Greg Gilbert - Against Music

[christianyouth]

This is a very insightful blog from Greg Gilbert at 9marks.org. It's short.

http://blog.9marks.org/2008/02/against-music.html

What do you think? Is he right?

 

[Revmitchell]

This is a very insightful blog from Greg Gilbert at 9marks.org. It's short.

http://blog.9marks.org/2008/02/against-music.html

What do you think? Is he right?

Amen!:thumbs:

 

[cowboymatt]

Thanks for posting this!

I think Greg has put his finger on a hot-button issue, that has been hot for quite a long time now.

To me, this issue can be boiled down to selfishness. Many hymn people hate praise and worship songs because they don't prefer that style and many praise and worship people hat hymns because they don't prefer that style. Since when did worshiping God revolve around our preferences! Sadly, I think that human preferences have always dictated worship, which is a bit sad to me. Within reason, a Christian should be able to worship God even if he/she doesn't like the musical style at all. Worship is more than hearing what makes us happy!

 

[PastorSBC1303]

To me, this issue can be boiled down to selfishness. Many hymn people hate praise and worship songs because they don't prefer that style and many praise and worship people hat hymns because they don't prefer that style. Since when did worshiping God revolve around our preferences! Sadly, I think that human preferences have always dictated worship, which is a bit sad to me. Within reason, a Christian should be able to worship God even if he/she doesn't like the musical style at all. Worship is more than hearing what makes us happy!

Excellent, excellent points. I agree. It seems we are all naturally inclined to believe that our own preferences are Biblically right, and therefore we want to hold others to own preferences.

 

[lbaker]

Reminds me of something I heard Rich Mullins say - somebody came up to him after a concert and talked about how they really felt the Spirit moving at a certain point in one song. Rich's reply was something like "Naw, that was just the kick drum coming in!"

 

[TCGreek]

Thanks for posting this!

I think Greg has put his finger on a hot-button issue, that has been hot for quite a long time now.

To me, this issue can be boiled down to selfishness. Many hymn people hate praise and worship songs because they don't prefer that style and many praise and worship people hat hymns because they don't prefer that style. Since when did worshiping God revolve around our preferences! Sadly, I think that human preferences have always dictated worship, which is a bit sad to me. Within reason, a Christian should be able to worship God even if he/she doesn't like the musical style at all. Worship is more than hearing what makes us happy!

I second your post.

Here's another thing: Greg is venting needlessly, and he provides no Scripture for his careless rant. Do we have to wonder?

 

[SBCPreacher]

Thanks for posting this!

I think Greg has put his finger on a hot-button issue, that has been hot for quite a long time now.

To me, this issue can be boiled down to selfishness. Many hymn people hate praise and worship songs because they don't prefer that style and many praise and worship people hat hymns because they don't prefer that style. Since when did worshiping God revolve around our preferences! Sadly, I think that human preferences have always dictated worship, which is a bit sad to me. Within reason, a Christian should be able to worship God even if he/she doesn't like the musical style at all. Worship is more than hearing what makes us happy!

Bravo!! Outstanding post. Thanks.

 

[pinoybaptist]

I second your post.

Here's another thing: Greg is venting needlessly, and he provides no Scripture for his careless rant. Do we have to wonder?

Isn't that what blogs are for ?
So we can "spit it out", so to speak ?
rant and rave ?
to be "interactive" or otherwise ?

 

[TCGreek]

Isn't that what blogs are for ?
So we can "spit it out", so to speak ?
rant and rave ?
to be "interactive" or otherwise ?

You said it better than I could.

 

[christianyouth]

I think he was very generous in his ranting, to be honest. He isn't against certain music styles, he made clear. He followed up in a second post because some people were thinking like you, TC. You should check it out. He actually says he would choose CCM over the hymns if he had to. He is just speaking from experience, and I think if some of us are honest, we HAVE been spiritually dependent on music. I know when I was first saved, that is how I was.

 

[TCGreek]

I think he was very generous in his ranting, to be honest. He isn't against certain music styles, he made clear. He followed up in a second post because some people were thinking like you, TC. You should check it out. He actually says he would choose CCM over the hymns if he had to. He is just speaking from experience, and I think if some of us are honest, we HAVE been spiritually dependent on music. I know when I was first saved, that is how I was.

He does clarify some things. But was his initial post on purpose? Was he trying to evoke a particular response?

 

[tinytim]

I think he did a wonderful job of assessing the situation in a lot of churches...

So much so that I emailed his blog to everyone in our church.

 

[Tom Butler]

I'm not much of a CCM fan, but I recognize that it's because of the Southern Baptist culture in which I was reared, as well as my geezerhood.

Would it be fair to say that must 50-60-somethings don't relate very well to CCM? Are there any of you folks approaching geezerhood that have acquired an appreciation for it?

Another question: Are song leaders and worship leaders simply assuming that the teens and yuppies in their congregation love CCM? Or are they reflecting their own music preferences?

