I'm taking the spiritual lead in my family

[TCassidy]

And if someone doesn't want to call it a conviction, it is a very, very, very strongly held belief/opinion.

I too hold some very, very strong opinions and beliefs. But for me to raise that opinion/belief to the level of conviction I would have to say that I hold that opinion/belief due to the Illuminating ministry of the Holy Spirit, and by claiming so I am, in effect, saying "In this I am right because God is on my side."

God is not on my side. I am, as much as humanly possible, on His side.

 

[StefanM]

I too hold some very, very strong opinions and beliefs. But for me to raise that opinion/belief to the level of conviction I would have to say that I hold that opinion/belief due to the Illuminating ministry of the Holy Spirit, and by claiming so I am, in effect, saying "In this I am right because God is on my side."

God is not on my side. I am, as much as humanly possible, on His side.

We are using the term in different senses. I would not claim the things you mentioned, either. Feel free to substitute the alternative terms.

 

[TCassidy]

Yes, we are. The term has been so badly misused (largely by IFBs, ironically) that it no longer has any meaning at all. A conviction is something that is absolutely certain. And only those things spoken by God Himself are absolutely certain. And even then, in order to have that absolute certainty, we must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. And that is why we must never say, "I know." We must say "I believe." For we walk by faith, not by sight. John wrote over and over again that we "know." And how do we "know?" We know by faith.

 

[StefanM]

Yes, we are. The term has been so badly misused (largely by IFBs, ironically) that it no longer has any meaning at all. A conviction is something that is absolutely certain. And only those things spoken by God Himself are absolutely certain. And even then, in order to have that absolute certainty, we must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. And that is why we must never say, "I know." We must say "I believe." For we walk by faith, not by sight. John wrote over and over again that we "know." And how do we "know?" We know by faith.

I see what you mean. I will call it a strongly held belief, then. Thank you for the clarification. I was rather confused for a bit.

 

[TCassidy]

I see what you mean. I will call it a strongly held belief, then. Thank you for the clarification. I was rather confused for a bit.

I tend to have the effect on people. Even on me.

 

[Sapper Woody]

My information is old, so this may have changed. But I was taught that the legal definition of conviction is something you were willing to die for, otherwise, it was a preference.

Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk

 

[StefanM]

My information is old, so this may have changed. But I was taught that the legal definition of conviction is something you were willing to die for, otherwise, it was a preference.

Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk

It apparently has as many meanings as people saying it. Dictionaries definitely include strong opinions, but I'm not sure legally the term would be defined in any official sense.

 

[StefanM]

I tend to have the effect on people. Even on me.

I blame my Swiss-cheese brain!

 

[TCassidy]

My information is old, so this may have changed. But I was taught that the legal definition of conviction is something you were willing to die for, otherwise, it was a preference.

I have heard that too. It springs from a comment made by a judge in case regarding a Christian ministry. "Are you willing to die for it?" In my opinion it was an asinine question. Nobody knows what they are willing to die for until they are faced with that decision. We might think we are willing to die for something but when face to face with death we may not be as strong as we initially assumed.

The legal definition of "conviction" is "a formal declaration that someone is guilty of a criminal offense, made by the verdict of a jury or the decision of a judge in a court of law."

 

[Don]

This thread has deviated FAR from where it started....

Suffice to say, as was pointed out by a respondent somewhere back around page 1, it takes 2 to argue.

 

[StefanM]

This thread has deviated FAR from where it started....

Suffice to say, as was pointed out by a respondent somewhere back around page 1, it takes 2 to argue.

In a sense, it has still remained on topic somewhat---the idea of what prompts a person to consider a church unacceptable or not.

But, practically, I think that the question was answered sufficiently earlier in the thread, and then the thread just evolved.

 

[Jordan Kurecki]

"When the Bible teaches something the Church doesn't like they call it legalism" -Leonard Ravenhill

 

[StefanM]

"When the Bible teaches something the Church doesn't like they call it legalism" -Leonard Ravenhill

Perhaps, but we better be sure the Bible teaches it, lest we fall into this trap:

“Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition?" - Jesus Christ, from Matt 15:3 (NKJV)

 

[SovereignGrace]

I don't know that that's a good idea, Evan. We are dealing with two very different but Christian churches. Your marriage is more important than your preference of churches.

