How do Baptists view I Pet 3:21

[Moriah]

Unless the Lord grants us hearts to hear, minds to receive, we are ALL still "lost sheep", even after hearing about jesus and the Gospel!

You are speaking in a twisted manner.

God does NOT cause us all to believe in Him. THAT IS NOWHERE IN THE SCRIPTURES NOWHERE.

After hearing the gospel, you choose to believe and obey, AND THEN GOD WHO KNOWS THE HEART WILL ACCEPT YOU BY GIVING YOU THE HOLY SPIRIT.

Acts 15:7-8 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: "Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us

God showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them.

Acts 5:30-32 The God of our fathers raised Jesus from the dead---whom you had killed by hanging him on a tree. God exalted him to his own right hand as Prince and Savior that he might give repentance and forgiveness of sins to Israel. We are witnesses of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him."

"...the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.”

 

[Moriah]

have to ask Peter, as he really disobeyed him, and did that while saved by him!

Peter disobeyed, and JESUS HAD TO REINSTATE HIM. Did you not know that?

 

[DHK]

Peter disobeyed, and JESUS HAD TO REINSTATE HIM. Did you not know that?

Jesus never "reinstates" anyone." Have you ever heard of anyone being "unborn"? And then having to be born again and then again? No such concept is found in the Bible.

 

[Moriah]

Jesus never "reinstates" anyone." Have you ever heard of anyone being "unborn"? And then having to be born again and then again? No such concept is found in the Bible.

Matthew 26:33 Peter replied, “Even if all fall away on account of you, I never will.”

Matthew 26:35 But Peter declared, “Even if I have to die with you, I will never disown you.” And all the other disciples said the same.

John 13:37 Peter asked, “Lord, why can’t I follow you now? I will lay down my life for you.”

John 13:38 Then Jesus answered, “Will you really lay down your life for me? I tell you the truth, before the rooster crows, you will disown me three times!


Mark 14:30 “I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “today—yes, tonight—before the rooster crows twice you yourself will disown me three times.”

31 But Peter insisted emphatically, “Even if I have to die with you, I will never disown you.” And all the others said the same.

Mark 14:72 Immediately the rooster crowed the second time. Then Peter remembered the word Jesus had spoken to him: “Before the rooster crows twice you will disown me three times.” And he broke down and wept.

John 21:7 Then the disciple whom Jesus loved said to Peter, "It is the Lord!" As soon as Simon Peter heard him say, "It is the Lord," he wrapped his outer garment around him (for he had taken it off) and jumped into the water.

Peter was ashamed that he denied Jesus three times.

Jesus said Peter's faith would fail him.

Luke 22:31 "Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift you as wheat.

Luke 22:32 But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers."

Peter's faith HAD failed him. He was given the chance to turn back, after Jesus reinstated him.

Peter denied Jesus three times, and three times Jesus confirms the reinstating.

John 21:15-19

Jesus Reinstates Peter

15 When they had finished eating, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon son of John, do you truly love me more than these?”

“Yes, Lord,” he said, “you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Feed my lambs.”

16 Again Jesus said, “Simon son of John, do you truly love me?”

He answered, “Yes, Lord, you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Take care of my sheep.”

17 The third time he said to him, “Simon son of John, do you love me?”

Peter was hurt because Jesus asked him the third time, “Do you love me?” He said, “Lord, you know all things; you know that I love you.”

19 Jesus said this to indicate the kind of death by which Peter would glorify God. Then he said to him, "Follow me!"

 

[Yeshua1]

Peter disobeyed, and JESUS HAD TO REINSTATE HIM. Did you not know that?

reinstate him to exactly what though? from what he did he need to get reinstated back to?

 

[Moriah]

Jesus never "reinstates" anyone." Have you ever heard of anyone being "unborn"? And then having to be born again and then again? No such concept is found in the Bible.

They did not even yet have the Holy Spirit to seal them.

 

[DHK]

They did not even yet have the Holy Spirit to seal them.

Who is greater? The Holy Spirit or Jesus Christ?
You are suggesting that Christ in the flesh is of less importance than the Holy Spirit. Is this what you believe?

 

[Yeshua1]

They did not even yet have the Holy Spirit to seal them.

Could judas been 'reinstated" then?

Could peter have actually lost Jesus, and joined Judas?

