Foreknowledge

God hates

God sent His Son into the world because He loves them, even those that will never believe.

They have a same chance as you do to believe, God has not excluded any one from the gift.

If they do not come it is because the ones He sent out did not Go to them to bring the good news or they heard the message and walked away.

God wants all men to be saved and come to the knowlefdge of the truth.

 

That kinda blows your "God has to be fair" theory.

 

Does God foreknow who will believe? Yes. Does God allow those who He knows will never believe come into existence? Yes. Kinda blows your theory too Psalms.

 

Sure it changes everything of what you said if God sees their unbelief the same time He allowed them to come into existence.
To God, it all happened at once not in time as you are looking at it.

 

He elects some and passes over others... according to His own will. They do have a choice in the matter. Those He elects will choose to come.... John 6:37 Those He passes over will not come. Romans 3:11 John 8:43-44 Mark 4:11-12 and many others. They act according to their nature and choose according to their nature. They are by nature children of wrath. They are not born again.

 

I'm interested Bob. Tell me how.

 

(believe me, and understand that I am he)
This is not the same as "having belief in the Lord Jesus Christ". These people were already Israel and were already God's chosen people. God just wanted them to believe that it was Him that was amongst them at that moment. A big difference than that to believe for Salvation.

 

He still sees their unbelief and still allows them to come into existence, knowing they will never believe. He still sends them to hell. Changes nothing. Unless He loves those He sends to hell.

 

You are looking at it in time but God saw it all at once and not in time. He saw more than that. He saw our death, those in hell, Resurrection, our being Glorified and redeemed from the earth all at once and not in time as you speak of it. You say sends them to Hell but again He sees all at once their unbelief, their being in Hell, the end. You try to be the mind of God and you can't.

 

Ahhhh....... keys sticking again bob? You are trying to say God could not see before they were brought into existence? God sees and is present in all time bob. He knew before they existed that they would not believe. You can't wriggle out of that.

 

I really think you need to read the post again reformed. You are trying to place God in time.

 

What? Did you change it again?

 

I don't bind God to any time. He foreknows all things. He is present in all time. He is present outside time. Does not change the fact that He knows before He allows to come into existence. No matter what you say bob.

 

scripture

If the ones that would not believe did not come into existant then the one that will come through that person seed that will believe would not come into existance, you are trying to just let me see a small picture, without looking at the big one.

God uses us all to complete His will, even those who will never believe.

We are not to lean on our own understanding but trust in our Lord Jesus Christ and He will direct our paths

 

I am saying He saw it reformed as He sees all.

You keep saying He allowed them to come into existence but you don't mention what you believe and that is according to your belief He allows them to go to Hell without a choice. At least we say they had a choice to believe.

 

If God sees everything that happens in creation all at once, outside of time, then He is most certainly the ultimate cause of everything in His creation, including sin.

Now, if one wants to postulate that sin exists because God creates and THEN sees everything that happens in His creation all at once, then this contradicts the notion that God is outside of time, since His creation would have to preceed what He knows about His creation. It also contradicts scripture.

It also raises the question: If God creates and THEN sees what happens all at once, which is why sin exists, then why didn't He just uncreate and repeat until He got it right?

 

Another dishonest misrepresentation.

 

You err greatly. Because He sees it don't mean He causes it.

 

Come on reformed. You can say you believe they have a choice all you want but you don't believe they can accept salvation, same thing as no choice IMO.

 

That is your incorrect opinion.... which you are entitled to. They choose according to their nature. They are children of wrath.