Dr. Graham answered my letter

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by Pastor Larry:
What he has done is more on the line of fellowshipping with the Pharisees. If all Graham did was hang around with the sinners, I would have no problem. But he joined hands in cooperation with false teachers, thus giving credence to them and to their message. Can you imagine Christ having a Pharisee open in prayer at one of his sessions? Can you imagine Christ sending his disciples back to learn and grow at one of their synagogues? I can't ... becuase Scripture gives no example. There is not one iota of biblical evidence for the things that Graham has done in this regard. Let's not confuse it because he is a good man of personal integrity. Let's not get personalities and apparent successes in the way. Let's just look at the facts.

I agree that it is good to question Graham's judgement in sending some folks back to some fundamentalist churches.

About Jesus associating with Pharisees, Nicodemus and Joseph of Arimathea were two Pharisees that Jesus apparently had good relationships with, but probably in secret.

[ June 24, 2005, 09:57 AM: Message edited by: Gold Dragon ]

 

[Jim1999]

Dr. Graham, never was, and never claimed to be a theologian. He is a dedicated believer who reached out to as many as possible with the simple gospel. The real work is in the follow-up and in the counsel rooms after the crusades. If we, as evangelicals, avoid his crusades, then we are the losers.

In the 1955 crusade in Toronto, the Fellowship Baptists gained great numbers because they got involved and partnered people back to their churches. Some opposed, based on the mixed platform, and they gained nought.

The work that goes on as far as a year before the crusade is enormous. People are trained to counsel, and "lead" people to the Lord. In my 50 odd years observing Billy Graham and staff, I never once saw him betray the gospel. His message was clear and simple.

Having said that, I disagreed with his theology, and sharing the platform with liberals, but it was his ministry and not mine, and I would support his ministry to this day.

I further believe there is a time to step aside, and perhaps this is the time. He is making statements that seem out of character. How much of that is due to his age and disease, I cannot say, but I have seen it often as preachers age. We either mellow or get cantakerous, or perhaps a little of both, and we should have the wisdom to step down.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[dianetavegia]

Jim1999!

Dr. Graham, never was, and never claimed to be a theologian. He is a dedicated believer who reached out to as many as possible with the simple gospel. The real work is in the follow-up and in the counsel rooms after the crusades. If we, as evangelicals, avoid his crusades, then we are the losers.

In the 1955 crusade in Toronto, the Fellowship Baptists gained great numbers because they got involved and partnered people back to their churches. Some opposed, based on the mixed platform, and they gained nought.

The work that goes on as far as a year before the crusade is enormous. People are trained to counsel, and "lead" people to the Lord. In my 50 odd years observing Billy Graham and staff, I never once saw him betray the gospel. His message was clear and simple.

So good it deserved to be said twice! AGREE.

As a child and young person, I attended many Billy Graham crusades and sang in the youth choir. Certainly this man has been used by God.

A recent report has said he's made plans for his final revival before retirement. His health has failed greatly and others are in place to carry on.

I say, Well Done Billy Graham! We may not agree on non salvific issues but his gospel message was excellent.

Graham: 'I Look Forward to Death'





By RACHEL ZOLL
AP Religion Writer

NEW YORK (AP) -- An ailing Billy Graham, acknowledging that his life’s work is near its end, said Tuesday that his upcoming revival meeting in New York “will be the last in America, I’m sure.”

The 86-year-old preacher said he is still considering an invitation to preach in November in London, but said his death “could happen any day.”

“I look forward to death,” Graham said, at a news conference ahead of his three-day New York crusade, is set to begin Friday. “I look forward to seeing God face-to-face.”

Graham is suffering from a host of ailments, including hydrocephalus, or fluid on the brain, prostate cancer and told The Associated Press last week that he has been diagnosed with Parkinson’s disease. He uses a walker due to a pelvic fracture last year and had to be guided to his seat by aides before speaking with reporters.

His powerful voice has diminished over the years and his hearing is failing, yet he responded strongly to questions Tuesday. He also showed that his sense of humor remains intact.

Talking about the promise of heaven and, looking at the crush of news photographers surrounding him, Graham said, “I hope I’ll see all of you there. And bring your cameras.”
http://www.11alive.com/life/faith/faith_article.aspx?storyid=65008

“At my age, I have one message and that is that Jesus Christ came, he died on the cross, he rose again and he asks us to repent of our sins,” he said. “We don’t have any possibility of solving our problems today except through Jesus.”

 

[BillyMac]

CNN has been advertising a special program scheduled for this Sunday in the evening I think that features Dr. Graham's life. It may be hosted by Larry King, I don't recall exactly.

 

[TexasSky]

I agree. This is worth quoting. Well said, Jim.

