Ephesians 2:1-10. What Does Paul Say?

[SavedByGrace]

I am in general agreement with your position, but Luke 13:24 (as elaborated elsewhere to Van) is not a legitimate passage to use for support. The verb ἀγωνίζομαι translates "strive, struggle, make an effort, fight." It is a misunderstanding to interpret the "kingdom of/from heaven" as eternal salvation instead of the promised millennial kingdom, which the Bible manifestly teaches not all resurrected Israelites will automatically enter. Eternal salvation is not something Jesus says we must strive to enter into, while entrance and possession in the millennial kingdom is very much predicated on living faith and obedience on the part of Old Testament saints.

Your comments cannot be serious? I have never read anywhere in the Bible, where anyone speaks of being told about entering the "promised millennial kingdom"! The verb ἀγωνίζομαι is used for a contest, in which much effort is made, and is contrasted with ζητέω (seek), which is for a casual desire! Jesus in Matthew, which is the corresponding passage to Luke, says, "13“Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few." (7). Are you saying that "Narrow Way" that Jesus says, "leads to life", is not "eternal life"? Regardless of theology, and any difficulty in the passage in Luke, it is very clear, that the sinner is NOT "passive", as some assume, in their salvation!

 

[canadyjd]

Luke 13:24 is about the Narrow Gate that leads to salvation. Here Jesus responds to the question, "Then one said to Him, “Lord, are there few who are saved?” (verse 23). "Make every effort" on your part, says Jesus! Does this sound to you, that the sinner is "passive" in their salvation? simple yes or no will do. Thanks

Just to be clear, I do not believe a person is “passive in their salvation”. They are passive, per the passage you quoted, in being “made alive”.

God Holy Spirit changes our nature that we can understand our sinfulness and need for a Savior as well as the truth of the gospel. The person responds (active participation) with repentance and faith in Jesus. At that point, they receive indwelling Holy Spirit and are saved.

peace to you

 

[SavedByGrace]

My question is: Do you believe the command of God to strive for salvation necessarily means the ability to strive for salvation?

peace to you

YES! If it does not, then Jesus' own words in Luke with Matthew 7:13-14, are completely without any meaning!

 

[SavedByGrace]

Just to be clear, I do not believe a person is “passive in their salvation”. They are passive, per the passage you quoted, in being “made alive”.

God Holy Spirit changes our nature that we can understand our sinfulness and need for a Savior as well as the truth of the gospel. The person responds (active participation) with repentance and faith in Jesus. At that point, they receive indwelling Holy Spirit and are saved.

peace to you

If the sinner were "passive" in their own salvation, there the call to action, in "repentance and faith", would be meaningless!

 

[AustinC]

for those "reformed" who have this unbiblical view, that the sinner does nothing for their salvation. And that God has first to "enable" them to then call on Him. I answer from one Scripture passage from the Lord's own words:

"Strive to enter through the narrow door. For many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able" Luke 13:24

Literally, "make every effort", etc. WHO is this addressed to? God? or to the sinful human race? WHY would the Lord ask the sinner to MAKE EVERY EFFORT to enter heaven, if it has all already been done for them? Reformed Soteriology is NOT what the Bible actually teaches, but a grave error from the devil!

This is addressed to Israel, the chosen people of God, whom Jesus came to call them back to God. They would not repent. God has subsequently chosen people of the promise based on his new covenant, not based on the Mosaic covenant. (Perhaps you do not grasp that God is a covenant making God.)

Galatians 3:7-29
Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham. And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you shall all the nations be blessed.” So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith. For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.” But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.” Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith. To give a human example, brothers:even with a man-made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified. Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ. This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void. For if the inheritance comes by the law, it no longer comes by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by a promise. Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, until the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made, and it was put in place through angels by an intermediary. Now an intermediary implies more than one, but God is one. Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.

Did we receive the Spirit of God through repentance, sbg? What does God tell us in this passage?

