God Did Not Breathe The World Into Existence. He Spoke It.

[canadyjd]

Breathing is never specified in Scriptural text to be speaking.

Heb. 4 Speaks plainly about the Word of God.

"Quick and powerful, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit ... a discerner of the thoughts and intentions of the heart."

2 Tim. 3 Speaks plainly about inspired Scripture.

"Is profitable for doctrine, reproof, correction, instruction in righteousness."

Identical and equal? Does profitability equal quickness/ power/sharpness/piercing(ness)/division/discernment?

So again, you cannot answer directly.

You made the distinction between God-Spoken and God-Breathed, stating that “authority is established” by speaking.

So, I’ll try again. Does “God-Breathed” scripture have authority as God’s Word?

Are you capable of answering directly?

peace to you

 

[Jacob59]

The Word of God (as in scripture) is not spoken by God, rather it is “God-breathed”.

• [2 Timothy 3:16-17 NIV] 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
  
• [1Ki 12:22 NIV] 22 But this word of God came to Shemaiah the man of God:
  
• [1Ch 17:3 NIV] 3 But that night the word of God came to Nathan, saying:
  
• [Luk 3:2 NIV] 2 during the high-priesthood of Annas and Caiaphas, the word of God came to John son of Zechariah in the wilderness.
  
• [Jhn 10:35 NIV] 35 If he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came--and Scripture cannot be set aside--

The word of God “comes” to men ... it is not spoken by God.

So again, you cannot answer directly.

You made the distinction between God-Spoken and God-Breathed, stating that “authority is established” by speaking.

So, I’ll try again. Does “God-Breathed” scripture have authority as God’s Word?

Are you capable of answering directly?

peace to you

Try to relax. This is a discussion dealing with information, rather than with upset demands from you. That should be a comfortable idea for you, as you prayerfully abide in Truth. Since God loves you so much, He will protect your sensitive heart and feelings from insult and injury while reading this.

The answer to your intense question about God Breathed Scripture is in Scripture itself, as you recently learned.

Open again please to 2 Tim. 3:16. "All Scripture is Given by inspiration of God." No place in this 2 Tim. 2 passage, or in the whole of Scripture, states "All God breathed Scripture is the Word of God." Rather, those parts of Scripture which are indeed God's Spoken Word are clearly identified by:

1.) Their placement in The Pentateuch Torah, which is God's verbatim uttered Word through Ezra.
2.) Their authorship by an anointed Old Testament Prophet.
3.) The author stating "Thus saith The Lord," or equivalent.
4.) Jesus Christ citing the text or author.

An example of mere teaching or wisdom would be Paul in Titus stating the Cretians are "liars, evil beasts, slow bellies." He even inserts the words of one of their own godless prophets into his teachings. Nothing there displays the Gospel and Love of Christ unto sinners.

Another clear evidence of Scripture not being God's Word is again by Paul in 2 Cor. 7:12, "Speak I, not the Lord." There are other clear proofs which can be shown. Such as the exclusion of the Book of Enoch, widely read by the Early Church, yet which is greatly quoted in the Book of Jude.

Regards, and Blessings on your sincere heart.

 

[atpollard]

Is breathing equal to speaking?

No.
However part of our point is that NOBODY ever claimed "breathing is equal to speaking" ... so what.

Is roller skating equal to flying a kite?
Is dancing equal to killing a lamb?
Is asking silly questions equal to studying scripture?

 

[atpollard]

God speaks His Word. "Said" is the record of it graciously and accurately provided.

Verse, please?

 

[Yeshua1]

Genesis ch. 1.
#559 amar, "to say, appoint, avouch, boast self, certify, challenge, charge, command, declare, demand, determine, publish, speak, say, verify."

vs. 3 "said."
vs. 6 "said."
vs. 9 "said."
vs. 11 "said."
vs. 14 "said."
vs. 20 "said."
vs. 24 "said."
vs. 26 "said."

The authority of the Word of God is established by His speaking it.

Jesus the eternal Word of Father spoke it into existence

 

[canadyjd]

Try to relax. This is a discussion dealing with information, rather than with upset demands from you. That should be a comfortable idea for you, as you prayerfully abide in Truth. Since God loves you so much, He will protect your sensitive heart and feelings from insult and injury while reading this.

The answer to your intense question about God Breathed Scripture is in Scripture itself, as you recently learned.

