How's Your Hermeneutic?

[thatbrian]

Do you read the Bible with the care and respect we would give any other text or do you treat it like a personal basket of fortune cookies? Do you take a half-sentence from anywhere in the Bible and claim its meaning, independent of its context? Is that Okay? Is it what God intended?

Would you be happy with someone treating your statements in the same manner you treat God's Word?

 

[utilyan]

Do you read the Bible with the care and respect we would give any other text or do you treat it like a personal basket of fortune cookies? Do you take a half-sentence from anywhere in the Bible and claim its meaning, independent of its context? Is that Okay? Is it what God intended?

Would you be happy with someone treating your statements in the same manner you treat God's Word?

Like adding rules that don't exist? Or taking statements conclude its the exact opposite meaning? Redoing the entire vocabulary of the entire human race? Where ALL doesn't mean ALL. And FREE WILL doesn't mean FREE WILL. Love doesn't mean love,

Being devoid of most basic common sense?

If God commands us to sit down, I know that means God WANTS me to sit down. With a Calvinist? who knows?

God commands the entire world not to sin and our brethren are not sure if that means God ACTUALLY wants all to be saved.

 

[thatbrian]

Nothing???

 

[thatbrian]

Perhaps I used too big a word in the title.

 

[utilyan]

Perhaps I used too big a word in the title.

Or you have all your opposition on IGNORE so you can pretend to be right when you are proven wrong.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Like adding rules that don't exist? Or taking statements conclude its the exact opposite meaning? Redoing the entire vocabulary of the entire human race? Where ALL doesn't mean ALL. And FREE WILL doesn't mean FREE WILL. Love doesn't mean love,

Being devoid of most basic common sense?

If God commands us to sit down, I know that means God WANTS me to sit down. With a Calvinist? who knows?

God commands the entire world not to sin and our brethren are not sure if that means God ACTUALLY wants all to be saved.

If he wants everyone to be saved then he is an enept failure

 

[Reformed]

Nothing???

Perhaps you are not getting any bites because no one is going to admit that they take scripture out of context?

 

[thatbrian]

Perhaps you are not getting any bites because no one is going to admit that they take scripture out of context?

You're right.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

You're right.

As the Paul Simon song goes in the boxer, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.

 

[Rob_BW]

Do you read the Bible with the care and respect we would give any other text or do you treat it like a personal basket of fortune cookies? Do you take a half-sentence from anywhere in the Bible and claim its meaning, independent of its context? Is that Okay? Is it what God intended?

Would you be happy with someone treating your statements in the same manner you treat God's Word?

Fortune cookies? Interesting, but may I suggest the I Ching for an example of randomness in eastern paganism.

But your foundational statement seems unassailable to me: read God's word in its entirety.

 

[Rippon]

If he wants everyone to be saved then he is an enept failure

Your spelling is inept.

 

[JonC]

As the Paul Simon song goes in the boxer, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.

Exactly. People often read into Scripture and block out what doesn't fit their ideas. (And one of my favorite songs.....did you know originally the "Lie la lie's" were just a filler until he would come up with words?)

 

[thatbrian]

Fortune cookies? Interesting, but may I suggest the I Ching for an example of randomness in eastern paganism.

But your foundational statement seems unassailable to me: read God's word in its entirety.

I've seen countless people treat tiny portions of God's Word like one would treat the contents of a "fortune cookie". I've done it myself.

It's always done in a way in which ignores context. @HankD argued for it in another thread which sparked this one. He thinks it's Okay, and I had hoped that others who think that they may ascribe meaning to a text, regardless of its context, would step up and defend their position, but I think that @Reformed is correct. They aren't exactly going to admit to it.

 

[thatbrian]

Exactly. People often read into Scripture and block out what doesn't fit their ideas. (And one of my favorite songs.....did you know originally the "Lie la lie's" were just a filler until he would come up with words?)

People can do that, but that wasn't the point of this thread.

What I want to discuss here is the act of ascribing meaning to a text, outside of, and in spite of, its context, and if that is a proper way in which to read the Bible.

 

[Don]

People can do that, but that wasn't the point of this thread.

What I want to discuss here is the act of ascribing meaning to a text, outside of, and in spite of, its context, and if that is a proper way in which to read the Bible.

What a silly statement/question. Since there's an obvious answer, what's the real point of this thread?

 

[thatbrian]

What a silly statement/question. Since there's an obvious answer, what's the real point of this thread?

I've already explained the point of the thread.

Have you ever seen a poster in a church basement with someone climbing a mountain with : "Philippians 4:13 I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me", as the caption?

Obviously many people think that they can apply the verse to literally, Anything. Do you? If not, why not? If so, you are my target audience, and I want to discuss this topic with you.

 

[JonC]

People can do that, but that wasn't the point of this thread.

What I want to discuss here is the act of ascribing meaning to a text, outside of, and in spite of, its context, and if that is a proper way in which to read the Bible.

Some say that this is the proper way to read the Bible. The argument is that their theological perspectives and traditions are derived from Scripture and therefore applicable to the whole regardless as to the text or context.

As an example, recently a MDiv graduate declared the text of 1 John demanded the word hilasmos (ἱλασμός) in 1 John 2:2 be defined as “wrath bearing”. The text itself offers a few interpretations of the word (expiation, propitiation, atonement, etc.) but not “wrath bearing” as the subject is not how Christ expiated or propitiated sin but that He is the One who expiates or propitiates.

Regardless as to the validity of the MDiv graduate’s theology, it was poor hermeneutics as he was reading into the text rather than allowing the text (and its context) to define both the term and what John was relating to the audience. Essentially, the graduate, again - regardless as to the correctness of his theology - was holding his theology above God's Word.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Your spelling is inept.

Your personality is inept.

 

[thatbrian]

Some say that this is the proper way to read the Bible. The argument is that their theological perspectives and traditions are derived from Scripture and therefore applicable to the whole regardless as to the text or context.

As an example, recently a MDiv graduate declared the text of 1 John demanded the word hilasmos (ἱλασμός) in 1 John 2:2 be defined as “wrath bearing”. The text itself offers a few interpretations of the word (expiation, propitiation, atonement, etc.) but not “wrath bearing” as the subject is not how Christ expiated or propitiated sin but that He is the One who expiates or propitiates.

Regardless as to the validity of the MDiv graduate’s theology, it was poor hermeneutics as he was reading into the text rather than allowing the text (and its context) to define both the term and what John was relating to the audience. Essentially, the graduate, again - regardless as to the correctness of his theology - was holding his theology above God's Word.

I'm shocked and surprised you would use the above example.

 

[JonC]

I'm shocked and surprised you would use the above example.

It was the best I could come up with on such short notice . And it's a good one.

Another example is that I sometimes catch myself reading the Psalms without diving into what author was experiencing (I sometimes allow my situation to dictate the meaning and have to consciously set aside my presuppositions).