How can there be any selection without someone to do the selecting? Believing in the lie of evolution is denying that an omnipotent God exists; the same goes for theistic evolution. Theistic evolution says that God is limited in power.
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Did manking evolve from other primates, or By Creation by God?
- Thread starter Yeshua1
- Start date
How can there be any selection without someone to do the selecting? Believing in the lie of evolution is denying that an omnipotent God exists; the same goes for theistic evolution. Theistic evolution says that God is limited in power.
My strawman for today: What effect does the Higgs Boson, aka: God Particle, have on the discussion? It all still points to an Intelligent Design. Albert of Einstein acknowledged such an intelligence--greater than his. Al apparently never admitted to having a personal relationship with his creator--in fact to the contrary--Intelligent Design does not necessarily lead one to Calvary.
This is not a new malady of mankind. Many of our founding fathers believed in Deity, while not necessarily following the precepts of Jesus, The Christ. In fact, even many of those who were called Christian were following another gospel: that of baptismal regeneration and the consequential infant baptism.(Baptism is not part of the gospel.) Relatively few Christians refuse to baptize children as part of the Gospel. Curious.
Some of this belongs on another thread perhaps.
It all boils to this: without the spiritual discernment of having been born again, one cannot comprehend what has happened, is happening and what is soon to happen. See Jn. 3:1-21. Are we ready?
Even so, come Lord Jesus
Bro. James
This is not a new malady of mankind. Many of our founding fathers believed in Deity, while not necessarily following the precepts of Jesus, The Christ. In fact, even many of those who were called Christian were following another gospel: that of baptismal regeneration and the consequential infant baptism.(Baptism is not part of the gospel.) Relatively few Christians refuse to baptize children as part of the Gospel. Curious.
Some of this belongs on another thread perhaps.
It all boils to this: without the spiritual discernment of having been born again, one cannot comprehend what has happened, is happening and what is soon to happen. See Jn. 3:1-21. Are we ready?
Even so, come Lord Jesus
Bro. James
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OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Evolution is not a fact and according to scientific terminology is not even a theory. Evolution cannot be tested and theories require verification by testing.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
That is the pathetic mantra of atheistic evolution: Everyone is stupid but the evolutionist. I suspect you understand nothing. If so respond to posts without making irrational comments!
Magnetic Poles
New Member
And again, you are incorrect. But you cannot educate those who do not wish it. They follow those who only take them where they wish to go anyway.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Well said, especially referencing wiki.
Just when and where has the concept of evolution been tested?
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
You can only be speaking of yourself since you really know no one on this Board.
MP: I see that you are in the business of advertising, a manager no less. That puts everything you say in proper perspective.
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The biggest hurdle for both the evolutionists and the creationists to come to terms with is that the fossil records, carbon dating, and "earth layers" all disturb the "timeline" and neither reconcile major discrepancies in solving all the findings.
The Scriptures teach a seven day creation.
Some are rather myopic as a child would be in thinking that nothing existed before the first day, but that isn't Scriptural. For water covered land and God did not create either on the first day but called for them to separate and established boundaries. Separation and boundaries have always mystified humankind - and they have this desire to tear down the walls of separation and remove the stones of boundaries.
Considering that one of the great attributes of God is that He is a Creator, then it follows that God created before this world's creation any number of objects and schemes in which humankind is not told a word in Scriptures and science can only guess using observational tools.
Evolution has never been proved scientifically - even from fossil forms up to modern forms. It is merely conjecture and speculation that changes with each decade. What I was schooled in the mid 20th century is not the same and is laughable compared to some "understandings" of thought in the modern world. The basic tenet of any science for a theory to become fact is that the "experiment" is reproducible. So far, not one species has been shown as mutated or "evolved" from another, much less "reproductions" of the event which would show the mutation viable and continuous. Rather, all mutations have been shown as degenerative and non-viable (that is non-continual in offspring).
Even the physicists who have sought to prove by mathematical schemes the various aspects of the universe are in constant revision and refutation of each other.