An example: I attended an association annual meeting, attended mostly by folks with gray heads. The host church's young minister of music chose mostly CCM stuff as the music. Most of the attendees didn't participate in the singing. That's why I asked about worship leaders' reflecting their own preferences.

 

[rbell]

An example: I attended an association annual meeting, attended mostly by folks with gray heads. The host church's young minister of music chose mostly CCM stuff as the music. Most of the attendees didn't participate in the singing. That's why I asked about worship leaders' reflecting their own preferences.

well said. We as leaders in worship should be servant-hearted.

 

[tinytim]

I'm not much of a CCM fan, but I recognize that it's because of the Southern Baptist culture in which I was reared, as well as my geezerhood.

Would it be fair to say that must 50-60-somethings don't relate very well to CCM? Are there any of you folks approaching geezerhood that have acquired an appreciation for it?

Another question: Are song leaders and worship leaders simply assuming that the teens and yuppies in their congregation love CCM? Or are they reflecting their own music preferences?

An example: I attended an association annual meeting, attended mostly by folks with gray heads. The host church's young minister of music chose mostly CCM stuff as the music. Most of the attendees didn't participate in the singing. That's why I asked about worship leaders' reflecting their own preferences.

Yes, I have seen this too.

This yr we are having our church's 125th anniversary...
Our Choir right now sings probably 60% Praise and Worship...
But we have began practicing songs that have been prevalent throughout the church's history...

Beginning with the oldest song, and working up through this yr, our choir will present a musical montage of our church's history...

That day, we will line out our songs like they did 70-80 yrs ago...

I presented this idea last night to the church, (lining songs out) and most had no idea what I was talking about (because they are so young)... so I gave them a demonstration... (Thanks Bob, for showing me your examples) Everyone in church thought lining songs was soooo coool. It was new to the teens, and they even liked it... Some even asked if we could do it more often!

Who would have thunk it!??

Anyway, the music director of any gathering must present the style of music that most will be comfortable singing. If people are paying too much attention to the style, the message gets lost...

And it is the message that is always important.

 

[Grasshopper]

He writes:

" How many times have you heard someone say, for example, “I just can’t worship in that church.”? Or “I just don’t feel like I’m connecting with God there.”

You would hear alot more of those kind of comments if we just chanted psalms for the next 10 years.raying:

 

[Karen]

..........Another question: Are song leaders and worship leaders simply assuming that the teens and yuppies in their congregation love CCM? Or are they reflecting their own music preferences?
..............

I consider that an excellent question. In my family, the teenagers and under-25's consider CCM old people's music. Old people being over 35's, who want to be considered young. :laugh:

I also think there is too much equating music with worship in SBC churches that I am acquainted with. Worship = music, and music = worship. Well, no, there are a lot more acts of worship that should occur such as Scripture reading and prayer. But we too often narrowly define worship to just mean music.

 

[just-want-peace]

I presented this idea last night to the church, (lining songs out) and most had no idea what I was talking about (because they are so young)...

Well m'friend, I'm 71 and have no idea what this term means,so please elaborate.

I may have done it, participated in it or observed it, but never being aware that it was "lining songs out".

 

[tank1976]

A lot of this goes with the thought I've heard expressed- " I just didn't get anything out of the service."

A fellow minister friend of mine put it this way to his congregation...

" We are here to worship God. I have found no where in the Bible that says we are to get something out of it. We are to give something to God- our worship."

 

[J.Wayne]

I'm not much of a CCM fan, but I recognize that it's because of the Southern Baptist culture in which I was reared, as well as my geezerhood.

Would it be fair to say that must 50-60-somethings don't relate very well to CCM? Are there any of you folks approaching geezerhood that have acquired an appreciation for it?

Another question: Are song leaders and worship leaders simply assuming that the teens and yuppies in their congregation love CCM? Or are they reflecting their own music preferences?

An example: I attended an association annual meeting, attended mostly by folks with gray heads. The host church's young minister of music chose mostly CCM stuff as the music. Most of the attendees didn't participate in the singing. That's why I asked about worship leaders' reflecting their own preferences.

I think that we all should be open to "different" as long as whatever music is being offered is offered to God and as a praise to Him. Tradition is only good to a point, but it may very well hold many back and not allow the continued growth that God desires.

Tom I am quickly approaching what you call geezerhood, as I will turn 50 in July. I for one enjoy a wide variety of styles as long as there is a message in it. I love the old time gospel, the old spiritual songs, as well as CCM. I feel that we as Christians must not stay stuck in the past. My grandparents did not like the music that my dad was into, and that was not much. My dad did not care for a lot of my choices, and I do not care for some of the choices that my children make.

That being said, I also try to be open minded with their choices and we for the most part have each learned to appreciate each others choices. Yet there still remains their choices that I will never accept, mainly because those choices do not honor God in any manner.

I am mostly a gray head (have been for several years now) but, does that mean that, I must also be close minded, and not even be willing to learn something "different" and new?

I am an old dog, and I can still be taught new tricks. Our youth are our future, are they not? Should we not share in their praises as we expect for them to share in ours?