Dr. Graham, never was, and never claimed to be a theologian. He is a dedicated believer who reached out to as many as possible with the simple gospel. The real work is in the follow-up and in the counsel rooms after the crusades. If we, as evangelicals, avoid his crusades, then we are the losers.

In the 1955 crusade in Toronto, the Fellowship Baptists gained great numbers because they got involved and partnered people back to their churches. Some opposed, based on the mixed platform, and they gained nought.

The work that goes on as far as a year before the crusade is enormous. People are trained to counsel, and "lead" people to the Lord. In my 50 odd years observing Billy Graham and staff, I never once saw him betray the gospel. His message was clear and simple.

Having said that, I disagreed with his theology, and sharing the platform with liberals, but it was his ministry and not mine, and I would support his ministry to this day.

I further believe there is a time to step aside, and perhaps this is the time. He is making statements that seem out of character. How much of that is due to his age and disease, I cannot say, but I have seen it often as preachers age. We either mellow or get cantakerous, or perhaps a little of both, and we should have the wisdom to step down.

Cheers,

Jim

....

And Diane,

I believe the New York Crusade begins tonight.
I urge everyone to pray without ceasing - beginning now.

 

[Paul33]

In Christianity Today, Billy Graham admitted that most of those who come forward have not been converted. BG made a distinction between making a decision for Christ and being converted by God. Some do get converted, others begin a process that ends in conversion, yet many others have made what amounts to a "spurious" decision.

God calls us to preach the good news. Conversion is up to God. BG admits this and affirms it.

BG organization comes into a city and says, "This is what I'm going to do and this is what I'm going to preach. If you want to work with me under these conditions, welcome." Now if a liberal lies about his own beliefs and participates with the crusade, is that BG's fault?

It might be. But if someone is truly converted at a BG crusade, is our God so small and impotent that he can't direct that person to a biblical group for discipleship?

Larry's concerns have merit, but in this world there will always be tares mixed in among the wheat.

 

[TexasSky]

Well said Paul.

In reference to the comments regarding the unsaved coming forward during the alter call - every Church, every Church camp, every VBS has had the experience of someone coming forward who is not truly saved. I think almost all have also seen people who, for reasons only they and God understand, fear they will lose their salvation, so they come forward again.
We can't know their heart.

We all say that salvation is up to the Holy Ghost.
Why do we judge men for others making false-confessions?

 

[Paul33]

Billy Graham makes statements on Larry King that are confusing because the issue is complex.

Can a Hindu or Budhist following the light given to him go to heaven? If God wants to manifest himself in a vision to a Hindu or Budhist, it is possible. Because with God everything is possible. BG said that the Hindu could be believing in Jesus without knowing Jesus'name.

BG was allowing for the supernatural power of God to redeem his elect from every nation. Jesus is the only way, and that truth will get to those who are the elect.

Is this confusing and subject to easy misinterpretation? It sure is. Does it sound wrong to "fundamentalist" ears? It sure might.

Can God save or regenerate a baby being baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit? He sure could. Does this sound wrong to "baptist" ears? Absolutely.

But God regenerates through the Holy Spirit on the basis of the blood of Christ. Jesus is the only way, but our "methods" of how we receive that way isn't necessarily "right."

I've been in enough situations where walking the aisle and praying the prayer resulted in the pronouncement of salvation for the individual when it was clear that the person hadn't beed saved after all.

I'm not so confident in my "formula" of salvation any more.

 

[computerjunkie]

Billy Graham gave a press conference in New York this week. Some quotes from the article, sourced below...

In Dr. Graham's press conference he set the tone for the day and the week by opening his remarks with this: "I'm not going to dwell on the problems that face us today, or in my own mind and heart. I'm going to talk about the Gospel of Christ. And I'm going to refuse to answer questions on subjects that maybe 20 years ago I would've answered. Because I think that at my age, I have one message. And that is that Jesus Christ came, he died on a cross, he rose again, and He asks us to repent of our sin, and to receive Him by faith as Lord and Savior. And if we do, we have forgiveness for all of our sins."

--snip--

What Dr. Graham has excelled at is to continually tell of the God who created us – the sin that separates us from that God. And the salvation that is ours if we believe in the Son of God and His mission to come and take our sins upon Him on the cross, die on our behalf, and be resurrected – thus defeating sin's deathly grip.

--snip--

...he holds to the absolute claim that God is the origin of truth, that Scripture is authoritative, and that Jesus Christ is THE truth, THE way, and THE life.

--snip--

...he ended his remarks by telling of which song he hopes ends the weekend crusade that he promised will be his final to be held in America.

"My favorite song of all is the one written by George Beverly Shea, called 'I'd Rather Have Jesus' (than anything) ... because that is what's true for me."