Fact: God creates
Fact: God created in 6 days this current world system
Fact: God established redemption before the foundations of the system were placed
Fact: If one does not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, they are condemned to hell, already - because they haven't believed.
Fact: "But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God has chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;..."
Fact: There are many "myths" and "half truths" in which God has no part nor enjoys any fellowship. Evolution is one of them.
Fact: God does not "evolve" and His creation from the fall has been devolving.
The Scriptures teach a seven day creation.
Some are rather myopic as a child would be in thinking that nothing existed before the first day, but that isn't Scriptural. For water covered land and God did not create either on the first day but called for them to separate and established boundaries. Separation and boundaries have always mystified humankind - and they have this desire to tear down the walls of separation and remove the stones of boundaries.
Considering that one of the great attributes of God is that He is a Creator, then it follows that God created before this world's creation any number of objects and schemes in which humankind is not told a word in Scriptures and science can only guess using observational tools.
Evolution has never been proved scientifically - even from fossil forms up to modern forms. It is merely conjecture and speculation that changes with each decade. What I was schooled in the mid 20th century is not the same and is laughable compared to some "understandings" of thought in the modern world. The basic tenet of any science for a theory to become fact is that the "experiment" is reproducible. So far, not one species has been shown as mutated or "evolved" from another, much less "reproductions" of the event which would show the mutation viable and continuous. Rather, all mutations have been shown as degenerative and non-viable (that is non-continual in offspring).
Even the physicists who have sought to prove by mathematical schemes the various aspects of the universe are in constant revision and refutation of each other.
Fact: God creates
Fact: God created in 6 days this current world system
Fact: God established redemption before the foundations of the system were placed
Fact: If one does not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, they are condemned to hell, already - because they haven't believed.
Fact: "But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God has chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;..."
Fact: There are many "myths" and "half truths" in which God has no part nor enjoys any fellowship. Evolution is one of them.
Fact: God does not "evolve" and His creation from the fall has been devolving.
The "theory" not sure which one of many so far has been shown to be statistically insignificant. The odds of the right information coming together in the same place at the same time to produce one living cell are one in ten to more zeros than one can count without scientific notation.
The basic absurdity of evolutionary theories is that they cannot be proven nor disproven, a basic tenet of the scientific methodology. No one was there in the beginning to verify what happened--except God. Atheistic scientists have a real problem with the accountability consequences of the fact of: "In the beginning God..." So, they say God cannot be proven nor disproven by science while retaining the notion that evolution is a fact which apparently needs no proof.
Both evolution and creation belong in religion class--they both have to be accepted by faith.
The Bible is not a science book--it does not change every 10 years either. The Truth needs no addendum.
Theistic evolution came out of the same ditch as evolution, regardless of whichever Big Bang Boson one may follow.
Peace,
Bro. James
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OldRegular
Well-Known Member
The Higgs Boson particle, if it exists, has nothing to do with the discussion. Neither does intelligent design, another obeisance to evolution.
Until the development of the nuclear weapon it was commonly held by physicists that there were three elementary particles, electron, proton, neutron. As the result of unaccounted energy in nuclear weapons the neutrino was postulated and experiments have identified what is believed to be the neutrino. Presently quantum physics predicts 18 elementary particles.
It should be noted that particles may be postulated to explain observations or and/or calculations. Presumably 16 elementary particles have been identified but things may be much simpler, or perhaps more complex, than the human mind can handle.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
I like that.:laugh::thumbs::thumbs::laugh:
freeatlast
New Member
There is no evidence, just theory. What you are claiming is not science. The bible has the truth not men who make up stories. I would ask you this. Do you believe in the laws of Physics? If so then give me one that explains or promotes evolution.
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OldRegular
Well-Known Member
I am not sure the above is correct. In fact I believe it to be incorrect.
Consider Genesis 1:1-5, the first day.
1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Verse 1 clearly states that 1. In the beginning God created. There is no reason to believe that this did not happen on the 1st day. He could have spoke these into existence just as he did light.
freeatlast
New Member
I think you are a little confused about the creation account. The fact that water is mentioned shows it was created on the first day, not that it was already here. As for the fossil records, carbon dating, and "earth layers there is no issue as long as one believe the truth about them. Those who deny a 6 day creation force false information into those things.
