Exposing False teaching about Jesus Christ !

[PreachTony]

Is that what you call 1 Pet 2:24, my idea ? I thought it was scripture, the word of God !

Not what I meant. I was referring to your continual copy-and-paste of the same phrase. Even though Bro. Willis has explained to you what he meant, you continue to try to snow him under by using the same phrase. I agree with him, and neither one of us are saying Christ's death was ineffective. We're just pointing out that the death alone is not the stopping point. It also took His resurrection and ascension to complete our salvation.

 

[convicted1]

Not what I meant. I was referring to your continual copy-and-paste of the same phrase. Even though Bro. Willis has explained to you what he meant, you continue to try to snow him under by using the same phrase. I agree with him, and neither one of us are saying Christ's death was ineffective. We're just pointing out that the death alone is not the stopping point. It also took His resurrection and ascension to complete our salvation.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbs::thumbsup:

 

[savedbymercy]

pt

Not what I meant.

Well thats the scripture I use to show that Christ's Death alone brings about the Salvation of those He died for. Thats what its teaches 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Thats always an appropriate scripture that condemns heretics who say that Christ,'s death did not save anyone ! It makes them a Liar ! Yeah I am going to stick by it, you dont like it ?

 

[savedbymercy]

Pt

neither one of us are saying Christ's death was ineffective.

Yes you are. Do you believe that the Death of Christ alone will effect the Salvation for all whom He died without exception ? Yes or No ?

 

[convicted1]

Is anyone saved if Christ be not risen?

 

[PreachTony]

Well thats the scripture I use to show that Christ's Death alone brings about the Salvation of those He died for. Thats what its teaches 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Thats always an appropriate scripture that condemns heretics who say that Christ,'s death did not save anyone ! It makes them a Liar ! Yeah I am going to stick by it, you dont like it ?

Scripture does not contradict itself, and Paul wrote to the Corinthians that our faith is in vain if Christ is not risen. We are saved by grace through FAITH, and if our faith is vain without the resurrection, then it kinda proves the necessity of the resurrection for our salvation. If the death alone was enough to save us then the OT system could've continued. But the writer of Hebrews explains that Christ was a change in the Priesthood, and a change in the Priesthood of necessity brings about a change in the Law, ergo, the OT system of sacrifice was not good enough. As the scripture said, Christ is the mediator of the a new covenant, speaking better things than Abel (who was recorded as offering blood sacrifice for atonement of sin).

 

[savedbymercy]

pt

Scripture does not contradict itself,

Who said it did ? Thats more evasiveness from the Point made by 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Peter teaches that Christ's Death effected their Salvation ! Do you believe it ! Yes or No !

 

[PreachTony]

Who said it did ? Thats more evasiveness from the Point made by 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

No, it's not evasive. You are saying the death alone was enough to save. If that's true, then why did Paul say that our faith is vain if Christ is not risen?

Paul is, in effect, saying that our faith is valid because of the resurrection. It is in this resurrection that we see the symbol of our own pending resurrection, should the Lord tarry His coming long enough that we meet the physical death. Our outward symbol of our closeness to Christ upon salvation does not come from performing a task similar to hanging on a cross, but rather from performing a task similar to being buried and rising again (baptism).

Yes, we are healed by His stripes. Yes, the blood He shed on Calvary was shed for the remission of sins. But our hope lies in His resurrection, and how it shows us that He claimed victory over Death, Hell, and the Grave for us.

Peter teaches that Christ's Death effected their Salvation ! Do you believe it ! Yes or No !

Have you stopped beating your wife? Yes or No?

C'mon, SBM, you know better than that. "Yes or No" questions are a sure sign of either trolling or attempting to sidestep a conversation by forcing your opponent to answer in a way you set.

 

[savedbymercy]

Is anyone saved if Christ be not risen?

Read the thread, already answered ! You are the one denying that those Christ died for and rose again for their Justification Rom 4:25 are still lost in their sins! You don't believe that Christ death saved them He died for and you deny that His resurrection is the proof!

