Do you Love YHVH?

[Jason1]

And here we see your cult expression. 100% wrong you say.

I notice that not one have you acknowledged that Yeshua, Jesus, is in fact YHWH himself and he has fulfilled the law because we are incapable of doing it ourselves. Yeshua's propitiation for me has caused me to hit the mark that the law required. God's great and amazing grace is more than sufficient.
You may go back to your compound at any time. Your foolish heresy is noted.

Yeshua was sent from YHVH the Father to redeem His pride back to Him. Yeshua took on the penalty of an adulterous woman and we can rejoin the covenant because He became a new creation upon being risen from the dead. That is grace indeed.

Now we can walk in newness of life and follow YHVH with a pure heart by obeying His torah with help from His spirit.

May His will be done (torah) on earth as it is in heaven.

If that's a cult, sign me up

 

[Alcott]

Alcott, if you wish to know the truth of Rom 14, here is an excellent study: ...

I hold that truth to be self-evident.

As per your second verse, you are misreading it most likely. Let nobody judge you in HOW you keep it.

No, you have to insert your own word for the verse to have that meaning.

These gentiles are new to obeying these things and Paul was saying don't let people judge you in how you perform it (like the judaisers).

Like you, huh?

Again, scripture builds on scripture and Paul cannot undue a written command (which he never tried to do).

Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law [Galatians 5:2-3].

If you want your salvation to be based on doing absolutely every requirement of The Law with no failure whatsoever, then go for it. The "whole law" excludes nothing-- sacrifices, ceremonies, the lamb's blood, the scapegoat, all of it.

 

[MennoSota]

Yeshua was sent from YHVH the Father to redeem His pride back to Him. Yeshua took on the penalty of an adulterous woman and we can rejoin the covenant because He became a new creation upon being risen from the dead. That is grace indeed.

Now we can walk in newness of life and follow YHVH with a pure heart by obeying His torah with help from His spirit.

May His will be done (torah) on earth as it is in heaven.

If that's a cult, sign me up

Sounds like Jehovah's Witness with a twist. If you wish to be in chains stay where you are. Perhaps one day God will choose to be gracious to you, give your spirit life and redeem you. I will pray to that end.

 

[HankD]

Hmm, "Hebrew Roots"?

The idea that the New Testament is faulty and relevant only in light of the Old Testament has also brought the doctrine of the Trinity under attack by many advocates of the Hebrew Roots beliefs

What is the Hebrew Roots movement?

So Jason was/is Jesus Christ God come in the flesh?

HankD

 

[Jason1]

Hmm, "Hebrew Roots"?


What is the Hebrew Roots movement?

So Jason was/is Jesus Christ God come in the flesh?

HankD

Yes, I am into hebrew roots. The quote you posted is not an accurate description because most find no fault with the NT. We take scripture as a whole and use the OT to understand the NT which is only logical. Much understanding has come doing this.

Jesus is the word made flesh

 

[Jason1]

I hold that truth to be self-evident.


No, you have to insert your own word for the verse to have that meaning.



Like you, huh?



Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law [Galatians 5:2-3].

If you want your salvation to be based on doing absolutely every requirement of The Law with no failure whatsoever, then go for it. The "whole law" excludes nothing-- sacrifices, ceremonies, the lamb's blood, the scapegoat, all of it.

Its ok Alcott. I know most people can't understand there are 3 different laws talked about in the NT. The translators don't make a distinction always so it is hard to understand on the surface.

1. Written Law
2. Oral Law
3. Law of Sin & Death

Once you understand which Paul is talking about in each of his letters it makes so much sense. Peter even knew it was hard:

Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them concerning these matters, in which some are hard to understand,1 which those who are untaught and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do also the other Scriptures.

 

[MennoSota]

Yes, I am into hebrew roots. The quote you posted is not an accurate description because most find no fault with the NT. We take scripture as a whole and use the OT to understand the NT which is only logical. Much understanding has come doing this.