Watch this video and let me know what you think.
http://www.creationtoday.org/seminar-part-1-the-age-of-the-earth/
I've Watched Most of the Planet of Apes Movies....
....and it is still science-fiction to me! Great entertainment, but that is all it was then and still is! :wavey:
....and it is still science-fiction to me! Great entertainment, but that is all it was then and still is! :wavey:
Like I stated, some do, some don't.
Doesn't really matter. Great folks have argued on both sides of the issue.
I would agree with your view EXCEPT:
First: It is not in character with God to create what is without form and void. NO other creative work throughout Scriptures can show without form and void to be part of the character of how God creates.
Second: the word "was" in this poetical selection is accurately translated but NOT meaning as it being created originally in that condition.
For example. I purchased a new car. The car was in a wreck.
See the "was" is not the condition of original purchase, but it "was" in a wreck and no longer in the original condition.
Unfortunately, there is no Scriptures to give the original condition for that is closed and frankly unnecessary to the purpose of the narrative the Scriptures give. It is stated as "was" and therefore, the original was wrecked. Some readers do not recall that poetry (even Hebrew poetry) does not have to entertain every action and recall every work. But poetry (even Hebrew poetry) that presents a "story" is a narrative in short concise terms.
Third: Darkness. There is no darkness in God. In the new Heaven and Earth there is no darkness not even a shaddow. It is impossible for God to deny Himself and Scriptures clearly teach that "God is light, in Him is no darkness." Yet, here in Genesis God is in the dark. Dark is the absence of light, not the presence of darkness. When light is not - darkness is. Because darkness was, God called for light - and there was light. What God desires is treated as a command throughout Scriptures. Light and dark is all the same to God, but because the Scriptures emphasize the state of darkness it places emphasis upon the condition that caused the darkness and without form and void.
Fourth: The land was not exposed until the second day. This was the first time known that water covered the earth, but not the last.
Fifth: There is no alternative, but to recognize the earth's revolution around it's own axis is what declares one day. There is no "time" marked out until the statement of day and night, and then the demarcation of what is a day. Because that day has never been changed (other than for Joshua), and has remained on a 24 hour basis, there is no reason to assume that once night and day were established the 24 hour cycle was also not already in effect.
Note: Without form and void does not have a specific revolution upon axis that can establish what is the beginning from the next beginning. It has no form, it has no fixed estate. The Hebrew poetry words are used to show confusion and like a boiling or churning action. The fact that what constitutes a "day" being specified in the Scriptures, conforms to the poetical form of assuming the reader knows that without form and void was corrected into some established form that was not void.
Sixth: Lest some readers think I am not a holder of a literal six day creation, let me make that statement clear. I hold to the view of a six day creation, and that is six 24 hour time periods in which all creation took place.
Seventh: That view (as stated in # six) does not conform the Creator to have only created the current heavens and earth and never having created before nor in the future. The Lord Jesus Christ states - "I go to prepare a place for you..." He is reflecting that of God's character as Creator. If one reads carefully, it is the "Word" of God (for God is Spirit) that actually formed and did the work - that Word is Christ. He is the Creator and sustains all creation.
I do not deny a six literal 24 hour day creation.
I am not certain how folks read that into my post.
However, there is nothing to prevent God from having created before Genesis 1 and just never told about it.
Why would He?
It really isn't anything that pertains to redemption - that is what the Scriptures are main theme is really about.
freeatlast
New Member
If there was something before that carried over to this creation then the bible is wrong as it says in the beginning and speakes of the first day. There is only one first day.
Really?
So, God did not exist before the first day?
You can prove God existed before the first day?
You can prove that in all eternity God did not create other than on the first day?
Perhaps you will show Scriptures for your assumptions.
The absence of Scriptures do not mean the absence of God or some other creative work.
freeatlast
New Member
Read what I wrote. God is not a thing.