 

[SavedByGrace]

This is addressed to Israel, the chosen people of God, whom Jesus came to call them back to God. They would not repent. God has subsequently chosen people of the promise based on his new covenant, not based on the Mosaic covenant. (Perhaps you do not grasp that God is a covenant making God.)

Galatians 3:7-29
Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham. And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you shall all the nations be blessed.” So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith. For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.” But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.” Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith. To give a human example, brothers:even with a man-made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified. Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ. This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void. For if the inheritance comes by the law, it no longer comes by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by a promise. Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, until the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made, and it was put in place through angels by an intermediary. Now an intermediary implies more than one, but God is one. Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.

Did we receive the Spirit of God through repentance, sbg? What does God tell us in this passage?

I think that you are BLINDED by your "reformed" teachings! What utter rubbish, "This is addressed to Israel, the chosen people of God". You get worse in your understanding! Matthew 7, says, ""13“Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.". is this also only to Israel? then maybe the Command by Jesus in John chapter 3, to be BORN AGAIN, is ONLY for Nicodemus!!!

 

[canadyjd]

YES! If it does not, then Jesus' own words in Luke with Matthew 7:13-14, are completely without any meaning!

Throughout the OT, God commanded people to keep the Law. Paul tells us no one was ever saved by keeping the Law. They all failed, even though God commanded them to do it. Clearly they were unable to keep the Law. So clearly, God demanded people do something they were not capable of doing: i.e. keeping the Law.

In Mark 10, a man comes to Jesus asking what he must do to inherit eternal life. Jesus points him to the Law, even though he was unable to keep the Law. Why did Jesus point him to the Law, knowing he was unable to keep the Law?

The disciples then ask “who can be saved?”, Jesus answers that with men it is “impossible”, but with God all things are possible.

So, the thing that is impossible with men (salvation: right relationship with God) is only possible when God is in charge of the saving.

So concerning Jesus telling the disciples to “strive” to enter the narrow gate: that doesn’t necessarily mean they had the ability, absent the intervention of God Holy Spirit.

peace to you

 

[SavedByGrace]

So concerning Jesus telling the disciples to “strive” to enter the narrow gate: that doesn’t necessarily mean they had the ability, absent the intervention of God Holy Spirit.

your assumption!

 

[canadyjd]

your assumption!

Belief based on the evidence of scripture that God has commanded we do things we are not able to do absent His intervention by the enabling grace of God Holy Spirit.

It is only with God that the “impossible” (sinners brought to salvation) is made possible. (Mark 10)

All glory to God!!

peace to you

 

[AustinC]

I think that you are BLINDED by your "reformed" teachings! What utter rubbish, "This is addressed to Israel, the chosen people of God". You get worse in your understanding! Matthew 7, says, ""13“Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.". is this also only to Israel? then maybe the Command by Jesus in John chapter 3, to be BORN AGAIN, is ONLY for Nicodemus!!!

What did Jesus say about why he came?

Matthew 15:22-28
And behold, a Canaanite woman from that region came out and was crying, “Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David; my daughter is severely oppressed by a demon.” But he did not answer her a word. And his disciples came and begged him, saying, “Send her away, for she is crying out after us.” He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” But she came and knelt before him, saying, “Lord, help me.” And he answered, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs.” She said, “Yes, Lord, yet even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters’ table.” Then Jesus answered her, “O woman, great is your faith! Be it done for you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed instantly.

Do you see the context of Jesus ministry or do you choose to stick with your preconceived prejudice?

 

[SavedByGrace]

Belief based on the evidence of scripture that God has commanded we do things we are not able to do absent His intervention by the enabling grace of God Holy Spirit.

It is only with God that the “impossible” (sinners brought to salvation) is made possible. (Mark 10)

All glory to God!!

peace to you

You are still ignoring luke 13. 24

 

[SavedByGrace]

What did Jesus say about why he came?

