Now I see why you are not married.
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Family Planning
- Thread starter Salty
- Start date
I'm with Steven on this issue. And dealing with Infertility has made me even more so in the camp that couples should not be preventing children. I very much view it as a trust issue, as the Bible is very clear that it is God that opens and closes wombs. It has been amazing to me the things people in church will say that show a very low regard for children. I was holding one of my friends infant son, and another gal came up to me and said, careful you know that is contagious. And then there is the don't drink the water comments as well when a lot of women announce their pregnancies. I see red when people say these things as it ignores the blessing that children are, and is a slap in the face to those of us who pray day and night for a child.
Well, it took two years of trying to conceive our first. He miscarried. We then had a healthy boy. Then another miscarriage. Then another healthy boy. Then a vasectomy. I thank the Lord for the two sons I have on Earth and the two I will meet in heaven. There is a point that you say enough. One of my friends, who is a SBC pastor has 13 kids. He raised the first three of them and just kind of let the last 10 do whatever. He is on track for having three good kids and 10 convicts.
Does family planning only involve preventing children being born? Doesn't it include planning to have children?
I did not use the term "family planning" in my post at all. I said exactly what I meant and I what I truly am convicted about. Couples should not be preventing children. As anyone who is dealing with infertility knows "planning" to have kids is the easy part, actually having that "plan" come to fruition is hard painful, emotional, crazy, and sometimes never happens. And no amount of people telling them about their sisters, friends, roommates, cousin neighbors daughter who tried for x years and now has y kids makes it any easier. This is an area that the american church is failing in which is tragic given how many couples in the Bible dealt with the issue of infertility. But that is another subject. I just wanted to voice my support for Steven's views.
You say it better than I could ever say it myself. I will stop using "family planning" and say the truth you have given us. Couples should not be preventing children. It has far more power to it than anything in my academic jargon.
Now I see why you are not married.
TCassidy I know that is a joke, but that actually really hurt because I have been looking for a godly woman for a long time. Just saying, that if the guy is 33 and single and wants a ton of children, it probably speaks to looking but not finding. I would love to find a solid fundamentalist woman who wants a big family. Most big family type girls usually agree with me on preventing children too. The problem is I just can't seem to find someone at church or at other churches I go to like First Baptist Orlando, which I did looking for Christian singles.
I avoid euphemism around this issue as I find all of them offensive. The one that makes me the most angry is "reproductive health" as that is just a nice way of saying baby killing, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with the health of anyone's reproductive system.
Yeah, I absolutely agree on "reproductive health." For me, since I have a mental illness, it also speaks to me of the type of eugenics and castration used back in the day against the disabled to keep them from having children.
Uh, "Family Planning" is the title of the thread. In that context you only spoke of preventing children. You did not address planning to have children. I was just wondering if you only attribute the thread title to negative planning.
I know its the title of the thread. It was also clear in this tread that what was really being discussed was preventing children through birth control methods. Even before getting married I was totally against birth control, and now having dealt with infertility I'm even more against it then I was. As I said earlier to me it is a trust issue, as the Bible is clear that God is the one that opens and closes wombs. I Trust God in my infertility, and if He ever does bless us with children I will trust Him with the number. As far as "planning" on having children, I read or heard a pastor say (can't remember who at the moment) that "if you plan to get married, plan to have children." Besides I would think the inverse of my statement, that couple should not prevent children, would be fairly obvious.Uh, "Family Planning" is the title of the thread. In that context you only spoke of preventing children. You did not address planning to have children. I was just wondering if you only attribute the thread title to negative planning.
My intent was not to hurt but to point out why you may be having trouble finding a wife.
Earlier you said you would not allow your church to cross your red line. I suggested you allow the church to make sure you don't cross their red line.
Now you say that, if a woman does not agree with you that you would not consider marrying her. You seem to be saying in order to marry her she would have to toe your red line. What you have to understand is that she will not see that as unconditional love. You will only love her if she is subjected entirely to you and your (often changing) theological opinions.
Marriage is not about "Me Tarzan, you Jane." Marriage is a Complementarian relationship. Husbands and wives are allowed to have differences as long as those differences complement each other.
