Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
25,000? Um, your numbers are a bit off there...
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Dr. Phil warns about dire health consequences of shutdown
- Thread starter Calminian
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Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Observation
But do you really believe things like drug addiction and alcoholism don't affect others collaterally? All these epidemics have a ripple effect. Right now Trump is building a wall, in part, to slow drug traffic. I support this because I know all men have a sin nature (kids too) and there's no good reason to bombard our country with temptation. I agree, men are responsible for their choices. That doesn't mean we flood them with opportunity, especially considering the impact on kids.
The policies and stances of politicians reflect their character. We know nothing of Trump apart from snapshots in tabloid stories. He's committed sins, we all have. The totality of man should not be determined by snapshots of his public life. How would you fair if your private life was public?
Trump has some very good macro values. Jimmy Carter and Obama seemed to be good men with stable marriages, but their policy stances gave them away. Ultimately, I'm looking for someone that will run on good policy and not flipflop (McCain, Romney). If that's what you're looking for, Trump's our guy. Perfection is a myth.
This is an article from March 30.
Coronavirus causing rise in drug, alcohol relapses among people in recovery, expert says
Coronavirus causing rise in drug, alcohol relapses among people in recovery, expert says
But neither are worth triggering a global economic depression. The question is not whether to respond, but how. Can we do this every time a highly infections virus comes around? I don't think so. We have to put collective minds together and find a better way. When all is said and done, and we see the fallout clearly, I doubt we'll do this again. The only tragedy will be if we learn nothing.
Prove it.
You're right. We need to be ready next time. It didn't help that China lied about it and covered it up for weeks. We will learn from this.
I don't think something like COVID-19 will be a common occurrence. I suppose the next time a pandemic threatens we will immediately go to common sense strategies like frequent hand washing, wearing masks, maybe have older workers work from home, etc. But a shutdown like we just went through? I hope we don't have to do that again.
As I said, we agree on a lot, more than not.
You might find this study below fascinating. It's suggesting this thing is way more more prevalent than thought. 50-80 fold?? 4% of the population?? Can that be right?
Wondering at what point we need to question the effectiveness of the quarantine strategy. I'm not saying there was no benefit, just wondering if there's a better strategy.
Antibody Testing Reveals Coronavirus More Widespread Than Known and Thus Far Less Dangerous Than Expected
The first large-scale test of 3,300 people in a California county revealed that 2.5% to 4.2% of people tested for COVID-19 were positive for antibodies.
The new antibody testing shows the Coronavirus is far more widespread than previously known and thus far less dangerous.
The data indicates that there are between 50 to 80-fold more infections than confirmed cases.
The new antibody testing shows the Coronavirus is far more widespread than previously known and thus far less dangerous.
The data indicates that there are between 50 to 80-fold more infections than confirmed cases.
Scott Downey
Well-Known Member
Probably most of the people who got it thought they had a bad cold or the flu. This virus was circulating on the west coast in December. In Chicago testing, up to 50% of people who came in for antibody testing were positive. Which means they had already gotten it and were fine.As I said, we agree on a lot, more than not.
You might find this study below fascinating. It's suggesting this thing is way more more prevalent than thought. 50-80 fold?? 4% of the population?? Can that be right?
Wondering at what point we need to question the effectiveness of the quarantine strategy. I'm not saying there was no benefit, just wondering if there's a better strategy.
Antibody Testing Reveals Coronavirus More Widespread Than Known and Thus Far Less Dangerous Than Expected
The first large-scale test of 3,300 people in a California county revealed that 2.5% to 4.2% of people tested for COVID-19 were positive for antibodies.
The new antibody testing shows the Coronavirus is far more widespread than previously known and thus far less dangerous.
The data indicates that there are between 50 to 80-fold more infections than confirmed cases.
Flu and covidvirus are a respiratory viral disease, both kill tens of thousands of mostly older people by the same process of pneumonia.
When they get lots more data on the antibody testing they will find this is just a little deadlier than the flu, becuase it is a new virus. But after the people gather their herd immunity, it will, if it comes back next flu season, be just another flu.
AND if the flu was going to kill an older person, so will this virus too, either one can be deadly to older people and some few numbers of young people too. So honestly its not like we are going to see double the deaths from either one as if it is additive in future flu seasons. Death susceptibility to Flu is death susceptibility to covid.
It is good to get an understanding on this new virus, the more we find out, the more we know what will happen.
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Again, the average flu season kills 25,000 Americans in a year. COVID-19 has killed 33,000 in six weeks. [update: 34,575, up from 33,000 since yesterday. But, it's just another flu, right?]
To you that is "just a little bit deadlier than the flu".
To me that is A LOT more deadlier.
Are you guys in denial, or what?!
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Well, this is a disconnect. I'm not aware that the more widespread something is, the less dangerous it is. Can you explain that to me?
You keep going to this ratio thing trying to show that it's really not that dangerous. I keep insisting the raw numbers of deaths prove it is dangerous.
I think the problem is you're in debate mode and not reading posts carefully. He said very clearly that the CV19 is deadly because it's new and the infection rate is super high. Once the antibodies are out in force, it will not be as contagious, and thus just another virus, given the low death ratio. This makes perfect sense. Even you admit, the deadliness of this CV19 is because of the infection rate, not the infection to death ratio. Nobody is disagreeing this is a dangerous situation.
Again, read carefully. I was talking about strategy for dealing with CV19, not the deadlines or seriousness of it. Just because I don't buy into the 6% death-rate nonsense, doesn't mean we disagree on the danger. You're too defensive. We're just talking.
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Wearing masks does not make sense either. It doesn't stop you from getting the virus. Only people who are showing symptoms need to wear masks. Of course, those people shouldn't be in public anyway. We did not have to do the current shutdown. Completely unnecessary. Coronavirus Response: Sweden Has Avoided Isolation and Economic Ruin | National Review
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
And yes, no different than flu. People need to build up immunity. The lockdown are useless.
They are absolutely in denial! This country was locked down for VERY GOOD reason (by now we'd have 10s of millions infected and the hospitals would be overrun without a close down) and yet all these irresponsible crybabies do is complain and try to make lame hyper political arguments like this is just another flu and and people will get depressed if they have to make some sacrifices for others. It is pathetic how little a sacrifice people are willing to make for the good of their country and fellow man today. Too bad we don't have a large group from the WWII era to teach these people what it means to sacrifice for your country.
Trump is doing a great job and will reopen the country when it is safe and as responsibly as possible despite these COVIDIOTS that I guarantee you would be the same one's screaming and crying the loudest that we didn't do enough to stop the spread if it was overrunning their friends and family right now ...or in the future. .
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
You actually don't know that.
Actually, a recent study is suggesting we likely already have 10s of millions infected.
Antibody Testing Reveals Coronavirus 50-85 Times More Widespread Than Previously Known and Thus Far Less Dangerous Than Expected
We're finding antibodies all over the place. Starting to wonder if the mitigation strategy needs to be rethought. I think it was a logical first step. Now we need to get the economy up and running fast.
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Yeah they want to call us COVIDIOTS (which is inappropriate and against site rules) but we aren't the ones denying ACTUAL reality that the virus is not nearly as bad as these alarmists are making it out to be.
The virus is bad because it's new. I can't deny this. The question is, what's the best approach? I pray our leaders continually take in the data and learn. The strategies need to evolve with new information.