add, with all the lost folks on this earth, and the limited time we spend hearing the Word every week, that precious time should be spent on the Gospel and what Jesus Christ did for us on the cross. Pounding the podium about drinking, dancing, buying lottery tickets, or watching movies is a waste of the Lord's time, serves no purpose, and does nothing to advance the Kingdom of God.

Pound the pavement....not the podium.:thumbsup:

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So why do you always use Yah and not Yahweh??? It was rarely ever used in the OT as a name in itself and most often attached to other words and names.

And why do you think the Father's name is Yah? YHWH can be applied to all members of the trinity, and I can offer Scripture to back that up... something you have yet to do w/ this whole "yeshua" fetish you are on.

Yahoo mule....cracks bull whip :laugh:

 

[Greektim]

ask yourself a question friend--why is it that they took his name out over 6k times and replaced it with titles of Lord or God--these doesn't tell you who it is talking about--anyone or anything could be a lord or god---point is His name of YAH should have stayed in there in the place of putting lord or god in its place.

I actually think you are breaking the 3rd commandment. When I was learning Hebrew, read aloud, or quote the Shema, I substitute Adonai in place of YHWH. I try to use the divine name as little as possible. The way you use it, it lacks respect and reverence. You throw it around like a baseball.

You still didn't answer why you think the shortened Yah is preferable. You quoted one verse where it says that is his name. What about the many other verses that say YHWH is his name??? And you keep misspelling the Hebrew of Jesus. It is Yahoshua. If it is so important to you, you'd think you'd get that right.

This is pathetic.

And the divine name YHWH is applied to all three members of the trinity. So it is not a name for the Father any more than it is for the Spirit. You're reasoning is based on suppositions not supported by Scripture. And you hold to a name that the New Testament never applied to Jesus. Show me one place where he is called Yeshua. He is Iesous in the GNT.

Still pathetic.

 

[Luke2427]

Where's your response to this, Luke?

I agree that the wine was fermented. Why respond?

 

[Aaron]

I agree that the wine was fermented. Why respond?

Eminent scholars disagree, but that won't budge you, I know. Do you believe Christ provided alcoholic drinks for those already drunken?

 

[HisWitness]

I actually think you are breaking the 3rd commandment. When I was learning Hebrew, read aloud, or quote the Shema, I substitute Adonai in place of YHWH. I try to use the divine name as little as possible. The way you use it, it lacks respect and reverence. You throw it around like a baseball.

You still didn't answer why you think the shortened Yah is preferable. You quoted one verse where it says that is his name. What about the many other verses that say YHWH is his name??? And you keep misspelling the Hebrew of Jesus. It is Yahoshua. If it is so important to you, you'd think you'd get that right.

This is pathetic.

And the divine name YHWH is applied to all three members of the trinity. So it is not a name for the Father any more than it is for the Spirit. You're reasoning is based on suppositions not supported by Scripture. And you hold to a name that the New Testament never applied to Jesus. Show me one place where he is called Yeshua. He is Iesous in the GNT.

Still pathetic.

Yahweh---Yahshua Fathers name is in the Son's

 

[webdog]

Eminent scholars disagree, but that won't budge you, I know. Do you believe Christ provided alcoholic drinks for those already drunken?

Its what the Bible says, why don't you.

 

[Aaron]

It's hard enough to be heard above Luke's appetite without your fairytales in the mix.

 

[webdog]

Lets see, Jesus allegedly turned water into freshly squeezed juice to give to a group of people who were well drunk on other freshly squeezed juice, and couldnt tell the difference between store brand and name brand fresh juice.

Someone believes fairy tales, thats true.

 

[Aaron]

dawg, I don't have power to open the eyes of the blind, so attempting to correct you is futile.

For kicks and grins, lets say you're right. Then Christ is no champion of moderation.

 

[Alive in Christ]

Well, I have just been lurking on this thread, so I will just say this..

Yes, scriptually...alchcholic beverages were allowed in the scriptures, and brothers and sisters today should not be looked down on if they imbibe. (in moderation)


And I am saying this as a total non drinker. I comletely quit drinking, and the reefer, and the pills, and the other drugs back in the 80,s when I was born again.

OK, back to lurk mode :godisgood:

 

[Luke2427]

Eminent scholars disagree, but that won't budge you, I know. Do you believe Christ provided alcoholic drinks for those already drunken?

name these "eminent scholars."

Fundy bumpkins who think of themselves as scholars maybe.

 

[Aaron]

Albert Barnes is the first to come to mind. I'll look up more later, if you wish. (I'm at work now and have 4th activities later tonight).

But let's cut to the chase: Isn't you're "belief" that Christ gave intoxicated men more with which to further intoxicate themselves really a projection of your own assertion that a degree of drunkenness is not only allowed but encouraged in the Scriptures?

If honesty prevails, it cannot be concluded from the text.