God wants all men to be saved

[Revmitchell]

2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

God does not want just some men but all men to be saved. This scripture is clear and it is a lie straight from the pit of hell that says God does not want all men to be saved but only some men of all nations.

 

[agedman]

2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

God does not want just some men but all men to be saved. This scripture is clear and it is a lie straight from the pit of hell that says God does not want all men to be saved but only some men of all nations.

Should you care to look, the context is the last times when great trouble grieves the church.

It is within that context that believers question the validity of the promise of the return of Christ.

So Peter writes the delay is for the purpose of salvation.

See why? Because He is “longsuffering toward us”. Who is the “us?” Believers.

God desires the “us,” the believers not to die, but repent.

The NASB gives the translation in this manner:

3Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with theirmocking, following after their own lusts, 4and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.” 5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, 6through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water. 7But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.​

8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.​

The “all” is believers, not the unsaved.

Following the personal pronouns does not allow for your view to stand.

 

[Iconoclast]

="Revmitchell,

[2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

God does not want just some men but all men to be saved. This scripture is clear and it is a lie straight from the pit of hell that says God does not want all men to be saved but only some men of all nations.]


Rm does not seem to grasp the idea of context as he boldly proclaims the truth of God a lie from hell???
When someone can do this...do they establish credibility,or sound a clear warning that they are devoid of truth?
The false teaching as put forth by him would describe a god
Who cannot do what he purposes to do, unlike the biblical God who always accomplishes His purpose isa46:9-11.

 

[Jerome]

God wants all men to be saved

2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Yes!

This is His wondrous love towards the human race, that he desires all men to be saved!

 

[InTheLight]

Should you care to look, the context is the last times when great trouble grieves the church.

It is within that context that believers question the validity of the promise of the return of Christ.

So Peter writes the delay is for the purpose of salvation.

See why? Because He is “longsuffering toward us”. Who is the “us?” Believers.

God desires the “us,” the believers not to die, but repent.

8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.​

The “all” is believers, not the unsaved.

I'm having a hard time understanding your position. If God doesn't want believers to "die", then it's within his power to see that they don't die.

Why would believers "perish"? Why would believers need to repent?

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

God does not want just some men but all men to be saved. This scripture is clear and it is a lie straight from the pit of hell that says God does not want all men to be saved but only some men of all nations.

The King James Version, and some others have got this verse wrong. The ESV is quite right here:

"The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance"

Instead of the reading "ἡμᾶς" (us), which some take to mean only believers, and have tried to limit it to the "elect"; the far stronger and older textual reading is, "ὑμᾶς" (you). The difference is very important. With the reading "you", it is to be understood Peter as addressing the "mockers and scoffers" in verses 3+, which is very clear that he says that God is not willing that any of THEM perish, and was long-suffering towards THEM. This is also the language used by the Apostle Paul in Romans 9:22, "What if God, willing to show his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction". God is here seen as "long-suffering" towards those who are lost and hell-bound. Paul does not say that God "κατηρτισμένα" (fitted) them to their "destruction". It is evident from 2 Peter 3:9, and other places, that the sinner by rejecting the Gospel, so "fits themselves", which is also seen from Acts 13:46-48, where we read of the Jews rejecting the Gospel, and thereby "consider themselves (not God) unworthy of eternal life", and then the same Message is taken to the Gentiles, who gladly receive it, and thereby "τεταγμένοι", "arrange themselves" (so the Greek to be taken in the middle voice, contextually) on God's side!

 

[SheepWhisperer]

..........See why? Because He is “longsuffering toward us”. Who is the “us?” Believers...........
God desires the “us,” the believers not to die, but repent............

The “all” is believers, not the unsaved.........

Sir, "believers" are ones who have ALREADY "come to repentance" and they CANNOT "perish" anyway so how could 2 Peter 3:9 be specifying believers? And God IS willing that all of us die physically, hence we all do. So since EVERYONE is going to die physically the "perish" here is not speaking of physical death. It's speaking about going to Hell, and the lake of fire. So the "us" is speaking about the the whole human race. I will expound it for you: God is not willing that any human being should "perish"(go to Hell) but that all should "come to repentance"(get born again).

 

[Jerome]

Even Calvin says so:

Calvin College - II Peter 3 (click to John Calvin Commentary)

the Lord defers his coming that he might invite all mankind to repentance....Not willing that any should perish. So wonderful is his love towards mankind, that he would have them all to be saved, and is of his own self prepared to bestow salvation on the lost.

These guys are going "beyond Calvin".

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Even Calvin says so:

Calvin College - II Peter 3 (click to John Calvin Commentary)


These guys are going "beyond Calvin".

Well, we know from Calvin's comments on John 3:16, Mark 14:24 and Colossians 1:14, etc, that he never did believe in any "limitation" on the Death of the Lord Jesus Christ, which was for the "sins of the entire human race". It is interesting that those who call themselves "Five Point Calvinists", still do so, even though Calvin never believed in the "L" of T.U.L.I.P.!

