From IFB pastor to Athiest

[Salty]

So did this young man who gave a profession of faith at age - 15 -- Was he truly saved -
If he was - even though he claims to be an atheist - will he still be in Heaven?

Bruce Gerencser Blog

This is a lenghty read - but dont skip over any of it - to get the full story.

 

[JPPT1974]

Praying for him to go back to Christ before he leaves this earth or Jesus comes back on the white colt! To get us all. Will leave it at that!

 

[TCassidy]

God alone knows the state of the man's soul and I will leave that judgment up to him.

 

[Salty]

God alone knows the state of the man's soul and I will leave that judgment up to him.

I would agree with you -
The purpose of the thread is to think about the issue.

 

[JonC]

While it is impossible for me to know, I suspect that Mr. Gerencser is a man who came to a particular realization prior to hearing those words “I never knew you.” The reason I say this is he presents himself as being indoctrinated rather than converted into the faith. I appreciate his honesty here because I believe it a legitimate issue in how we work with those "born into the church."

As Christians we are, I believe, told to take the man at his words. We judge the fruit, not the heart, and are to treat him as if he is as lost as his profession indicates. We are fruit inspectors - not botanists.

 

[JamesL]

This was posted here a year or so ago....by ? I don't remember

Anywho...
I very much appreciate his distinction between theological fundamentalist and social Fundamentalist

he makes some unwarranted assumptions and runs with them, such as the notion that every Evangelical would agree with the idea that we are to obey everything contained in the Bible.

I know that is the right wing, fanatic, Fundamentalist, legalistic way. However, a true Evangelical who is sharing the good news of the Cross of Christ will recognize that we are not obligated to the Mosaic law.

But I appreciate the man's candor. And I can sympathize with the fact that he was brainwashed by a fundamentalism which does not stand up to scripture

I think he was taught to have unrealistic expectations, and was not able to shake them. And that ultimately shook his faith

I think it would be very interesting to sit across the table from him, maybe a different doctrinal take would have yielded different fruit

 

[Salty]

What is interesting is that over a period of a couple of years - he visted scores of churches - Bap, Protestants, Catholic, Mennonite - Methodist - you name it, he probably attended.
He did not find any that he felt comfortable in.

 

[Rob_BW]

What is interesting is that over a period of a couple of years - he visted scores of churches - Bap, Protestants, Catholic, Mennonite - Methodist - you name it, he probably attended.
He did not find any that he felt comfortable in.

Sounds familiar.

 

[TCassidy]

We judge the fruit, not the heart, and are to treat him as if he is as lost as his profession indicates. We are fruit inspectors - not botanists.

I agree, in this case, that we should take him at his word and treat him as an unbeliever. However, we must also remember that "by their fruits ye shall know them" in Matthew 7 is referring to false prophets. We can know false prophets by their false teaching. But it is a one way street. You cannot tell whether or not a person is saved by his fruit, or lack thereof.

We must remember that we have been given the ministry of reconciliation (2 Corinthians 5:18) not the ministry of judgmentalism (Romans 14:13).

 

[TCassidy]

Sounds familiar.

When a person can't find any church he can agree with and feel comfortable in, we can rest assured the problem is not the churches, it is the person.

 

[Tim71]

I agree, in this case, that we should take him at his word and treat him as an unbeliever. However, we must also remember that "by their fruits ye shall know them" in Matthew 7 is referring to false prophets. We can know false prophets by their false teaching. But it is a one way street. You cannot tell whether or not a person is saved by his fruit, or lack thereof.

We must remember that we have been given the ministry of reconciliation (2 Corinthians 5:18) not the ministry of judgmentalism (Romans 14:13).

If this man is saved. Wouldn't Hebrews chapter 12 vs 5 thru 11 apply? If you're Gods child he going to take you to the wood shed and if you continue in disobedience he will call you home.

 

[evangelist6589]

So did this young man who gave a profession of faith at age - 15 -- Was he truly saved -
If he was - even though he claims to be an atheist - will he still be in Heaven?

Bruce Gerencser Blog

This is a lenghty read - but dont skip over any of it - to get the full story.

False convert who was a victim of the modern gospel message. Refer to Judas and a passage in the Synoptics of the many that will stand before him on the day of judgment.

This is all the more important why we must preach law to the proud and grace for the humble.

 

[JamesL]

False convert who was a victim of the modern gospel message. Refer to Judas and a passage in the Synoptics of the many that will stand before him on the day of judgment.

This is all the more important why we must preach law to the proud and grace for the humble.

I don't think you read any of the post right.

This guy was IFB, so I'm pretty sure he had enough law for 6 false converts

 

[TCassidy]

This is all the more important why we must preach law to the proud and grace for the humble.

You mean like "Thou shalt not commit adultery?"

 

[evangelist6589]

I don't think you read any of the post right.

This guy was IFB, so I'm pretty sure he had enough law for 6 false converts

Not exactly James. IFB are known to preach a easy believism message with much emphasis on the sinners prayer.

 

[annsni]

False convert who was a victim of the modern gospel message. Refer to Judas and a passage in the Synoptics of the many that will stand before him on the day of judgment.

This is all the more important why we must preach law to the proud and grace for the humble.

So it is only in modern times that we have false converts?

 

[annsni]

Not exactly James. IFB are known to preach a easy believism message with much emphasis on the sinners prayer.

But seminary. Does seminary focus on easy believe-ism and the sinner's prayer? Don't you think at some point in there, even if he DID hear a false gospel message, that he heard the gospel in his studies of the Scripture?

 

[Bro. James]

Ain't no atheists in heaven--none headed there either.

Ecumenism is alive and growing on planet Earth.

The Lord knows them that are His, and they are sealed forever.

Now what? Pray for the lost and others deluded.

Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

Bro. James

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

While it is impossible for me to know, I suspect that Mr. Gerencser is a man who came to a particular realization prior to hearing those words “I never knew you.” The reason I say this is he presents himself as being indoctrinated rather than converted into the faith. I appreciate his honesty here because I believe it a legitimate issue in how we work with those "born into the church."

As Christians we are, I believe, told to take the man at his words. We judge the fruit, not the heart, and are to treat him as if he is as lost as his profession indicates. We are fruit inspectors - not botanists.

BINGO!!!!

You also notice that he is enormous! Out of that his health has been affected.

To quote my hero, Reggie Van Gleason......"Boy, are you fat!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Not exactly James. IFB are known to preach a easy believism message with much emphasis on the sinners prayer.

Is that true????