Is Arminianism heresy?

[Robert William]

Many national church meetings have declared Arminianism as heresy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synod_of_Dort

Why is it that today most Christians or so called Christians comfortable with Arminianism??

The Synod concluded with a rejection of the Arminian views, and set forth the Reformed doctrine on each point, namely: total depravity, unconditional election, limited atonement (arguing that Christ's atoning work was intended only for the elect and not for the rest of the world), irresistible (or irrevocable) grace, and the perseverance of the saints. These are sometimes referred to as the Five points of Calvinism. The Decision of the Synod of Dort on the Five Main Points of Doctrine in Dispute in the Netherlands, popularly known as the Canons of Dort, is the explanation of the judicial decision of the Synod.[12] In the original preface, the Decision is called:

The Synod condemned the religious doctrine of Arminianism as heresy. There followed the political condemnation of the statesman Johan van Oldenbarnevelt who had been the protector of the Remonstrants. For the crime of general perturbation in the state of the nation, both in Church and State (treason), he was beheaded on 13 May 1619, only four days after the final meeting of the Synod. As consequence of the Arminian defeat the jurist Hugo Grotius was given a life sentence in prison; but he escaped with the help of his wife. Both Van Oldenbarnevelt and Grotius had in fact been imprisoned since 29 August 1618.

 

[BobRyan]

Many national church meetings have declared Arminianism as heresy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synod_of_Dort

Why is it that today most Christians or so called Christians comfortable with Arminianism??

The Synod concluded with a rejection of the Arminian views, and set forth the Reformed doctrine on each point, namely: total depravity, unconditional election, limited atonement (arguing that Christ's atoning work was intended only for the elect and not for the rest of the world), irresistible (or irrevocable) grace, and the perseverance of the saints. These are sometimes referred to as the Five points of Calvinism. The Decision of the Synod of Dort on the Five Main Points of Doctrine in Dispute in the Netherlands, popularly known as the Canons of Dort, is the explanation of the judicial decision of the Synod.[12] In the original preface, the Decision is called:

The Synod condemned the religious doctrine of Arminianism as heresy. There followed the political condemnation of the statesman Johan van Oldenbarnevelt who had been the protector of the Remonstrants. For the crime of general perturbation in the state of the nation, both in Church and State (treason), he was beheaded on 13 May 1619, only four days after the final meeting of the Synod. As consequence of the Arminian defeat the jurist Hugo Grotius was given a life sentence in prison; but he escaped with the help of his wife. Both Van Oldenbarnevelt and Grotius had in fact been imprisoned since 29 August 1618.

The Jewish council condemned Paul and Christ as heretics.

The Catholic councils condemned protestants as heretics.

it is about time a few more protestants woke up to the fact that name-calling is worthless.

The Bible is an Arminian text "God so loved the WORLD - yes really" John 3:16.

Christ is the "Atoning sacrifice for OUR sins and not for OUR sins only but for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD" 1John 2:2.

The heresy we find in Calvinism (sorry about that but I wanted to throw the all-name-calling-crowd a bone on this one) - is that God becomes the Saboteur of his own gospel and the cause of his own lament.

Sorry folks - but Calvinism is just plain wrong - especially in its 4 and 5 point form.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

This is where a number of Calvinists will simply "leave the building" ...

[FONT=&quot]God's Lament
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Hosea 11[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]:7 So My people are bent on turning from Me.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Though they call them to the One on high,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]None at all exalts Him.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]8 How can I give you up, O Ephraim?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]How can I surrender you, O Israel?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]How can I make you like Admah?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]How can I treat you like Zeboiim?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]My heart is turned over within Me,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]All My compassions are kindled[/FONT][FONT=&quot].[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ezek 18[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
30“Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, each according to his conduct,” declares the Lord GOD. “Repent and turn away from all your transgressions, so that iniquity may not become a stumbling block to you. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]31“Cast away from you all your transgressions which you have committed and make yourselves a new heart and a new spirit! For why will you die, O house of Israel? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]32“For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies,” declares the Lord GOD. “Therefore, repent and LIVE!" [/FONT]

"He came to HIS OWN and HIS OWN received Him not" John 1

[FONT=&quot]2Cor 5
18 Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation,
19 namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the WORLD to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
20 Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were making an appeal through us; we beg you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.[/FONT]



[FONT=&quot]Calvinism's cause/reason for the Lament:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Calvinism responds to God’s Lament “Why will you die” with an extreme form of ‘inference” that it pours into Deut 5:59. Instead of the obvious cause[/FONT]à[FONT=&quot] effect. Israel chooses faithfulness to God – and God responds with blessing and protection. Calvinism “infers” that it is GOD who is causing Israel to sabotage his plans for them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
Now Deut 5:29 -- 29 O that there were such an heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep all my commandments always, that it might be well with them, and with their children for ever!.