 

[agedman]

Well, we know from Calvin's comments on John 3:16, Mark 14:24 and Colossians 1:14, etc, that he never did believe in any "limitation" on the Death of the Lord Jesus Christ, which was for the "sins of the entire human race". It is interesting that those who call themselves "Five Point Calvinists", still do so, even though Calvin never believed in the "L" of T.U.L.I.P.!

Not all who hold to the Doctrines of Grace place a limit upon the shed blood.

Those that do see the atonement and salvation as synonymous, but those that do not can have the blood shed for sin of all, and salvation limited to the believing ones.

That given as understood, it remains that the flow of personal pronouns places the “us” as believers.

Basically, Peter is remarking that although the believers are persecuted, God is waiting for all to believe that are given to believe.

 

[TCassidy]

It is interesting that those who call themselves "Five Point Calvinists", still do so, even though Calvin never believed in the "L" of T.U.L.I.P.!

More nonsense. The Atonement is limited in its application, not in it ability to save everyone. It is sufficient for all, efficient only for those who believe.

 

[Jerome]

It is sufficient for all, efficient only for those who believe.

Yours is the Arminian position, according to this posted by "Reformed":

Arminian
Christ's death was "sufficient" for all but "efficient" only for the ones who would believe.

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

Not all who hold to the Doctrines of Grace place a limit upon the shed blood.

Those that do see the atonement and salvation as synonymous, but those that do not can have the blood shed for sin of all, and salvation limited to the believing ones.

That given as understood, it remains that the flow of personal pronouns places the “us” as believers.

Basically, Peter is remarking that although the believers are persecuted, God is waiting for all to believe that are given to believe.

the context with the correct reading as YOU, is not about believers, but the "scoffers and mockers". The words of verse 9 are completely pointless if addressed to "believers", because they are already saved, and can never be lost, so why should God be "not willing that any one the elect be lost", when they CANNOT!

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

More nonsense. The Atonement is limited in its application, not in it ability to save everyone. It is sufficient for all, efficient only for those who believe.

Not only "sufficient", but also "AVAILABLE" for the whole human race, because Jesus' death INCLUDES even the likes of Judas. Note Jesus' words to Judas, "this is My blood, shed for YOU".

 

[TCassidy]

Not only "sufficient", but also "AVAILABLE" for the whole human race, because Jesus' death INCLUDES even the likes of Judas. Note Jesus' words to Judas, "this is My blood, shed for YOU".

You may want to study the Last Supper again. Notice the sequence of events. After being given the sop, which identified him as the traitor, Judas IMMEDIATELY goes out from them and goes to the chief priests. (John 13:30). He was not there when Jesus said those words.

 

[TCassidy]

Yours is the Arminian position, according to this posted by "Reformed":

Look up the word "would" in a good dictionary. That word changes the whole meaning of the sentence.

 

[agedman]

the context with the correct reading as YOU, is not about believers, but the "scoffers and mockers". The words of verse 9 are completely pointless if addressed to "believers", because they are already saved, and can never be lost, so why should God be "not willing that any one the elect be lost", when they CANNOT!

You're basing your approach upon human understanding that believers cannot be elect and lost. This is correct, however not in the manner in which you are showing. The pronouns shift from others to believers in verse 9.

Therefore, the only consistent interpretation for the delay of the Lord's return is that there are yet the unborn who will be saved, that when the last of the elect are saved, then the "day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men" will happen.

Again, I will post this copy from a near post.

The NASB gives the translation in this manner:

3Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, 4and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.” 5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, 6through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water. 7But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
​

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

You may want to study the Last Supper again. Notice the sequence of events. After being given the sop, which identified him as the traitor, Judas IMMEDIATELY goes out from them and goes to the chief priests. (John 13:30). He was not there when Jesus said those words.

John does not have the Lord's Supper recorded, only the Passover meal. Luke clearly states that Judas was still present when Jesus spoke the words concerning His Death. A fact that John Gill and Matthew Henry admit to!

 

[Saved-By-Grace]

You're basing your approach upon human understanding that believers cannot be elect and lost. This is correct, however not in the manner in which you are showing. The pronouns shift from others to believers in verse 9.

Therefore, the only consistent interpretation for the delay of the Lord's return is that there are yet the unborn who will be saved, that when the last of the elect are saved, then the "day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men" will happen.

Again, I will post this copy from a near post.

The NASB gives the translation in this manner:

3Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, 4and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.” 5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, 6through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water. 7But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
​

You still cannot show why would God say that He is "patient" towards the "elect", not "wishing any to perish", when this is something not even possible? What is the point in these words, addressed to the "elect"? The pronoun was changed to "us" at a late date, as the earliest textual evidence shows "you" to be the correct, which includes those who "mock"!

 

[Yeshua1]

2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

God does not want just some men but all men to be saved. This scripture is clear and it is a lie straight from the pit of hell that says God does not want all men to be saved but only some men of all nations.

The ALL in context would mean all that were elected unto eternal life in Christ!