Open again please to 2 Tim. 3:16. "All Scripture is Given by inspiration of God." No place in this 2 Tim. 2 passage, or in the whole of Scripture, states "All God breathed Scripture is the Word of God." Rather, those parts of Scripture which are indeed God's Spoken Word are clearly identified by:

1.) Their placement in The Pentateuch Torah, which is God's verbatim uttered Word through Ezra.
2.) Their authorship by an anointed Old Testament Prophet.
3.) The author stating "Thus saith The Lord," or equivalent.
4.) Jesus Christ citing the text or author.

An example of mere teaching or wisdom would be Paul in Titus stating the Cretians are "liars, evil beasts, slow bellies." He even inserts the words of one of their own godless prophets into his teachings. Nothing there displays the Gospel and Love of Christ unto sinners.

Another clear evidence of Scripture not being God's Word is again by Paul in 2 Cor. 7:12, "Speak I, not the Lord." There are other clear proofs which can be shown. Such as the exclusion of the Book of Enoch, widely read by the Early Church, yet which is greatly quoted in the Book of Jude.

Regards, and Blessings on your sincere heart.

The question again, which you cannot answer, is one of authority.

You made the claim that there is a distinction between “God-Spoken” and “God-Breathed” scripture and specifically that “authority is established” with “God-Spoken” scripture.

By making this distinction, you appear to be saying all non “God-Spoken” scripture lacks authority over a Christian’s life.

By doing so, you dismiss most of the Bible as a lesser form of “God’s Word” that can be dismissed and ignored as you see fit.

Even though you are using the same words and phrases common in Christian thought (I.e. scripture, God’s Word, inspiration etc. ) you are so polluting the meaning as to make your arguments full of deceit.

If you truly desired to understand scripture better, there are many Godly women and men on this forum that could help you in that effort.

At this point, I’ve had enough and I’ll leave you do whatever it is you are trying to do.

Thanks for the conversation

peace to you

 

[Yeshua1]

The question again, which you cannot answer, is one of authority.

You made the claim that there is a distinction between “God-Spoken” and “God-Breathed” scripture and specifically that “authority is established” with “God-Spoken” scripture.

By making this distinction, you appear to be saying all non “God-Spoken” scripture lacks authority over a Christian’s life.

By doing so, you dismiss most of the Bible as a lesser form of “God’s Word” that can be dismissed and ignored as you see fit.

Even though you are using the same words and phrases common in Christian thought (I.e. scripture, God’s Word, inspiration etc. ) you are so polluting the meaning as to make your arguments full of deceit.

If you truly desired to understand scripture better, there are many Godly women and men on this forum that could help you in that effort.

At this point, I’ve had enough and I’ll leave you do whatever it is you are trying to do.

Thanks for the conversation

peace to you

He does seem for example to view only portions of the letters of Paul as being inspired!

 

[Jacob59]

No.
However part of our point is that NOBODY ever claimed "breathing is equal to speaking" ... so what.

Is roller skating equal to flying a kite?
Is dancing equal to killing a lamb?
Is asking silly questions equal to studying scripture?

Yes, they do "claim" by rephrasing 2 Tim. 3:16, "Scripture is the inspired Word of God." The text does not say that. Rather, it says "All Scripture is given by the inspiration of God."

 

[Jacob59]

He does seem for example to view only portions of the letters of Paul as being inspired!

There is no "seem." What does Scripture itself say?

"Speak I, not the Lord." Read the English language rather than preacher babble.

 

[Jacob59]

The question again, which you cannot answer, is one of authority.

You made the claim that there is a distinction between “God-Spoken” and “God-Breathed” scripture and specifically that “authority is established” with “God-Spoken” scripture.

By making this distinction, you appear to be saying all non “God-Spoken” scripture lacks authority over a Christian’s life.

By doing so, you dismiss most of the Bible as a lesser form of “God’s Word” that can be dismissed and ignored as you see fit.

Even though you are using the same words and phrases common in Christian thought (I.e. scripture, God’s Word, inspiration etc. ) you are so polluting the meaning as to make your arguments full of deceit.

If you truly desired to understand scripture better, there are many Godly women and men on this forum that could help you in that effort.

At this point, I’ve had enough and I’ll leave you do whatever it is you are trying to do.

Thanks for the conversation

peace to you

Yes, run away. Paul wrote, "Speak I, not the Lord." Was that true? Yes? No? Step up and answer.

 

[atpollard]

[Proverbs 6:16-19 NKJV]
These six [things] the LORD hates, Yes, seven [are] an abomination to Him: A proud look, A lying tongue, Hands that shed innocent blood, A heart that devises wicked plans, Feet that are swift in running to evil, A false witness [who] speaks lies, And one who sows discord among brethren.

 

[canadyjd]

Yes, run away. Paul wrote, "Speak I, not the Lord." Was that true? Yes? No? Step up and answer.