 

[DHK]

Matthew 26:33 Peter replied, “Even if all fall away on account of you, I never will.”

Matthew 26:35 But Peter declared, “Even if I have to die with you, I will never disown you.” And all the other disciples said the same.

John 13:37 Peter asked, “Lord, why can’t I follow you now? I will lay down my life for you.”

John 13:38 Then Jesus answered, “Will you really lay down your life for me? I tell you the truth, before the rooster crows, you will disown me three times!


Mark 14:30 “I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “today—yes, tonight—before the rooster crows twice you yourself will disown me three times.”

31 But Peter insisted emphatically, “Even if I have to die with you, I will never disown you.” And all the others said the same.

Mark 14:72 Immediately the rooster crowed the second time. Then Peter remembered the word Jesus had spoken to him: “Before the rooster crows twice you will disown me three times.” And he broke down and wept.

John 21:7 Then the disciple whom Jesus loved said to Peter, "It is the Lord!" As soon as Simon Peter heard him say, "It is the Lord," he wrapped his outer garment around him (for he had taken it off) and jumped into the water.

Peter was ashamed that he denied Jesus three times.

Jesus said Peter's faith would fail him.

Luke 22:31 "Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift you as wheat.

Luke 22:32 But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers."

Peter's faith HAD failed him. He was given the chance to turn back, after Jesus reinstated him.

Peter denied Jesus three times, and three times Jesus confirms the reinstating.

John 21:15-19

Jesus Reinstates Peter

15 When they had finished eating, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon son of John, do you truly love me more than these?”

“Yes, Lord,” he said, “you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Feed my lambs.”

16 Again Jesus said, “Simon son of John, do you truly love me?”

He answered, “Yes, Lord, you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Take care of my sheep.”

17 The third time he said to him, “Simon son of John, do you love me?”

Peter was hurt because Jesus asked him the third time, “Do you love me?” He said, “Lord, you know all things; you know that I love you.”

19 Jesus said this to indicate the kind of death by which Peter would glorify God. Then he said to him, "Follow me!"

The sin of adding to the Word is a grievous sin. Not once did Jesus need to "reinstate" Peter. Those are your "added" words. You need to repent in sackcloth and ashes. Be ashamed you sinner. Howl for your transgressions have come before the face of God.

 

[Moriah]

The sin of adding to the Word is a grievous sin. Not once did Jesus need to "reinstate" Peter. Those are your "added" words. You need to repent in sackcloth and ashes. Be ashamed you sinner. Howl for your transgressions have come before the face of God.

You are a false accuser.

I was explaining the truth.

Not only that, those words “Jesus reinstates Peter” is in the Bible.

Repent of your sins against God, DHK. Falsely accusing another, and interfering with the Truth being told are not sins to be taken easily.

John 21:15-19

As copied exactly from the New International Version.

New International Version (NIV)
Jesus Reinstates Peter

15 When they had finished eating, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon son of John, do you love me more than these?”

“Yes, Lord,” he said, “you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Feed my lambs.”

16 Again Jesus said, “Simon son of John, do you love me?”

He answered, “Yes, Lord, you know that I love you.”

Jesus said, “Take care of my sheep.”

17 The third time he said to him, “Simon son of John, do you love me?”

Peter was hurt because Jesus asked him the third time, “Do you love me?” He said, “Lord, you know all things; you know that I love you.”

 

[DHK]

You are a false accuser.

I was explaining the truth.

Not only that, those words “Jesus reinstates Peter” is in the Bible.

Repent of your sins against God, DHK. Falsely accusing another, and interfering with the Truth being told are not sins to be taken easily.

Don't be foolish. The NIV is a poor translation at best, and their headings certainly are not the inspired Word of God. Do you believe all the written notes that I write in my Bible are inspired? Do you believe all the notes that Scofield had written in his Bible are inspired? I hope not. Then why would you believe that about the NIV editors which have said:

New International Version (NIV)
Jesus Reinstates Peter

THAT IS NOT SCRIPTURE!

Those are the words of men. They are not inspired.
You are adding to the word of God. Repent!

 

[Moriah]

Don't be foolish. The NIV is a poor translation at best, and their headings certainly are not the inspired Word of God. Do you believe all the written notes that I write in my Bible are inspired? Do you believe all the notes that Scofield had written in his Bible are inspired? I hope not. Then why would you believe that about the NIV editors which have said:

THAT IS NOT SCRIPTURE!