Rather than demanding a prospective wife not cross any of your (constantly changing) red lines, it is probably better to allow her to state her stance and ascertain what you can live with without compromising your convictions.
In order to have a good marriage (and my wife and I have been married for 42 years and in all that time we have never had a fight) you have to love her more than you love your red lines.
Not by me. I was discussing the thread title, "Family Planning."
You certainly didn't make it all that obvious.
Well let me help you out then:
Bolds are mine
It is in that context with all the above posting that I made my very clear statement that Couple should not prevent children.
Funny that out of everyone that talked about "family planning" in the negative sense you only asked me if I only viewed it in that way. Steven who this very thread was started about clearly defined his term as avoiding children.
Well let me help you out again. If Couple should not prevent children the inverse is Couples should try to have children.You certainly didn't make it all that obvious.
Now I would like to point out that I said TRY, not must have children as clearly as shown in multiple places in the Bible (Sarah, Rebekah, Rachel, Hannah, Elizabeth etc) God is the one that opens and closes wombs and couples can Trust in Him to do Good by them.
Hmm, my wife and I have had 11 children (all natural births - no adoptions) obviously we didn't "plan" one way or another.
It makes sense though since I am a former Catholic and she is a former Mormon
(at least that is what we tell folks who want to know - why so many!?).
HankD
It makes sense though since I am a former Catholic and she is a former Mormon
(at least that is what we tell folks who want to know - why so many!?).
HankD
I don't need your help. The name of the thread is still "Family Planning."
I still don't need your help. And the name of the thread is still "Family Planning."
And the OP and the Person the thread that this is about and the dictionary all view it in a negative light.I don't need your help. The name of the thread is still "Family Planning."
I still don't need your help. And the name of the thread is still "Family Planning."
So my question to you are you going to question all the people I quoted, or are you just going to continue to go after the infertile women who prays day and night for children for not "planning" on kids.
TCassidy would probably say the reason that he went after you and not other posters who share your interpretation is because you are the first one to not use the term family planning even though preventing children is clearly what is being talked about. I do find it odd that TCassidy does not call Steven out when he agrees with you that family planning is a euphemism for preventing children as shown in this quote.
So, TCassidy, are you going to expand your targeting to Steven since he agrees with blessedwife or are you going to continue to target a single person like so many bullies I have seen in my life? Does anyone think I am off base in calling TCassidy a bully? If you do, feel free to reply to this post with your reason for disagreeing. I realize that calling TCassidy a bully is off topic so maybe I should start a new thread about it.
This post will at the very least get me a warning and will probably get me banned but, TCassidy is abusing his power as an administrator and someone has to say something. So TCassidy, what are you going to do? Are you going to ban me and in so doing prove someone you you hold in contempt to be right?
Well Tendor you will be missed on this board even though you have not posted in a while. It is nice to see that I'm not the only one who felt that I was the only target in this thread for refusing to use euphemisms about preventing Children. Your defense is appreciated for however long it stays up.TCassidy would probably say the reason that he went after you and not other posters who share your interpretation is because you are the first one to not use the term family planning even though preventing children is clearly what is being talked about. I do find it odd that TCassidy does not call Steven out when he agrees with you that family planning is a euphemism for preventing children as shown in this quote.
So, TCassidy, are you going to expand your targeting to Steven since he agrees with blessedwife or are you going to continue to target a single person like so many bullies I have seen in my life? Does anyone think I am off base in calling TCassidy a bully? If you do, feel free to reply to this post with your reason for disagreeing. I realize that calling TCassidy a bully is off topic so maybe I should start a new thread about it.
My poor husband had to deal with my ranting about this thread and how much red I was seeing to see such a cavalier attitude toward having children and outright attacks on an infertile women. His response was pretty pithy but would violate TOS if I quoted him. Anyways I appreciate your defense of me.
I knew I should not have stepped foot in this thread but I just could not stand by and watch the cavalier attitude continue. It was just one more thing to add to my ever growing list of how infertility is mishandled by the American Church as a whole.
Thanks again and I'm glad I was able to see this before it most likely disappears.
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