I recommend you attend church with your wife and put your whole heart in that worship. And when you leave continue to love your wife and put her needs and desires over your own. After awhile, I think that the issue may fade. A church is a gathering of imperfect people worshiping an almighty and perfect God. There will always be things to complain about, but there will always be One who holds it all together because we are His. I don't know that it's too much to ask for you to give up Mikes Hard Lemonade and your worship preference in love towards a person for whom Christ suffered and died to save, particularly if this person is your wife who you are to love, cherish, and put her needs over your own, just as Christ loves the Church.

I wish you the very best, and will continue praying for you. What I wrote above is just my suggestion, what I believe is the right step based only on what I've read here. If I were you, I'd try to find someone to talk to as a couple.

He has attended that church for 3+ years. He said so in another post. He is in an undesireable postion. Churches can, sadly, indoctrinate their folks. Some will excommunicate if a woman is seen wearing pants in public and not a dress. I know this firsthanded as a reality. If a man's hair gets too long, it's either get a hair cut or be tossed out on your ears. If you don't preach from solely the KJV, you might get the ole heave ho. And so on, and so on, and so on...

Evan, you are in my prayers...but, as others have already said...tread LIGHTLY...

 

[SovereignGrace]

The associated issues like the KJVO and KJVP positions, separation, attire, cultural expectations, often excessive pastoral control, etc.

And the F is typically more fundamentalist than just the fundamentals of the faith. I'm an evangelical who believes in the fundamentals, but I'm not a fundamentalist.

Now if it were the equivalent of an SBC church, then I'd have no issue. But these other issues are dealbreakers for me.

The translation issue is major for me. I'm not going to have my children in a church that discourages them from reading a translation they can understand. And I believe I have the right to use a modern translation. I even mainly use the NKJV, but it's important for me to have my liberty to read and use in church a modern translation.

I love the NIV & NASB. Still read a little out of the KJV, but mainly those two. That says a lot about me as I was once staunchly KJVO. I thought all other translations were corrupted, evil, vile, detestable, &c. But thankfully, God brought me out of that nonsense. In many churches around here, it is KJVO. I have a second Tuesday night meeting at the only Separate Baptist in WVa every month, and they are KJVO. When I read scriptures I preach about, I use the KJV out of respect for them. They also believe one can be lost again after being saved. The Missionary Baptist church I now attend, I have liberty to use whatever translation I want. They are believers in eternal security, too.

So I can see where Bro. Evan has issues. But how he approaches and handles his wife he needs to be in deep prayer.

 

[evangelist6589]

This thread has deviated FAR from where it started....

Suffice to say, as was pointed out by a respondent somewhere back around page 1, it takes 2 to argue.

You made a false accusation that I do not listen. This is not true as I have decided on what to do based on the help of some posters.

 

[evangelist6589]

I love the NIV & NASB. Still read a little out of the KJV, but mainly those two. That says a lot about me as I was once staunchly KJVO. I thought all other translations were corrupted, evil, vile, detestable, &c. But thankfully, God brought me out of that nonsense. In many churches around here, it is KJVO. I have a second Tuesday night meeting at the only Separate Baptist in WVa every month, and they are KJVO. When I read scriptures I preach about, I use the KJV out of respect for them. They also believe one can be lost again after being saved. The Missionary Baptist church I now attend, I have liberty to use whatever translation I want. They are believers in eternal security, too.

So I can see where Bro. Evan has issues. But how he approaches and handles his wife he needs to be in deep prayer.

Indeed. I do not like attending the Baptist Church at least that type of Baptist. However I love attending a certain Reformed Baptist Church in the area with a biblical view on soteriology and church government.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Indeed. I do not like attending the Baptist Church at least that type of Baptist. However I love attending a certain Reformed Baptist Church in the area with a biblical view on soteriology and church government.

So, if you see that you going to another church genders strife in your marriage, then what? She may resent you for doing this. Always remember, you are not only a Christian, but also a husband. You are commanded to love her so much, you are willing to die in her stead. So again, tread lightly my Brother.

Now, her not willing to even attend another church once, is quite telling. She has been indoctrinated it seems.

 

[evangelist6589]

So, if you see that you going to another church genders strife in your marriage, then what? She may resent you for doing this. Always remember, you are not only a Christian, but also a husband. You are commanded to love her so much, you are willing to die in her stead. So again, tread lightly my Brother.

Now, her not willing to even attend another church once, is quite telling. She has been indoctrinated it seems.

That's how IFB's operate. I went to Bob Jones I know their plan.

 

[JamesL]

That's how IFB's operate. I went to Bob Jones I know their plan.

You should chime in on the "Church Standards" thread so we can have an insider's perspective on Fundamentalism