 

[savedbymercy]

No, it's not evasive. You are saying the death alone was enough to save. If that's true, then why did Paul say that our faith is vain if Christ is not risen?

Paul is, in effect, saying that our faith is valid because of the resurrection. It is in this resurrection that we see the symbol of our own pending resurrection, should the Lord tarry His coming long enough that we meet the physical death. Our outward symbol of our closeness to Christ upon salvation does not come from performing a task similar to hanging on a cross, but rather from performing a task similar to being buried and rising again (baptism).

Yes, we are healed by His stripes. Yes, the blood He shed on Calvary was shed for the remission of sins. But our hope lies in His resurrection, and how it shows us that He claimed victory over Death, Hell, and the Grave for us.


Have you stopped beating your wife? Yes or No?

C'mon, SBM, you know better than that. "Yes or No" questions are a sure sign of either trolling or attempting to sidestep a conversation by forcing your opponent to answer in a way you set.

Where did I say scripture contradicted itself? Yes or No, Do you believe that Christ death alone effected the salvation of those He died for?

 

[PreachTony]

Where did I say scripture contradicted itself? Yes or No, Do you believe that Christ death alone effected the salvation of those He died for?

This is not as simple as "Yes or No," so the sooner you get off that dead horse the better. This is deep spiritual stuff we're talking about.

The death of Christ on the cross offer atonement for us, as His shed blood came for the remission of sins. Just as the lambs sacrificed under the old covenant brought atonement and remission. Only those were temporary, as the lamb of the old covenant could not pick back up its life. Christ could pick back up His life, and He did so, coming out of the grave victorious. Had he stayed in the grave, our faith would be in vain, per Paul's epistle to Corinth.

If our faith is in vain, then are we truly saved? I would argue NO, ergo it took more than just the death on the cross. This is not to discount the death on the cross, as it was absolutely necessary. But the resurrection was equally necessary in securing salvation.

 

[savedbymercy]

This is not as simple as "Yes or No," so the sooner you get off that dead horse the better. This is deep spiritual stuff we're talking about.

The death of Christ on the cross offer atonement for us, as His shed blood came for the remission of sins. Just as the lambs sacrificed under the old covenant brought atonement and remission. Only those were temporary, as the lamb of the old covenant could not pick back up its life. Christ could pick back up His life, and He did so, coming out of the grave victorious. Had he stayed in the grave, our faith would be in vain, per Paul's epistle to Corinth.

If our faith is in vain, then are we truly saved? I would argue NO, ergo it took more than just the death on the cross. This is not to discount the death on the cross, as it was absolutely necessary. But the resurrection was equally necessary in securing salvation.

It is a simple yes or no, scripture states it! 1 Peter 2:24 states that they were healed /saved by Christ stripes! Do you know what Stripes stand for here?

 

[robustheologian]

You are just as bad as the other one is. The Death of Christ alone actually saved those He died for from the penalty of their sins as well as is the meritorious cause for all subsequent savings !

You just evaded the latter part of my post. Do you even understand what I wrote? If so, show me you understand my points by explaining it back to me so we can discuss them.

 

[savedbymercy]

You just evaded the latter part of my post. Do you even understand what I wrote? If so, show me you understand my points by explaining it back to me so we can discuss them.

You are just as bad as the other one is. The Death of Christ alone actually saved those He died for from the penalty of their sins as well as is the meritorious cause for all subsequent savings !

That was my response. Remember you have denied the fact that Christ's Death actually saved those He died for, and you attributed it to the Spirit. Thats a Lie ! The Spirit's Work is an answer to the Saving death of Christ. In other words, If Christ's Death was not the Meritorious Cause of ones Salvation, the Spirit would have no cause to give Life ! The Spirit's work is the Application of Christ's Saving Work. However, the Spirits Work did not save anyone from the Penalty of their sins , Christ's Death alone did that. His Job is to reveal the Things of Christ's Saving Accomplishment to the Redeemed, Reconciled sinner Jn 16:14

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

The Spirits role is subordinate to the actual Saving Death of Christ and accompanies it as the Fruit of Christ's Death !