Jesus is the word made flesh

Is Jesus YHWH?

 

[Jason1]

Is Jesus YHWH?

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with Elohim, and the Word was Elohim.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with Elohim.

 

[MennoSota]

Hmm, "Hebrew Roots"?


What is the Hebrew Roots movement?

So Jason was/is Jesus Christ God come in the flesh?

HankD

Bewitching Believers Through the Hebrew Roots Movement

 

[Jason1]

Bewitching Believers Through the Hebrew Roots Movement

Did you write that by chance? lol

What if I wrote an article "Bewitching Baptists" and posted it on here. Would that give my words any more credence in your eyes? No, I thought not.

 

[MennoSota]

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with Elohim, and the Word was Elohim.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with Elohim.

Elohim is plural. One being, God, three persons, Father, Son and Spirit.
Is Jesus YHWH? Yes or No will suffice.

 

[MennoSota]

Did you write that by chance? lol

What if I wrote an article "Bewitching Baptists" and posted it on here. Would that give my words any more credence in your eyes? No, I thought not.

Is the article wrong?

Jason, your comments and your tortured exegesis show that you are in a cult. May God extend his grace and free you from your bondage.

 

[Jason1]

Is the article wrong?

Yes, the article is wrong. What the author messes up is that he is confusing messianic judaism with hebrew roots. The difference is that messianic judaism takes man made laws and customs (oral law) and combines it with messiah. This leads to a false pairing because as I have shown over and over, Paul and the Messiah came to combat oral law's additions (never written law). They also elevate being jewish to a high standard as judaism does.

Hebrew roots on the other hand is a mixed bag of people. There is no central church so each group is a bit different and most groups are home fellowships (as mine is). We aim to come out of paganism and focus on what the Word really says.

Jason, your comments and your tortured exegesis show that you are in a cult. May God extend his grace and free you from your bondage.

A cult is not necessarily a negative word and does adequately describe us. It is an unorthodox group practicing a set of religious practices or dogma.

What you fail to understand is that the written word of Elohim is not bondage, it is freedom. In america we have laws to protect people and their rights (as torah does). Those laws aren't enslaving but protecting.

As Sean Connery said in First Knight:

"There are laws that enslave men, and laws that set men free"​

 

[HankD]

Jason,

Elohim is a plural Hebrew word and it is not found in the NT.

To quote John 1:1 with Elohim for God-theos does not answer M's question.

Elohim refers to the Trinity. - the Tertragrammaton (YHWH) refers to GOD in His TRIUNITY (These three are one).

Jesus was known as the Logos (The Word) - the Second person of the Trinity before His incarnation.

He IS/WAS/WILL ALWAYS BE eternal, omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent God.

This is what the Tetragrammaton is YHWH - a concatenation of the Hebrew verb "to be" in the three tenses - past, present and future thus signifying his eternal status in the Godhead.

As Baptist we are Trinitarian as explained above.

To say that Jesus is the word (lower case "w") incarnate is really not necessarily an affirmation of His deity.

We are all willing to discuss things with you but we would like to know exactly where you stand as to the person of Jesus Christ who is fully God, fully man.

Thanks
HankD

 

[Jason1]

Hank, I'm not a trinitarian. The set-apart spirit is the Father Himself. It is always "His" or "His Son's" spirit doing things (active force). So I guess you can call me a dualist.

The Father and the Son are not equal. The Father sits on the throne and His son is at His right hand. Yeshua gave all honor to the Father and directed it as such.

That being said, I do believe the Son is of the family of YHVH and proceeds from Him.

That's how I see things personally. I may be wrong, but it makes the most sense according to scripture the way I see it.

 

[MennoSota]

Hank, I'm not a trinitarian. The set-apart spirit is the Father Himself. It is always "His" or "His Son's" spirit doing things (active force). So I guess you can call me a dualist.

The Father and the Son are not equal. The Father sits on the throne and His son is at His right hand. Yeshua gave all honor to the Father and directed it as such.