Those are the words of men. They are not inspired.
You are adding to the word of God. Repent!

Wisdom proves you wrong DHK.

Jesus reinstated Peter. Why do you think Peter jumped into the water when Jesus came? Why do you think Jesus repeated three times the same command?

Peter’s faith failing him also proves to the Calvinists that God does not make us believe and do right. Jesus even PRAYED that Peter’s faith would not fail him, and it did.

 

[Yeshua1]

Wisdom proves you wrong DHK.

Jesus reinstated Peter. Why do you think Peter jumped into the water when Jesus came? Why do you think Jesus repeated three times the same command?

Peter’s faith failing him also proves to the Calvinists that God does not make us believe and do right. Jesus even PRAYED that Peter’s faith would not fail him, and it did.

Not quite right! Jesus prayed that Peter would "come to his senses" so to speak AFTER he would fail and deny Jesus, for jesus prayer was answered, not failed as you stated here!

 

[Steadfast Fred]

I do not believe Acts 2:38 is speaking of water baptism. I believe it is Holy Ghost baptism.

Why do I believe this? Because of the second part of the verse..."and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

We receive the Holy Ghost the moment we trust Christ, not the moment we are baptized in water.

John the Baptist told those he preached to that Christ would baptize them with the Holy Ghost and with fire... no mention of water. For this cause, I believe the baptism spoken of in Acts 2:38 is not water baptism, but Holy Spirit baptism.

 

[Yeshua1]

I do not believe Acts 2:38 is speaking of water baptism. I believe it is Holy Ghost baptism.

Why do I believe this? Because of the second part of the verse..."and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

We receive the Holy Ghost the moment we trust Christ, not the moment we are baptized in water.

John the Baptist told those he preached to that Christ would baptize them with the Holy Ghost and with fire... no mention of water. For this cause, I believe the baptism spoken of in Acts 2:38 is not water baptism, but Holy Spirit baptism.

Also could be referring to the basis of what actually saves us, in that the water baptism into name of jesus is stating that the source of salvation is jesus, and /or also being jewish, they would have caught that baptism in His name meant identification with him as being the messiah!

be like saying 'arise, each one of you be baptised in His name, as jesus is the One whom has already remitted your sins!"

 

[Moriah]

Not quite right! Jesus prayed that Peter would "come to his senses" so to speak AFTER he would fail and deny Jesus, for jesus prayer was answered, not failed as you stated here!

You say Jesus prayed that Peter would come to his senses, but that is not what the Word says.

Luke 22:32 But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers."

Jesus says the word ‘fail’. If Peter’s faith did not fail him, then how could he have denied Jesus three times? If Peter’s faith did not fail him, then why did Jesus say, “And when you have turned back…” What is Peter turning back from, if not from falling out of faith?

If Jesus did not have to reinstate Peter, then why did Peter jump in the water when Jesus came? If Jesus did not have to reinstate Peter, then why did Jesus ask Peter three times if he loved him and to feed his sheep and follow him?

 

[DHK]

Wisdom proves you wrong DHK.

Jesus reinstated Peter. Why do you think Peter jumped into the water when Jesus came? Why do you think Jesus repeated three times the same command?

Peter’s faith failing him also proves to the Calvinists that God does not make us believe and do right. Jesus even PRAYED that Peter’s faith would not fail him, and it did.

What wisdom? Yours? That I am not concerned about.

Jesus never reinstated Peter for he was never in a position where he had to be reinstated. He was born again. What? Was he unborn that he had to be reborn again and again? You make no sense. Reinstated to what? Reinstated to eternal life? If he lost eternal life then Jesus lied and the eternal life that was given him wasn't eternal. It was only temporary. Do you serve a lying Savior?

I am sure that you are human, and during your Christian life you faith has failed you many times. However, since you refuse to define faith, I can only conclude that you don't know what faith is. You do same to be fairly confused on this subject. Your faith fails you when it seems that God is not answering your prayers, or even perhaps a specific prayer. But that doesn't mean one's salvation is lost. Faith is confidence in God. For anyone to say that they have perfect confidence in God 100% of the time, 100% of their Christian life, they have lied.

 

[Moriah]

I do not believe Acts 2:38 is speaking of water baptism. I believe it is Holy Ghost baptism.