I’ll answer, though I expect you will dismiss all I say into your “pot of soup”, rhetorical device (which you condemn preachers for using but allow for yourself).

In context, Paul has established his authority as an Apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God. (Chapter 1) In Chapter 2, he claims to speak the words of God Holy Spirit and He claims to have the mind of Christ.

He addressed specific questions the Corinthians had asked. By the time we get to chapter 6, he is giving practical advice concerning those issues.

Concerning married Christians, he repeats the commands that Christ gave.

Concerning the issue of a believer married to a non believer (a situation Jesus did not directly address) he uses the phrase “I, not the Lord” which you have quoted out of context in an attempt to make it mean Paul’s words were not authoritative.

Paul gives his advice and urges them to accept it, claiming he had God Holy Spirit indwelling.

Paul is, in fact, claiming his words have the same authority as God because he was appointed an Apostle of Christ by the will of God, he spoke the words of God Holy Spirit, and he had the mind of Christ.

Because of those truths, the writings of Paul have the the same authority of God as when God dictated to Moses the 10 commandments or spoke the world into existence.

That is the testimony of God Himself, recorded in the Bible by men He chose and preserved for Christians to accept as fully authoritative until Christ returns.

Now, I have answered you directly, let’s see how capable you are to answer directly.

You have claimed a distinction between “God-Spoken” and “God-Breathed” scripture, saying “authority is established” by God Speaking.

Do you believe, as I do, that the writings of the Apostle Paul have the same authority as God’s Holy Word as any passage that God dictated in an audible voice directly to a person who then wrote it down.

Yes? No? Step up and answer directly if you are able.

peace to you

 

[Jacob59]

I’ll answer, though I expect you will dismiss all I say into your “pot of soup”, rhetorical device (which you condemn preachers for using but allow for yourself).

In context, Paul has established his authority as an Apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God. (Chapter 1) In Chapter 2, he claims to speak the words of God Holy Spirit and He claims to have the mind of Christ.

He addressed specific questions the Corinthians had asked. By the time we get to chapter 6, he is giving practical advice concerning those issues.

Concerning married Christians, he repeats the commands that Christ gave.

Concerning the issue of a believer married to a non believer (a situation Jesus did not directly address) he uses the phrase “I, not the Lord” which you have quoted out of context in an attempt to make it mean Paul’s words were not authoritative.

Paul gives his advice and urges them to accept it, claiming he had God Holy Spirit indwelling.

Paul is, in fact, claiming his words have the same authority as God because he was appointed an Apostle of Christ by the will of God, he spoke the words of God Holy Spirit, and he had the mind of Christ.

Because of those truths, the writings of Paul have the the same authority of God as when God dictated to Moses the 10 commandments or spoke the world into existence.

That is the testimony of God Himself, recorded in the Bible by men He chose and preserved for Christians to accept as fully authoritative until Christ returns.

Now, I have answered you directly, let’s see how capable you are to answer directly.

You have claimed a distinction between “God-Spoken” and “God-Breathed” scripture, saying “authority is established” by God Speaking.

Do you believe, as I do, that the writings of the Apostle Paul have the same authority as God’s Holy Word as any passage that God dictated in an audible voice directly to a person who then wrote it down.

Yes? No? Step up and answer directly if you are able.

peace to you

Did Jesus speak the doctrine of Women in 1 Tim. 2? He did not.

Paul added his own teachings by stating in vs. 12, "I suffer not a woman to teach." "I" was his source of authority, not Christ.

 

[canadyjd]

Did Jesus speak the doctrine of Women in 1 Tim. 2? He did not.

Paul added his own teachings by stating in vs. 12, "I suffer not a woman to teach." "I" was his source of authority, not Christ.

I took the time to answer you directly. As expected, the answer is... you are unable to answer my question directly.

Paul spoke for God. He was appointed an Apostle by the will of God. He spoke the words of God, Holy Spirit. He possessed the mind of Christ. When he wrote his letters, he was very aware he was speaking God’s Words. His writings have the same authority as God speaking the 10 commandments directly to Moses.

You do not have to agree with me, but at least have the courage to state what you believe directly.

Maybe you can educate me? If I said your posts were “clouds without rain”, they have no real substance, is that a rhetorical device?

If I said your posts were a “clanging gong”: you make a lot of noise but have no discernible meaning, is that a rhetorical device?

You have done nothing but start posts after post attempting to undermine the Word of God.

I see you. I understand you. Ive had enough of you. I’m done with you.

Thanks for the conversation

peace to you

 

[Squire Robertsson]

As the OP is now banned, this thread is closed.