In reality we all know God's lament is not about "himself" being saboteur of his own plans, or about Himself forgetting to provide the necessary means. Nobody can doubt that. But here Calvinism has the ultimate doctrine-by-inference to refute the common sense reading of the texts.

[/FONT]By contrast: God's "Appeal" and Lament

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezek 18[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]30“Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, each according to his conduct,” declares the Lord GOD. “Repent and turn away from all your transgressions, so that iniquity may not become a stumbling block to you. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]31“Cast away from you all your transgressions which you have committed and make yourselves a new heart and a new spirit! For why will you die, O house of Israel? [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]32“For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies,” declares the Lord GOD. “Therefore, repent and LIVE!" [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2Cor 5: [/FONT][FONT=&quot]20 Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were making an appeal through us; we beg you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2 Peter 3[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]8 But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day.
9 The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“He CAME to HIS OWN and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]His OWN received Him not[/FONT][FONT=&quot]” John 1[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Matt 23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]37“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]38“Behold, your house is being left to you desolate![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Luke 7[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]28 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]When all the people and the tax collectors heard this, they acknowledged God’s justice, having been baptized with the baptism of John. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]29 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Is 5:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Response: [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Well the Calvinist would have an answer for God on that one. An answer contrived via “extreme inference” in places like Deut 5:29. Calvinism would inform the world – and God Himself of just what God did to cause the lamentable result that God is complaining about. If the result is wrong then Calvinism argues He did wrong - sabotaging His own plans or at the very least - being forgetful to "do the necessary" as the saying goes in India.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The elephant in Calvinism’s living room is that they make God the saboteur of His own Gospel plans for life and salvation – the cause of His own lament
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]– like a house wife with a broom lamenting as she stares at a pile of dirt that is not swept clean, crying out “what more could I have done!! Why are you still just sitting there unswept??”.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]It appears to those watching Calvinism making such claims - that it is all counter intuitive - counter to the Word of God and based solely on incorrect "inferences" inserted into a text here or there.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]in Christ,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Bob
[/FONT]

Irrefutable.

 

[BobRyan]

Don't miss it.

[FONT=&quot]“He CAME to HIS OWN and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]His OWN received Him not[/FONT][FONT=&quot]” John 1[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Matt 23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]37“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]38“Behold, your house is being left to you desolate![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Luke 7[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]28 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]When all the people and the tax collectors heard this, they acknowledged God’s justice, having been baptized with the baptism of John. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]29 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Is 5:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Response: [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Well the Calvinist would have an answer for God on that one. An answer contrived via “extreme inference” in places like Deut 5:29. Calvinism would inform the world – and God Himself of just what God did to cause the lamentable result that God is complaining about. If the result is wrong then Calvinism argues He did wrong - sabotaging His own plans or at the very least - being forgetful to "do the necessary" as the saying goes in India.[/FONT]

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Is Arminianism heresy?

Arminianism is Roman Catholicism reinvented in Protestantism. To be correct, your question should be, Is Roman Catholicism heresy?

Now tell me your answer.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

<<<This is where a number of Calvinists will simply "leave the building" ...>>>

Of course! For sure they will. You blame them?!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

The Jewish council condemned Paul and Christ as heretics.

The Catholic councils condemned protestants as heretics.

it is about time a few more protestants woke up to the fact that name-calling is worthless.

The Bible is an Arminian text "God so loved the WORLD - yes really" John 3:16.

Christ is the "Atoning sacrifice for OUR sins and not for OUR sins only but for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD" 1John 2:2.

The heresy we find in Calvinism (sorry about that but I wanted to throw the all-name-calling-crowd a bone on this one) - is that God becomes the Saboteur of his own gospel and the cause of his own lament.

Sorry folks - but Calvinism is just plain wrong - especially in its 4 and 5 point form.

in Christ,

Bob

What a relief; this is a fight I can just sit back and enjoy. Yes in fact a WAR I can revel in at the defeat of the enemies of the LORD SABAOTH, for the LORD has many mighty men in the front-line. It's like watching a movie of ancient battles fought and won by the noble heroes. Old but ever-new.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

I have asked you questions, Bob Ryan, demanding brave answers. But you chose to divert attention with little Don Quixote windmill charges.

 

[BobRyan]

you asked "me" a question??

 

[robustheologian]

Is Arminianism heresy?

Arminianism is Roman Catholicism reinvented in Protestantism. To be correct, your question should be, Is Roman Catholicism heresy?

Now tell me your answer.