Why do I believe this? Because of the second part of the verse..."and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

We receive the Holy Ghost the moment we trust Christ, not the moment we are baptized in water.

In Acts 2:38, it is about water baptism. When the Apostles preached the gospel, they preached about forgiveness of sins. Water baptism is about forgiveness of sins.

In addition, consider that baptism in the Holy Spirit is a baptism; we are immersed with the Holy Spirit in the inside. It is not something that happens in addition to the baptism, it IS a baptism.

Read this next scripture, it is about repenting AND believing. TURN TO GOD IN REPENTANCE AND HAVE FAITH IN OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST.

Acts 20:21 I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.

Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

That scripture shows us how important repenting is, that we repent THEN turn to God and prove our repentance.

Christians are to be water baptized, even after having received the Holy Spirit.

Acts 10:47 Then Peter said, “Can anyone keep these people from being baptized with water? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”

Even though Apostle Paul now believed in Jesus, he still was to be water baptized, he still was to call on the name of the Lord.

Acts 22:16 And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.'

 

[Moriah]

What wisdom? Yours? That I am not concerned about.

It is not my wisdom; it is the Wisdom of God.
I guess you think I wrote the NIV. For you to think I am the only one with the wisdom is so inaccurate. All those translators of the NIV knew too.

Jesus never reinstated Peter for he was never in a position where he had to be reinstated. He was born again. What? Was he unborn that he had to be reborn again and again? You make no sense. Reinstated to what? Reinstated to eternal life? If he lost eternal life then Jesus lied and the eternal life that was given him wasn't eternal. It was only temporary. Do you serve a lying Savior?

The Apostles were not baptized with the Holy Spirit until Jesus gave it to them to stay forever. Jesus tells his disciples when he goes he will come back and give them the Holy Spirit. Jesus also told them to get his teachings and obey them, then they would receive the Holy Spirit, that ANYONE who loved him would get his teachings and obey them, and he would give them the Holy Spirit.

I am sure that you are human, and during your Christian life you faith has failed you many times. However, since you refuse to define faith, I can only conclude that you don't know what faith is. You do same to be fairly confused on this subject. Your faith fails you when it seems that God is not answering your prayers, or even perhaps a specific prayer. But that doesn't mean one's salvation is lost. Faith is confidence in God. For anyone to say that they have perfect confidence in God 100% of the time, 100% of their Christian life, they have lied.

Do not say I do not know things that I do know. Do not say I refuse to do something that I have not. In addition, this debate group is not for you to abuse me, this group is to talk about doctrines. If you have questions about me personally, it is my decision to tell you.

 

[DHK]

It is not my wisdom; it is the Wisdom of God.
I guess you think I wrote the NIV. For you to think I am the only one with the wisdom is so inaccurate. All those translators of the NIV knew too.

You said: "Wisdom proves 'me' wrong." No, your wisdom doesn't prove anything. And you haven't quoted anything of the wisdom of God. You added to the Word of God, which you haven't yet repented of. The foolish additions of the editors of the NIV are not the inspired words of God, and I thought that you would have enough common sense to realize that. I guess not. That certainly is not a demonstration of wisdom.

The Apostles did not receive the Holy Spirit until Jesus gave it to them to stay forever. Jesus tells his disciples when he goes he will come back and give them the Holy Spirit. Jesus also told them to get his teachings and obey them, then they would receive the Holy Spirit, that ANYONE who loved him would get his teachings and obey them, and he would give them the Holy Spirit.

I ask you again (This time answer me).

Who is greater: Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit?
If you don't answer my question I cannot respond to your post.

Do not say I do not know things that I do know. Do not say I refuse to do something that I have not. In addition, this debate group is not for you to abuse me, this group is to talk about doctrines. If you have questions about me personally, it is my decision to tell you.

I stated facts. You refuse to apply them to yourself.
Fact: No Christian goes through life without "faith failing them," that is without perfect confidence in God 100% of the time 100% of their Christian life. If they say that they do, they have lied.

Fact: You have posted so many contradictory things concerning faith, that I don't believe you know what faith is. That is a fact in the sense that it is my believe, or that I have stated it, even though it is stated as an opinion. And any person in this world is entitled to an opinion. Or don't you believe in your own Constitution, as well as in the universally stated Human Bill of Rights which states that every person has the right to freedom of speech.