Death Penalty: My view

[Earth Wind and Fire]

To say that pedophiles don't change is to deny the change of heart that Christ performs at the moment of salvation. The solution is to evangelize them and every other criminal.

Then, if they are released and break into your house to harm your children, you shoot them dead .

Pedophiles have their particular sin and the rest of us have our own sin. We're no better than they are and are all equally condemned to Hell without Christ.

No I would not shoot them dead, bullets are hard to find today & why waste them when a good Louisville Slugger is close at hand. 1st swing takes out the hands or wrists or elbows Next,takes out kneecaps. My Kabar is always near me and razor sharp. One swipe and the ball sack is removed. Then he is taken to the Pocono mountains for a visit with the local bears. After that, if God wants him, he can have him but physically he is going to have a hard time.

 

[canadyjd]

No I would not shoot them dead, bullets are hard to find today & why waste them when a good Louisville Slugger is close at hand. 1st swing takes out the hands or wrists or elbows Next,takes out kneecaps. My Kabar is always near me and razor sharp. One swipe and the ball sack is removed. Then he is taken to the Pocono mountains for a visit with the local bears. After that, if God wants him, he can have him but physically he is going to have a hard time.

Torture, mutilation, kidnapping?

I don’t think that’s what Paul had in mind in 1 Timothy 1:15-16.

This may be one of the hardest commands of our Lord Jesus to obey. Every ounce of our being is screaming for vengeance. But God tells us to leave such things to Him.

And there is the possibility the murderer or pedophile will actually be saved at some point.

What if you see that person in heaven?

peace to you

 

[Alcott]

Do you think God needed Samuels help to kill them? God had commanded Saul to kill them, he disobeyed.

Ain't that what I said, Bud?

Jesus commands us, in 1 Timothy 1:15-16 to follow the example of our Lord by showing mercy to the worst of sinners, even murderers like Paul.

If we followed His example, what would we do to crooked dealers in the temple?

Will we obey the commands of our Lord Jesus?

We might.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Ain't that what I said, Bud?



If we followed His example, what would we do to crooked dealers in the temple?



We might.

Good so God commanded me to protect the little ones from harm. I could have killed the child molester... put a concrete pilon around his neck and drowns the sob.

In scripture it says... If a thief is found breaking in and is struck so that he dies, there shall be no bloodguilt for him

I consider a child molester a thief at the very least and more .. much more. He is a murderer, an executioner of an innocent human beings very soul. And when you do that... break in, well you get what’s coming to you

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

And let me put some real life experience to this

A pedophile comes into a church in NE PA and gets a job driving the bus and helping the youth pastor with the kids... only thing is he was caught twice and arrested for fondling children. So now he is released into an unsuspecting community and what does he do, take a guess. And it took a while for the church and community to catch on (oh he also joined the Boy Scouts as a friendly leader of boys) . He molested one boy I know, my nephew, who today is severely depressed and wants to take his life. He lives in his bedroom and is unable to leave that room. He is in deep mental disconnect from day to day living. I haven’t checked on the others but I know that robber stole that kids soul and left him a social cripple. I can go on and on with this but sufficient to say, I have first hand experience with pedofiles and I doubt I will be seeing any one of them in heaven.

 

[1689Dave]

I was asked in another thread how any Christian could not support the death penalty. I decided to explain my view here instead of derailing the thread.

I supported the death penalty most of my adult life. I changed my mind after studying scripture carefully in light of the execution in Texas of Carla Faye Tucker in 2000.

Many find support for the death penalty in Gen. 9. Any man that sheds blood shall have his blood shed by man (or words to that effect). The passage is viewed as an absolute standard. God requires the death of those that commit murder.

There were no governments during that time just after the flood. This is a reference to the ancient near East custom of the “blood avenger”. A relative who sought vengeance for death, accidental or intentional. Israel had cities of refuge for people seeking to avoid the blood avenger.

Concerning God setting the standard of execution for murder, I point to these examples. Cain killed Abel and God did not require his death (prior to the flood and Gen 9).

Moses killed the Egyptian. Moses was a murderer. (after the flood, prior to the law) God did not require his death.

David killed the husband of Bathsheba, by proxy as it were (after the law, before Christ) God did not require his life.

Paul persecuted Christians to the death (after Christ) and God did not require his life.

Paul is particularly important to this discussion. I’ll address that next.

peace to you

It's not the role of the Christian to bear the sword. It's the role of the civil magistrate who God sanctions to kill on behalf of the State. Christians in the magistrate's office have conflicting roles and cannot follow Christ's doctrine of non-restance of evil.

 

[JonC]

Ain't that what I said, Bud?



If we followed His example, what would we do to crooked dealers in the temple?



We might.

We would "expel the wicked man" (practice "church discipline").

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

We would "expel the wicked man" (practice "church discipline").

Would you also call the cops on him?

 

[JonC]

Would you also call the cops on him?

Depends on what he did.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Depends on what he did.

Pedofile... he abused children, that’s what they do.

 

[Van]

This is my two cents worth, and I have not read past the OP:

The bible clearly allows government to use deadly force to protect its citizens. However when California voted on the death penalty several years ago, I voted against it. Not because it was unbiblical, because it is not, but because its administration many times was not just. Too many poor people, too many feeble minded, too many people of color were sentenced to death, but the rich, the well connected, the powerful somehow got off disproportionately. And I believe life without parole equally protects citizens.

Again, just my two cents...

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Pedofile... he abused children, that’s what they do.