Lol...interestingly enough this is kinda true.

 

[DHK]

Many national church meetings have declared Arminianism as heresy.

The inference of those that are non-Cal are Arminian is dishonest.
I don't know of anyone on this board that is an Arminian. If you do, please tell me.
Perhaps you should give your own concise definition instead of providing a link.

 

[Don]

Many national church meetings have declared Arminianism as heresy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synod_of_Dort

Why is it that today most Christians or so called Christians comfortable with Arminianism??

The Synod concluded with a rejection of the Arminian views, and set forth the Reformed doctrine on each point, namely: total depravity, unconditional election, limited atonement (arguing that Christ's atoning work was intended only for the elect and not for the rest of the world), irresistible (or irrevocable) grace, and the perseverance of the saints. These are sometimes referred to as the Five points of Calvinism. The Decision of the Synod of Dort on the Five Main Points of Doctrine in Dispute in the Netherlands, popularly known as the Canons of Dort, is the explanation of the judicial decision of the Synod.[12] In the original preface, the Decision is called:

The Synod condemned the religious doctrine of Arminianism as heresy. There followed the political condemnation of the statesman Johan van Oldenbarnevelt who had been the protector of the Remonstrants. For the crime of general perturbation in the state of the nation, both in Church and State (treason), he was beheaded on 13 May 1619, only four days after the final meeting of the Synod. As consequence of the Arminian defeat the jurist Hugo Grotius was given a life sentence in prison; but he escaped with the help of his wife. Both Van Oldenbarnevelt and Grotius had in fact been imprisoned since 29 August 1618.

Oh, please. Why are you so anxious to bolster calvinism rather than embrace Christians? Do you not accept soul liberty?

 

[tyndale1946]

What a relief; this is a fight I can just sit back and enjoy. Yes in fact a WAR I can revel in at the defeat of the enemies of the LORD SABAOTH, for the LORD has many mighty men in the front-line. It's like watching a movie of ancient battles fought and won by the noble heroes. Old but ever-new.

How exciting!... Would someone please pass the popcorn!... Brother Glen

 

[Rebel]

Lol...interestingly enough this is kinda true.

Said the Calvinist who gets his Penal Substitutionary Atonement Theory via the Roman Catholic Anselm's Satisfaction Theory.

 

[BobRyan]

The inference of those that are non-Cal are Arminian is dishonest.
I don't know of anyone on this board that is an Arminian. If you do, please tell me.
Perhaps you should give your own concise definition instead of providing a link.

I am Arminian. :wavey:

 

[BobRyan]

I wonder if Calvinists have an answer for this.

Don't miss it.

[FONT=&quot]“He CAME to HIS OWN and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]His OWN received Him not[/FONT][FONT=&quot]” John 1[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Matt 23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]37“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]38“Behold, your house is being left to you desolate![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Luke 7[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]28 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]When all the people and the tax collectors heard this, they acknowledged God’s justice, having been baptized with the baptism of John. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]29 [/FONT][FONT=&quot]But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God’s purpose for themselves, not having been baptized by John.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Is 5:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Response: [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Well the Calvinist would have an answer for God on that one. An answer contrived via “extreme inference” in places like Deut 5:29. Calvinism would inform the world – and God Himself of just what God did to cause the lamentable result that God is complaining about. If the result is wrong then Calvinism argues He did wrong - sabotaging His own plans or at the very least - being forgetful to "do the necessary" as the saying goes in India.[/FONT]

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

The inference of those that are non-Cal are Arminian is dishonest.
I don't know of anyone on this board that is an Arminian. If you do, please tell me.
Perhaps you should give your own concise definition instead of providing a link.

It's easy to <define> oneself out of the hot water. SDAs do that.

You're either a free grace believer or a free will believer. There is no in between.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

<<<“He CAME to HIS OWN and His OWN received Him not” John 1>>>

Bob Ryan, If you were there or I were there, you nor I would receive Him. Because "THEY" received Him not, But you, Bob Ryan and I GE, KILLED Him.

True or false?

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

<<<Matt 23
37“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.
38“Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!>>>

AT THIS very event where Bob Ryan and GE crucified and killed our visiting Creator and Redeemer, AT THIS VERY EVENT ---it is written--- "Thy people shall be willing IN THE DAY OF _THY_ POWER". You could please read the whole Psalm 110.

"If the LORD will ... we shall do this or that." James 4:15.

"If thou seek Him, HE, WILL, be found of thee ... FOR THE LORD HATH CHOSEN THEE to build an house for His sanctuary : BE STRONG AND DO IT"

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

We shall read the same Scripture and read what WE want to read or what GOD, actually, “WILL”.

(No, don't add an 's'!)