That being said, I do believe the Son is of the family of YHVH and proceeds from Him.

That's how I see things personally. I may be wrong, but it makes the most sense according to scripture the way I see it.

Jason, the path you currently are on is the same as Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons and Muslims. By denying Yeshua as being YHWH in the flesh, you rely upon your self to save you and receive God's approval. The Bible tells you that you will miss the mark and remain forever dead in your trespasses and sins. I do not wish this for you. I pray that God would free you from the bondage in which you live. Perhaps Yeshua will be gracious. God was gracious to Saul even though Saul/Paul imagined that he correctly devined the Torah and was a Jew among Jews. Surely you don't imagine yourself to be a better Jew than Saul.

 

[Jason1]

Jason, the path you currently are on is the same as Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons and Muslims. By denying Yeshua as being YHWH in the flesh, you rely upon your self to save you and receive God's approval. The Bible tells you that you will miss the mark and remain forever dead in your trespasses and sins. I do not wish this for you. I pray that God would free you from the bondage in which you live. Perhaps Yeshua will be gracious. God was gracious to Saul even though Saul/Paul imagined that he correctly devined the Torah and was a Jew among Jews. Surely you don't imagine yourself to be a better Jew than Saul.

I never denied that. You must reread.

I never said I rely on myself, you interjected that. Only YHVH saves

Keeping torah is not bondage, it is freedom and obedience. Not keeping torah is bondage because that is sin.

Saul was a pharisee and after judaism. His eyes were opened to the truth - the written word and the revelation of Yeshua.

 

[HankD]

Hank, I'm not a trinitarian. The set-apart spirit is the Father Himself. It is always "His" or "His Son's" spirit doing things (active force). So I guess you can call me a dualist.

The Father and the Son are not equal. The Father sits on the throne and His son is at His right hand. Yeshua gave all honor to the Father and directed it as such.

That being said, I do believe the Son is of the family of YHVH and proceeds from Him.

That's how I see things personally. I may be wrong, but it makes the most sense according to scripture the way I see it.

Thank you Jason for your honesty.

Jason do you know that the Torah contains 613 commandments (mitzvouth)?

About 200 or so cannot be kept because there is no temple in Jerusalem and no identifiable Aaronic priesthood.

How then can we be asked to keep torah when it is impossible?

Jesus indicated that every jot and tittle must be kept, yet God Himself allowed the Roman General Titus in AD70 to come to Jerusalem and destroy the Temple and destroy the Levitical priesthood which in effect brought biblical Judaism to an end.

The Temple and the Aaronic priesthood are absolute essentials to biblical Judaism.

There is no hope in Judaism Jason.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I AM the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

HankD

 

[Jason1]

Thank you Jason for your honesty.

Jason do you know that the Torah contains 613 commandments (mitzvouth)?

About 200 or so cannot be kept because there is no temple in Jerusalem and no identifiable Aaronic priesthood.

How then can we be asked to keep torah when it is impossible?

Jesus indicated that every jot and tittle must be kept, yet God Himself allowed the Roman General Titus in AD70 to come to Jerusalem and destroy the Temple and destroy the Levitical priesthood which in effect brought biblical Judaism to an end.

The Temple and the Aaronic priesthood are absolute essentials to biblical Judaism.

There is no hope in Judaism Jason.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I AM the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

HankD

Of coarse I do. Did you also know that some are for men, some for women, and some for priests also? You surely wouldn't keep those pertaining to someone else then or now.

Can you still keep ones like: Don't steal? Don't murder? Don't do incest? Keep the 7th day sabbath?

That isn't judaism, that is written word right there. Judaism is man-made laws added to torah (like every other religion). I agree we don't need it. All we need is the whole of scripture. We are to keep all of His commands we can and believe on His sent one.

There is much hope in that.

 

[Alcott]

I know most people can't understand there are 3 different laws talked about in the NT.

The particular decree Paul was talking about, circumcision-- which of those 3 is that a part of?