Double Predestination

[Saved-By-Grace]

Ezekiel 18:32, "For I have NO PLEASURE in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live.”

The word "pleasure" is from the Hebrew, חָפֵץ, which means, "to desire, will, have pleasure in"

 

[Yeshua1]

is Go

Ezekiel 18:32, "For I have NO PLEASURE in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live.”

The word "pleasure" is from the Hebrew, חָפֵץ, which means, "to desire, will, have pleasure in"

d asking all sinners to turn here, or those He intends to get saved?

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

It is not an abuse it is simply a disagreement on what it means. Abuse gives the connotation that there is intentionality. However, it is an evil doctrine.

When I say "abuse", I mean the "twisting" of the Word of God for other purposes, especially to force the meaning of a word or passage, etc, like κόσμος in John 3:16, where some would force its meaning to "elect".

 

[Yeshua1]

When I say "abuse", I mean the "twisting" of the Word of God for other purposes, especially to force the meaning of a word or passage, etc, like κόσμος in John 3:16, where some would force its meaning to "elect".

is it the determined Will of God then that all sinners get saved?

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

is Go

d asking all sinners to turn here, or those He intends to get saved?

How about the whole Book of Jonah, are you saying that ALL the 1000's in Nineveh were "elect"? They were NON Jews, who could not have been part of God's "elect", which was the nation of Israel

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

is it the determined Will of God then that all sinners get saved?

My response is from Jesus' own words in #97. He says whom He wants to save!

 

[Revmitchell]

When I say "abuse", I mean the "twisting" of the Word of God for other purposes, especially to force the meaning of a word or passage, etc, like κόσμος in John 3:16, where some would force its meaning to "elect".

There is a distinct difference between just being wrong and twisting. Twisting again connotates intentionality.

 

[Yeshua1]

How about the whole Book of Jonah, are you saying that ALL the 1000's in Nineveh were "elect"? They were NON Jews, who could not have been part of God's "elect", which was the nation of Israel

Yes, gentiles were also included evn back in OT times, Galatians 3:8, its just thta they had to become converts to judaism and to Yahweh!

 

[Yeshua1]

My response is from Jesus' own words in #97. He says whom He wants to save!

Romans 9:18

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Romans 9:18

So, were these Jews, who never did repent and accept Jesus, part of the "elect"? Is there any evidence from the Gospels that they were "elect"? Did not Jesus say to them that they were of their father the devil?

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Yes, gentiles were also included evn back in OT times, Galatians 3:8, its just thta they had to become converts to judaism and to Yahweh!

a whole city? Are you saying all these 100,000's of people were "elect"?

 

[Yeshua1]

So, were these Jews, who never did repent and accept Jesus, part of the "elect"? Is there any evidence from the Gospels that they were "elect"? Did not Jesus say to them that they were of their father the devil?

God stated that there was a faitrhul remnant that he had chosen out of israel, correct?

 

[Yeshua1]

a whole city? Are you saying all these 100,000's of people were "elect"?

Whoever turned to the Lord of the jews were!

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Whoever turned to the Lord of the jews were!

These people were NOT Jews!

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

God stated that there was a faitrhul remnant that he had chosen out of israel, correct?

Jesus desired those He spoke to in John chapter 5, to repent and be saved. This is what the account says, and they wanted to murder Him!

 

[Yeshua1]

These people were NOT Jews!

I stated whoever aming the Gentiles turned to the God of israel under the OT were indeed the called of God!

 

[Yeshua1]

Jesus desired those He spoke to in John chapter 5, to repent and be saved. This is what the account says, and they wanted to murder Him!

Those He came to save were those of His own flock, His own sheep!

 

[1689Dave]

Here's something to think about concerning double predestination.

John in Revelation 13:8 says God wrote the names of the elect in the Book of Life before the foundation of the world. And science tells us each person is a combination of 1 in a million or so sperm cells coming into contact with 1 in a million or so ovum. Each at the right time and place under the right conditions. And that any different combination would result in a different person being born. This also aligns with the Traducian theory of procreation in the Bible where souls are in the loins of the progenitor.

And then, imagine every progenitor in your family tree being necessary for your existence. Had any single person along the way been different, all from that point on would be a different person. And you would not exist.

So in order for you to exist, each union of each sperm and ovum in your family tree must have fallen out precisely according to God's plan. Every free choice in marriage partners, including the events leading up to the moment of conception. Or every evil act as in the case of David and Bathsheba that ultimately produced Jesus. Or accidents, wars, diseases and violent deaths, and so on, must be under God's direct control. And all falling out according to his eternal decree for you to be reading this now.

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Here's something to think about concerning double predestination.

John in Revelation 13:8 says God wrote the names of the elect in the Book of Life before the foundation of the world. And science tells us each person is a combination of 1 in a million or so sperm cells coming into contact with 1 in a million or so ovum. Each at the right time and place under the right conditions. And that any different combination would result in a different person being born. This also aligns with the Traducian theory of procreation in the Bible where souls are in the loins of the progenitor.

And then, imagine every progenitor in your family tree being necessary for your existence. Had any single person along the way been different, all from that point on would be a different person. And you would not exist.

So in order for you to exist, each union of each sperm and ovum in your family tree must have fallen out precisely according to God's plan. Every free choice in marriage partners, including the events leading up to the moment of conception. Or every evil act as in the case of David and Bathsheba that ultimately produced Jesus. Or accidents, wars, diseases and violent deaths, and so on, must be under God's direct control. And all falling out according to his eternal decree for you to be reading this now.

and how does any of what you have said, have anything to do with "double predestination"? Are you suggesting that God actively sends the lost sinners to hell?

 

[1689Dave]

and how does any of what you have said, have anything to do with "double predestination"? Are you suggesting that God actively sends the lost sinners to hell?

Yes.