Matthew 15:22-28
And behold, a Canaanite woman from that region came out and was crying, “Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David; my daughter is severely oppressed by a demon.” But he did not answer her a word. And his disciples came and begged him, saying, “Send her away, for she is crying out after us.” He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” But she came and knelt before him, saying, “Lord, help me.” And he answered, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs.” She said, “Yes, Lord, yet even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters’ table.” Then Jesus answered her, “O woman, great is your faith! Be it done for you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed instantly.

Do you see the context of Jesus ministry or do you choose to stick with your preconceived prejudice?

So Jesus only came to save the Jews?

 

[atpollard]

Will you accept this, or keep playing games by selecting comments that suite your theology?

“In a multitude of counselors there is wisdom.”
I simply offered more expert opinions on the verse you were discussing to seek “wisdom”. I am not swayed by any “appeals to authority” and would not expect you to be either.

In any event, how does the presence or absence of Judas at the last supper effect our understanding of Ephesians 2? You seem to be offering an irrelevant bunny trail to your own topic.

 

[AustinC]

So Jesus only came to save the Jews?

What does Jesus say was his ministry?
What did God prophesy about the promised one? From what lineage would he come? To whom would he address his earthly ministry?
sbg, are you unread in the Old Testament? Am I speaking of things in which you have no knowledge?

 

[SavedByGrace]

“In a multitude of counselors there is wisdom.”
I simply offered more expert opinions on the verse you were discussing to seek “wisdom”. I am not swayed by any “appeals to authority” and would not expect you to be either.

In any event, how does the presence or absence of Judas at the last supper effect our understanding of Ephesians 2? You seem to be offering an irrelevant bunny trail to your own topic.

You keep on quoting from reformed works that are clearly biased. I asked if you will accept what Matthew Henry says on Judas taking the Lords Supper. Do you?

 

[SavedByGrace]

What does Jesus say was his ministry?
What did God prophesy about the promised one? From what lineage would he come? To whom would he address his earthly ministry?
sbg, are you unread in the Old Testament? Am I speaking of things in which you have no knowledge?

So Jesus did not die for any Gentiles?

 

[AustinC]

You keep on quoting from reformed works that are clearly biased. I asked if you will accept what Matthew Henry says on Judas taking the Lords Supper. Do you?

What does Matthew Henry say that is so significant to your prejudice?

 

[SavedByGrace]

What does Matthew Henry say that is so significant to your prejudice?

How can you call truth prejudice? You are blinded to your pet theology

I don't think I can waste any more time with you

 

[AustinC]

So Jesus did not die for any Gentiles?

What does Jesus say about his ministry and to whom he was addressing?
Who is the lost sheep of Israel?

Romans 9:1-24
I am speaking the truth in Christ—I am not lying; my conscience bears me witness in the Holy Spirit— that I have great sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart. For I could wish that I myself were accursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brothers, my kinsmen according to the flesh. They are Israelites, and to them belong the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the worship, and the promises. To them belong the patriarchs, and from their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ, who is God over all, blessed forever. Amen. But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel, and not all are children of Abraham because they are his offspring, but “Through Isaac shall your offspring be named.” This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring. For this is what the promise said: “About this time next year I will return, and Sarah shall have a son.” And not only so, but also when Rebekah had conceived children by one man, our forefather Isaac, though they were not yet born and had done nothing either good or bad—in order that God’s purpose of election might continue, not because of works but because of him who calls— she was told, “The older will serve the younger.” As it is written, “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.” What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means! For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills. You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?

sbg, I recognize you have been taught a prejudiced opinion about God's means of redemption. You insist upon something that you have taken out of context as a human required action before God can redeem that human. Yet, I and others provide passages from God's word as a gracious correction to your legalism. Still you persist in your legalism and somehow imagine you understand grace. Sadly, you view works as though it were grace. It seems that God, at this present time has ordained your stumbling block. He is your Father. He is more than capable of correcting your error.

Peace

 

[AustinC]

How can you call truth prejudice? You are blinded to your pet theology

I don't think I can waste any more time with you

I have provided many Bible passages. You have clung to a couple sentences. Look at your own response to many who have graciously corrected you. You are fighting on an island of one.