Personally I’m most familiar with the M9 but any 9mm will do. These repeat offenders should be taken into the woods and shot in the back of the head. Dead men don’t abuse children.
Further, if you’re into data, I’m positive that child molestation would take an immediate down turn.

 

[robycop3]

First, my view on capital punishment, which won't change:
I believe the DP is under-used. There should be no controversy about what drugs to use, whether to use "Old Sparky", gas chamber, firing squad, hanging, or a guillotine. If duly convicted of a capital crime, BARD, (B eyond A R easonable D oubt) that person should be executed soon after conviction.

Ms. Tucker was such a person. She was guilty of several murders, beyond ANY doubt. It's GREAT that she became a Christian, but she still had to pay man's penalty for her crimes against people.

Next, I have several weapons in my home for home defense. All are loaded with "Home Defense" rounds, which are designed to kill a person forthwith. If someone unauthorizedly enters my home-BOOM! While in the Navy, I learned that the US military exists for one purpose-to let the enemy die for his country. I was unsaved then, but I never have considered it wrong to kill in battle. GOD knows the difference in killing an enemy who would kill you if he got the chance, and murder, such as killing a surrendered enemy, or noncombatants who were not aiding the enemy.

As for pedophiles-late in my police time, I witnessed to one. I was riding in the paddy wagon with one from the court to the jail, where he would await transport to the state prison at Orient, OH, considered to be the safest prison for that type of offender. I believe the HOLY SPIRIT gave me that opportunity, knowing I despised pedophiles & child molesters The HS was reminding me that JESUS will forgive anyone of anything except badmouthing the HS. This man believed the Gospel, & was ready to pay the earthly penalty for his crimes. Last I heard, he wasdoing OK in prison, growing in his faith, witnessing to other inmates.

That's my views on capital punishment, etc. & they won'yt change. You may agree or disagree according to the dictates of your own conscience.

 

[1689Dave]

And the testimony of two witnesses was required (not as proof, but as men testifying....essentially putting their lives on the line).

When it comes to the death penalty I have seen the most hate-filled supporters of death being Christians. I just do not get that part. Some seem almost giddy when a human being is killed.

That reminds me of a claim I've made concerning "Christians" I've been around. It's "I've been treated the worst by the best". If it wasn't for Christ in my heart, I'd thrown in the sponge a long time ago.

 

[JonC]

Pedofile... he abused children, that’s what they do.

Yes, I would call the police. No, I would not advocate for the death penalty.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

No I would not shoot them dead, bullets are hard to find today & why waste them when a good Louisville Slugger is close at hand. 1st swing takes out the hands or wrists or elbows Next,takes out kneecaps. My Kabar is always near me and razor sharp. One swipe and the ball sack is removed. Then he is taken to the Pocono mountains for a visit with the local bears. After that, if God wants him, he can have him but physically he is going to have a hard time.

You won't find any complaints from me. I've got two little ones and would be willing to do the same if somebody tried to get to them. Unfortunately I'm pressed for time usually between the farm, my software job and the fire dept so rule 7.62x39 will have to suffice. I just have a fine line drawn between violence "in the act" versus violence "after or before the act".

And let me put some real life experience to this

A pedophile comes into a church in NE PA and gets a job driving the bus and helping the youth pastor with the kids... only thing is he was caught twice and arrested for fondling children. So now he is released into an unsuspecting community and what does he do, take a guess. And it took a while for the church and community to catch on (oh he also joined the Boy Scouts as a friendly leader of boys) . He molested one boy I know, my nephew, who today is severely depressed and wants to take his life. He lives in his bedroom and is unable to leave that room. He is in deep mental disconnect from day to day living. I haven’t checked on the others but I know that robber stole that kids soul and left him a social cripple. I can go on and on with this but sufficient to say, I have first hand experience with pedofiles and I doubt I will be seeing any one of them in heaven.

I would add that the church made a massive mistake in allowing someone like him around children. His sex offender records must've shown up in a rudimentary background check. I don't advocate allowing a convicted sex offender near children or women. You wouldn't put a Saved alcoholic in charge of wine (if you use that during the Lord's Supper), you wouldn't put someone with anger issues in charge of security, an embezzler in charge of the budget, and you shouldn't put a self-professed Saved sex offender anywhere near kids or women. Let him run the sound booth or something under supervision.

There's a tension between the biblical teaching of a new believer being in-dwelt with the holy spirit and being a changed being vs the biblical mandate of father's to protect their children and family at all costs. The old man still rises from time to time. In the case above the Church should've gone for the protection side rather than the liberty side.

 

[1689Dave]

How does all the vigilante "justice" by Christians hold up to Jesus' teaching about loving enemies, non-resistance of evil, turning the other cheek, etc?

 

[Salty]

How does all the vigilante "justice" by Christians hold up to Jesus' teaching about loving enemies, non-resistance of evil, turning the other cheek, etc?

1) do you believe in using deadly force for self defense?

 

[Salty]

And let me put some real life experience to this

A pedophile comes into a church in NE PA and gets a job driving the bus and helping the youth pastor with the kids....

Thus the importance of having an annual background check on all youth workers.
Many insurance companies will assist with this.

 

[Salty]

It's not the role of the Christian to bear the sword. It's the role of the civil magistrate who God sanctions to kill on behalf of the State. Christians in the magistrate's office have conflicting roles and cannot follow Christ's doctrine of non-restance of evil.

So you are serving on a jury - would you vote to issue the death penalty - if you were 100% sure of their guilt.