• Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

I fear

R

Robert Snow

New Member
pinoybaptist said:
Well, then, whether you were truly not referring to me, for one, or not, I am not able to discern but I, for one, say the above.

First of all, I do not think the use of the term "will be saved" is appropriate anymore, unless, of course, by some form of verbal maneuvering or semantics we can cause the terms "having obtained eternal redemption for us" found in Hebrews 9:12 to mean anything else other than that eternal redemption is already a reality, finished, done, which necessitates people to still 'be saved', which in turn, logically, requires a present and ongoing redemption by a redeemer, as opposed to one who, by His own blood, entered into the rest of the Eternal God by sitting at the right hand of power.

If eternal redemption has been obtained, rightfully by the rightful Person, Jesus Christ, who should obtain it for those for whom redemption is purposed, His people, then the gospel has no power to grant that redemption, at all, since it is already finished.

Therefore, whether or not the ones to whom that redemption is intended, hears the gospel does not at all affect their eternal standing. They have been redeemed and saved by the Son of God, sanctified by Him, justified through His blood, and the purpose of the gospel is merely to INFORM them of their redemption, and point them to their redeemer, that they may worship Him, and live a life that is worthy of His Name.

Am I belittling the gospel ?

No, I am not. It is an important part of God's plan for His people, but it has no part at all in their eternal redemption, which is over.

OTOH, if redemption has not been obtained, then there is a lot of referring to the Greek that has to be done, a lot of debating about what this or that word means and actually intended to convey, a lot of aspiring to seminary education that the preacher "called" by God to save the souls of His people has to do.
Most importantly, the souls and salvation of millions of people now depended on the ability and willingness of people to "respond" to God's call, to forsake their family, their own lives, and risk everything for.....the Gospel.
More than that, the Creator God, who spoke everything around us into existence, would most utterly have failed, because while He put in writing for one and all to see that "He would have all men to be saved", in fact, many men are being doomed to eternity in hell because, alas, unlike Him, mortal men cannot even create water to wash the sleep off their eyes, nor get to the grocery store without a car, much less get to faraway places like, say, Cambodia where the devil is really romping around among those sin-laden Buddhists.
Without the gospel, how can they be saved ?

So you see, Mr Snow, I would rather throw my lot in with a God who purposed to save many from the fallen race of Adam, and did it Himself, whose words I can trust to be true (let God be true, and every man a liar) when He says "it is finished" and I can rest assured that, indeed, in heaven there shall be many who will come out of great tribulation from ALL tongues, ALL nations, and ALL kindred, including many who lived before Abraham or Israel, in places far away from the East, when yet there was no gospel to preach, or limited, sinful men to preach it.

Peace.
Click to expand...

No brother, I was not referring to you personally. What does puzzles me is that you seem to be saying that everything that will ever happen is settled in eternity past by God, so don't do anything, it's all settled anyway.

I believe we must reach the lost with the Gospel in order to save those who will believe.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
R

Robert Snow

New Member
kyredneck said:
Robert, just curious, is hyper-Calvinist code name for Primitive Baptist? If it is, I'll have respect for you for being gutsy enough to admit it.
Click to expand...

Sir, if it is I did not know it. Some of you think that I am attacking the Primitive Baptist, well I am not. In fact, I do not know the fine points of what they believe. I have never been in a Primitive Baptist church nor had a conversation with a member of such a church.

However, I stand by the things I posted in the OP. Primitive Baptist or not, if you, or anyone else, believes that a person can be saved without consciously repenting and calling on the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved, I feel you are wrong. If you are one who believes that you are saved without ever coming to Jesus then I fear for your salvation. If this is wrong and you all have repented and accepted the Gospel then I am not talking about you.
 
kyredneck

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Robert Snow said:
......repenting of their sins and accepting the free gift of salvation from God.....
Click to expand...
The 'free' 'gift' is eternal life, NOT salvation. As I stated in another thread, it is the error of the modern evangelical Church to not make a clear distinction between the two. 'Getting saved' is NOT synonymous with regeneration, i.e., the acquiring of eternal life.

As far as the 'accepting' goes; the ONLY 'accepting' I find in the scriptures is God's acceptance of us:

Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. Eph 1:5,6
 
R

Robert Snow

New Member
kyredneck said:
The 'free' 'gift' is eternal life, NOT salvation. As I stated in another thread, it is the error of the modern evangelical Church to not make a clear distinction between the two. 'Getting saved' is NOT synonymous with regeneration, i.e., the acquiring of eternal life.
Click to expand...

Wow, what a statement!

I've been a Christian since 1969 and this is the first time I have ever heard such a statement. You actually believe that this is true? Amazing that, considering the number of churches I have attended, that none of them ever said such a thing. I guess they are all wrong except the Primitive Baptist church.
 
R

Robert Snow

New Member
kyredneck said:
As I said, "it is the error of the modern evangelical Church to not make a clear distinction between the two".
Click to expand...

How is it that only the Primitive Baptist have it right?

I talked to a person who attended a Church of Christ a few years ago, and they seem to think that everyone is wrong except them.

Therefore, I am extremely leery of any one group of believers, Baptist included, who believe they somehow have a corner on understanding God's Word.
 
T

Theopolis

New Member
Robert Snow said:
I fear that many five point Calvinists (the ones who are hyper-Calvinists) are heretics (not all, but some) who have fooled themselves into thinking they belong to Christ.

If a person believes that they just all of a sudden recognized that they are part of the redeemed without repenting of their sins and accepting the free gift of salvation from God, I seriously doubt that they are saved at all!
Click to expand...

It's a well known fact that Hyper-Calvinists are saved by osmosis.

"The archetypal Hyper-Calvinist position may be found explicitly set forth in the confessional articles of the Gospel Standard (Baptist) Churches, specifically: Articles of Faith of the Gospel Standard Aid and Poor Relief Societies, (Leicester, England: Oldham & Manton Ltd., n.d.). Article 26 in that publication reads, "We deny duty faith and duty repentance — these terms suggesting that it is every man's duty spiritually and savingly to repent and believe."
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Jerome

Jerome

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
In 1826 the "Declaration of the Reformed Baptist Churches in the State of North Carolina" was issued, expressing the Primitive Baptists' characteristic rejection of missionary societies, seminaries, etc., and nonfellowship with Baptists who approved of such.

Elder Hassell's History of the Church of God from the Creation to A.D. 1885; Including Especially the History of the Kehukee Primitive Baptist Association (pp. 747-748):
we feel called on to state it as a historical truth, not successfully to be denied, that wherever Missionary Societies, Bible Societies, Tract Societies, Sunday Schools, Dorcas Societies, Mite Societies, Religious Fairs and Festivals, Temperance Societies, Sectarian Schools and Theological Seminaries in America prevail, there the doctrine of Phariseeism (modernly called Arminianism) prevails, there the doctrine of saving the souls of men from sin and from hell by works which men may do for themselves and for each other prevails. There the mark of the Beast and there persecution prevail.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
W

Winman

Active Member
Originally Posted by kyredneck
it is the error of the modern evangelical Church to not make a clear distinction between the two. 'Getting saved' is NOT synonymous with regeneration, i.e., the acquiring of eternal life.

Right on ...............
Click to expand...

Care to share scripture that proves regeneration is not the same as salvation?
 
T

Theopolis

New Member
Winman said:
Care to share scripture that proves regeneration is not the same as salvation?
Click to expand...

All you have to do is look up the definitions of those words to see that they even have different definitions. That should provide you with a beginning clue.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top