So you are still guilty of speaking against the Saving Merit of Christ's Death, and 1 Pet 2:24 which so vividly states that Christ's death/ stripes effected their Salvation !

Now when you respond to this post be prepared to explain back to me all these points I took time to make in your response !

 

[PreachTony]

You are just as bad as the other one is. The Death of Christ alone actually saved those He died for from the penalty of their sins as well as is the meritorious cause for all subsequent savings !

That was my response. Remember you have denied the fact that Christ's Death actually saved those He died for, and you attributed it to the Spirit. Thats a Lie ! The Spirit's Work is an answer to the Saving death of Christ. In other words, If Christ's Death was not the Meritorious Cause of ones Salvation, the Spirit would have no cause to give Life ! The Spirit's work is the Application of Christ's Saving Work. However, the Spirits Work did not save anyone from the Penalty of their sins , Christ's Death alone did that. His Job is to reveal the Things of Christ's Saving Accomplishment to the Redeemed, Reconciled sinner Jn 16:14

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

The Spirits role is subordinate to the actual Saving Death of Christ and accompanies it as the Fruit of Christ's Death !

So you are still guilty of speaking against the Saving Merit of Christ's Death, and 1 Pet 2:24 which so vividly states that Christ's death/ stripes effected their Salvation !

Now when you respond to this post be prepared to explain back to me all these points I took time to make in your response !

So what did Paul mean when he wrote if Christ was not rise our faith is vain?

 

[robustheologian]

You are just as bad as the other one is. The Death of Christ alone actually saved those He died for from the penalty of their sins as well as is the meritorious cause for all subsequent savings !

That was my response. Remember you have denied the fact that Christ's Death actually saved those He died for, and you attributed it to the Spirit. Thats a Lie ! The Spirit's Work is an answer to the Saving death of Christ. In other words, If Christ's Death was not the Meritorious Cause of ones Salvation, the Spirit would have no cause to give Life ! The Spirit's work is the Application of Christ's Saving Work. However, the Spirits Work did not save anyone from the Penalty of their sins , Christ's Death alone did that. His Job is to reveal the Things of Christ's Saving Accomplishment to the Redeemed, Reconciled sinner Jn 16:14

14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

The Spirits role is subordinate to the actual Saving Death of Christ and accompanies it as the Fruit of Christ's Death !

So you are still guilty of speaking against the Saving Merit of Christ's Death, and 1 Pet 2:24 which so vividly states that Christ's death/ stripes effected their Salvation !

Now when you respond to this post be prepared to explain back to me all these points I took time to make in your response !

You just evaded the latter part of my post. Do you even understand what I wrote? If so, show me you understand my points by explaining it back to me so we can discuss them.

You haven't shown me you understood my points. If you did, tell me what they are. I would like to debate them with you. Are you going to show me you understand my points so we can discuss them or are you going to evade them?

 

[savedbymercy]

So what did Paul mean when he wrote if Christ was not rise our faith is vain?

You have evaded my points!

 

[savedbymercy]

You haven't shown me you understood my points. If you did, tell me what they are. I would like to debate them with you. Are you going to show me you understand my points so we can discuss them or are you going to evade them?

Then you lack understanding and this debate is over your head! The Death of Christ effected Salvation for them He died for! The Spirit's Work with in Saving is the fruit of Christ's death actually saving!

You are still in denial of Christ's death actually saving them He died for, which is Blasphemy!

 

[PreachTony]

You have evaded my points!

You don't want discussion and debate, you just want people to repeat what you say. You evade almost every question posed to you. You start more rabbit trails than all the people you've accused of rabbit trails combined.:BangHead:

 

[savedbymercy]

You don't want discussion and debate, you just want people to repeat what you say. You evade almost every question posed to you. You start more rabbit trails than all the people you've accused of rabbit trails combined.:BangHead:

You have evaded my points to debate! Explain the points I made you want to debate?