Would it be possible for us, as sisters and brothers in Christ, to minimize what he has said in the past and let his words this week speak for his convictions?

Billy Graham's Unwavering Resolve

 

[gb93433]

Looking back over my 33 years as a Christian I have seen those who do nothing but cause trouble and those who work hard. When I was a college student I was involved in a church that sought to reach every person with the gospel in the city. They tried to enlist several evangelical churches. 30 years later every church that was an evangelical church then and refused to participate is nearly gone today. The church with the most people left is at about 30 percent of what it was then. One of the churches at the time had a lot of people attending and now it is wondering if it will be able to survive. It even has weeds growing in its parking lot.

 

[TexasSky]

I'm waiting for the day when Christians forgive as Christ forgave.

 

[Pastor Larry]

That day is already here for many of us. Why not wait for the day when Christians stand up for the truth without waffling or being worried about offending people?

 

[Paul33]

How about the day when Christians stand up for the truth in love.

 

[Pastor Larry]

Obviously, Paul. I have made that clear several times that standing up for the truth must be done in love. There is no excuse for unloving speech. We must love God and our neighbors enough to stand up for the truth. We do not need to be hateful in our presentation.

 

[TexasSky]

Larry,

The fact is, Graham apologized for the statements of the past. Graham apologized stated that he had reconfirmed that Christ is the only way.

So, why are you, and others, still condemning him? And, if you are still condemning a man that has already done what he can to correct what you call "waffling", where is the forgivness of Christ and the love of Christ?

 

[Pastor Larry]

Graham has not repented for his compromise of hte gospel by joining hands with people who deny the Christ he claims to preach. Graham has not, anywhere that I have seen, repented for saying that there may be more ways to heaven than faith in Christ alone. He has for 50 years set a path from which he has failed to turn. In these, the twilight years of his life, he needs to publicly repent for his compromise and separate himself from these apostates. He needs to immediately remove them from his crusade committees and explain that he was wrong for violating God's command.

To say he "apologized" is inadequate and incorrect. He didn't apologize, and he hans't changed his behavior. I pray that he does. The love of Christ demands that we deal with Graham as an unrepentant brother. We can do no less. If we do not point these problems out, we show that we have no love for the Christ of the true gospel. If we do not point these things out, we show that we have no love for the millions of people who are being affected by Graham's weak and inadequate gospel. To love people who are going to hell means we don't let them believe a false gospel. To love people in teh body of Christ means that we point out disobedience so we can pray and urge them to a place of repentance. Hopefully, Graham will repent before his life is over on this earth.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Pastor Larry, I don't think BG should repent of anything you mentioned because I do not see anything wrong with what he did.

If you truly do think it is wrong and truly love him enough to rebuke him as a brother, I suggest you approach him about it.

In trying to correct his errors, I will pray that both sides will have the humility to listen to God about any errors they may have.

 

[Pastor Larry]

Pastor Larry, I don't think BG should repent of anything you mentioned because I do not see anything wrong with what he did.

How can you not see anything wrong with a direct violation of the commands of Scripture? That is mind-boggling to me. Why are people so scared to call a spade a spade, even when it is Billy Graham?

If you truly do think it is wrong and truly love him enough to rebuke him as a brother, I suggest you approach him about it.

People have approached Graham for more than fifty years. Many of those people were men he highly respected and sought their advice. He rejected it. My comments are not directed so much to Graham as they are to people who are being affected by him. In line with scriptural teaching, I am warning others of Graham's disobedience and compromise. If I am to be obedient to Scripture, I can do no less.

 

[Kiffen]

8 years ago in an interview with Robert Schuller, Graham made some universalist comments that caused an uproar. The letter posted on this thread is almost the same letter that BGEA posted to complainers about his 1997 interview.

I am not a Graham basher and have great respect for him. I think however many have excused his behavior because of his fame or his age, or health. His age and health may be a reason for some of his errant comments but he should realize that and we should not defend those statements. I saw Franklin Graham on Bill O'Reiily the other night make uncompromising statements about Christ being the only way and that Muslims do not worship the God of Christians.

I however saw a portion of the repeat Larry King show with Billy Graham and I was disapointed. I also saw a portion of a Crusade in 1969 when he was 50 where he bodly proclaimed Christ as the only way to Heaven with fiery zeal.

Joel Osteen has been rightly criticized on another thread for almost the same comments Billy Graham made. He however has not had the same defense put up by posters as Dr. Graham has primarily because he is a younger preacher. I will not bash Billy Graham's ministry but I am not going to defend comments that are not excusable.

 

[Gold Dragon]

I do not excuse Graham's statements because he is old or sick or famous. I believe he is right and agree with his statements.