Did Eve Lie To The Serpent?

[standingfirminChrist]

I believe 'the truth' reffered to here is the gospel, the word of God, and/or the 'Christian Life'. My basis for saying this and for asking the original question is that Rahab lied and was blessed of God for it. There are others who lied and recieved no condemnation for it.
In context of 1 John 2, the 'truth' is a true life, true salvation, true works, which are true to your position as a saint, etc.

Actually, Rahab was not blessed of God for lying, but for hiding the spies.

 

[Rubato 1]

Actually, Rahab was not blessed of God for lying, but for hiding the spies.

Which, in God's providence, meant that she would lie to the searchers. She lied and was blessed as a result, because lying was how she hid the spies.

 

[KeithS]

Apparently I believe Scripture more than others

I haven't read the whole thread but came to this and had to ask...

Did Moses "lie" when he did not accurately relate the complete command that God apparently gave to Adam to not eat or touch?

It looks like either you want to insist that either Eve lied or that God originally commanded it. In that case you must insist that either Moses lied or God did not originally command it. For your viewpoint to be consistent you must insist that either Eve or Moses lied. Which will it be? Unless there is perhaps another less nefarious explanation.

 

[Isaiah40:28]

I would never advocate that a Christian lies to save themselves or someone else.
Speak the truth or stay silent.
What do you think the pastors' of persecuted churches teach?

If I were to ever lie for the sake of "righteousness", I believe it would demonstrate a lack of faith in God's purposes and plans. It would seem like I would be saying, "God cannot work in this situation unless I lie."

This in no way casts shame on those who have lied for the sake of righteousness, but I don't believe it is biblical to encourage such lying.

 

[webdog]

I would never advocate that a Christian lies to save themselves or someone else.
Speak the truth or stay silent.
What do you think the pastors' of persecuted churches teach?

If I were to ever lie for the sake of "righteousness", I believe it would demonstrate a lack of faith in God's purposes and plans. It would seem like I would be saying, "God cannot work in this situation unless I lie."

This in no way casts shame on those who have lied for the sake of righteousness, but I don't believe it is biblical to encourage such lying.

What about Rahab the harlot? Jonathan in the field with David? Jesus walking on the road with the two after His resurrection?

Lying that is sin is determined by motive.

 

[Isaiah40:28]

What about Rahab the harlot? Jonathan in the field with David? Jesus walking on the road with the two after His resurrection?

Lying that is sin is determined by motive.

What about it?
They are narratives.
Why should a Christian turn to narratives and override the didactic portions of Exodus 20?
Should Christian men take more than one wife?
There are plenty of narratives in the Bible where this is done and no condemnation is spoken of.

 

[Rubato 1]

What about it?
They are narratives.
Why should a Christian turn to narratives and override the didactic portions of Exodus 2?

Which 'didactic' portions do you mean? 'Bearing false witness' is different than lying.

 

[Isaiah40:28]

Which 'didactic' portions do you mean? 'Bearing false witness' is different than lying.

Okay.
Why should I accept that assertion?

 

[Steven2006]

What about missionaries in a closed country that apply for visas under a different stated purpose when their true intentions are to evangelize? Is that lying, is that wrong?

 

[standingfirminChrist]

What about missionaries in a closed country that apply for visas under a different stated purpose when their true intentions are to evangelize? Is that lying, is that wrong?

Lying is never right.

Matthew 10:32-33 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

 

[Revmitchell]

Genesis 3:2-3 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

I had always heard that Eve added to God's Word when she said 'neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die." And I had always believed that she did because of other's teaching so.

But tonight, as Linda and I were studying the Word, a thought came to me.

Did Eve really lie to the serpent in that statement?

I wonder if God may have instructed her not to touch it and it just was not recorded by Moses?

The reason I ask this is because of a verse found in Romans 5

Romans 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Was it disobedience that brought sin into the world? or was it a lie?

If a lie, then Eve lied before being deceived.

Theologians, have at it.

My position is she did not lie. However, giving room for the argument it is still a non-issue. No where in scripture is this addressed. And it has no bearing on anything.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Rahab was not rewarded for lying. She was rewarded for her kindness to the two spies.

After the men left, she went to the spies on her roof and made them swear to return the kindness she showed to them by protecting them.

 

[Steven2006]

Lying is never right.

Matthew 10:32-33 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

So are you condemning that practice for missionaries to enter a closed country? Should we not send missionaries to closed counties?

 

[Rubato 1]

Okay.
Why should I accept that assertion?

Because of the dictionary.

Bearing false witness is a falshood in a legal matter. This is saying that a neigbor did something that he did not do. There are also false accusations. A 'false witness' is just that:saying you witnessed something which you did not. That is saying 'Jonny took that candy bar', as opposed to 'I didn't take the candy bar'. Both can be lies, but only the first is false witness against a neighbor.

Rahab was not rewarded for lying. She was rewarded for her kindness to the two spies.

Her kindness was protecting them. How? By lying to mislead the searchers. This is the only way she protected them.

 

[Rubato 1]

Lying is never right.

Is this in the Bible?

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

It seems webdog had quite an idea that never got much traction. It seems that in Romans the idea is not what was the first sin, but rather how sin was transmitted to each person.

 

[Rubato 1]

It seems webdog had quite an idea that never got much traction. It seems that in Romans the idea is not what was the first sin, but rather how sin was transmitted to each person.

This is a good point. Makes me wish I had read all the rest of the thread...:thumbs:

 

[standingfirminChrist]

So are you condemning that practice for missionaries to enter a closed country? Should we not send missionaries to closed counties?

If God is sending them, He will open the doors. We do not have to lie, nor do they to spread the Gospel.

 

[Dale-c]

Rahab was not rewarded for lying. She was rewarded for her kindness to the two spies.

How do you think she showed them kindness?

You do not owe the truth to your enemy!

 

[webdog]

Rahab was not rewarded for lying. She was rewarded for her kindness to the two spies.

After the men left, she went to the spies on her roof and made them swear to return the kindness she showed to them by protecting them.

She lied nonetheless, and was never punished for it. That lie did lead to a reward.
Jonathan lied in the field to save David. He was neither rewarded or rebuked. Scripture doesn't tell us that what either did was sin.