Is it wrong to indulge the flesh in music?

[DHK]

1 John 2:15-16 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

 

[Monergist]

RO 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

RO 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

 

[shane usry]

I purchased a car yesterday that had a cd without a label on it. Curiosity got the best of me...I started to listen to it. The first song, I breezed through quickly, the next song was a song that I loved to hear in my rebellious days. I lingered a little too long and the Holy Spirit said, "NO!" Not audibly, but in my heart. I believe the Holy Spirit guides me in reference to what I listen to, what I eat, and in every aspect of my life. If I get too close and don't listen to Him...I get burned! Love in Christ, Shane

Just fyi I'm a car dealer- buying vehicles is a daily occurence for me, and this scenario happens a couple of times a week. Sometimes I find some very good Gospel, CCM or even preaching that is very uplifting. Sometimes I find some CCM that is NOT uplifting and it gets thrown out along with the before mentioned rebellious music.

 

[Trotter]

As far as I am concerned, any and/or all who want to be legalistic can hoot and holler all you want. What I listen to is between me and God.

Everything that has neen posted thus far has been personal preference. The bible is silent regarding music styles. It is also silent regarding lyrics, rhythyms, musical instruments that should not be played, what tempo is too fast/slow, yada yada yada. In other words, all anyone can give is their own uptight, I'm-holier-than-you, down-the-nose-looking opinion. There are no verses that speak directly to this subject.

Oh, you want to use blanket verses that might/could/possibly apply? How about "make a joyful noise unto the Lord"? I think that woiuld cover it all...

Just because you don't like a style of music does not give you the right to condemn it. I detest rap. But I don't try to blast it out oft he water. I also despise opera. But, again, I don't shun someone who listens to it. Same with country.

When I listen to CCM, I am glorifying my Lord and God. If you use hymns to do that, great. So do I. But don't come in here comdemning something just because it ain't your cup of tea...or you are afraid your pastor would throw you out of the church if he heard you'd been listening to that "worldly" music. (If I went to a church like that, I'd be finding me somewhere alse to go, post haste!!!)

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Aaron]

Originally posted by Trotter:
As far as I am concerned, any and/or all who want to be legalistic can hoot and holler all you want. What I listen to is between me and God.

Then keep it between you and God. Enter into thy closet and when thou hast shut thy door, get down and boogie for the Lord.

But as soon as you bring it into the open, then it's between you and me, brother. You'd better be right.

In fact, all the hootin' and hollerin' around here lately has been yours. Any boob can hurl insults and accusations, but it takes some skill in the Word of Righteousness to prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. I'd like to see if you can actually make a case for your style of music. Show me that it's God's will for you to use any style you prefer.

 

[GrannyGumbo]

God bless you, Aaron!

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Aaron:
Show me that it's God's will for you to use any style you prefer.

That bigger issue is that the anti-CCM crowd insist (without any scriptural support whatsoever) that it is God's will for us to use the style of music that THEY prefer.

It's the same circular, self-serving, and unscriptural reasoning that KJVOists use to support their false doctrine: "All other versions except the one I like are wrong, and you can't provide scripture to refute m"e. Same with the music issue: "All types of music that I don't like are wrong, and you can't provide scripture to refute me".

I reiterate my previous statement: Scripture does not say that polyphony is better spiritually than monophony. Scripture does not say that multiple percussion instruments are better than single percussion instruments. Scripture does not say that music must contain syncopation (instead of one-the-beat meters) in order to be spiritual.

And, if anyone needs to ask what any of those terms means, then they're not qualified to make a critical observation of modern music.

As to the OP topic, is it wrong to indulge the flesh? Yes. Is it wrong to listen to CCM or any other type of music? If it's not indulging the flesh, no.

 

[Monergist]

Originally posted by Trotter:
As far as I am concerned, any and/or all who want to be legalistic can hoot and holler all you want.

What is legalistic about being obedient to scripture?

The question was "Is it wrong to indulge the flesh..." Scripture says 'Yes.' God has given us unique personalities that are somewhat chararacterized by our preferences. These preferences must be brought under the authority of God's Word; as our preferences left unchecked always lead us to sin.

 

[Aaron]

Originally posted by GrannyGumbo:
God bless you, Aaron!

He does, Granny. He does!

 

[billwald]

>Scripture does not say that polyphony is better spiritually than monophony.

It's not a matter of spirituality but civility. Civilizing humanity has been a long process and modern savages seek to reverse the process. Just coincidence that the jungle music congregations tend to be 6 day creation congregations?

 

[Johnv]

Sorry, billwald, but that's just not the case. Just as it is absent from scripture, civility, too, does not say that polyphony is better civilly than monophony, or that multiple percussion instruments are better than single percussion instruments, or that music must contain syncopation instead of one-the-beat meters in order to be civil. Not only is this precedent absent from rules of civility, they are absent from rules of musical evolution, from rules of society, from rules of music appreciation, and from rules determining what constitutes advancement.

Your claim is highly subjective to your own personal taste in music, and nothing else.

 

[Trotter]

Am I to actually believe that a rendition of "I Can Only Imagine" by MercyMe, or "These Thousand Hills" by Third Day, or "Be Still" by Stephen Curtis Chapman would be shunned or walked out on? Look up the words to those songs or, better yet, actually listen to them, and then decide.

What makes the hymns we sing, or southern gospel, more biblical than some of the songs of today? True, not everything paraded as CCM is all that great, but to throw out the baby with the bathwater is getting extreme.

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Trotter]

Aaron, I am not trying to be insulting. But I cannot sit still while someone is running down something as personal to me as the music I use to worship my Lord. So, it's OK for me to keep quiet about CCM and you to post all you want about how evil modern Christian music is and how it shouldn't be in the church?

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Trotter]

I read that the topic of music in the church creates more hurt feelings and church splits that anything else. At least I know that it was true.

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Aaron]

Originally posted by Trotter:
Aaron, I am not trying to be insulting. But I cannot sit still while someone is running down something as personal to me as the music I use to worship my Lord. So, it's OK for me to keep quiet about CCM and you to post all you want about how evil modern Christian music is and how it shouldn't be in the church?

No. My point is the issue isn't a private one. It's a corporate one.

 

[billwald]

Not evil, juvenile.

 

[Trotter]

No. My point is the issue isn't a private one. It's a corporate one.

Would you attend a church that used contempory music? No, you wouldn't.

But, would you condemn them for using CCM in their worship? Would you question their salvation for using CCM?

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Trotter]

How can anyone justify any one style or genre of music as better than another? (this is an open question, and is not pointed at anyone)

What biblical grounds does any of us have for judging the music of one another?

In Christ,
Trotter

 

[Aaron]

Music is a form of human interaction. It isn't simply a medium or symbol of interaction, it is interaction. It is a willful, purposeful act. A work. And all our works will be judged as either good or evil.

That's why the "music is neutral" arguments are moot points.

How is it judged? First of all I want to establish that it can be judged.

He that is spiritual judgeth all things. 1 Cor. 2:15.

Okay now we can see it can be judged, and for our basis any Scripture that touches on the demeanor of a Christian's interaction directly applies to the music he participates in, either as performer or listener.

 

[Eric B]

"human interaction": in other words, what this is getting to, is because I see some other people over there using a certain style or beatfor sin, then it must be the music that is causing it, and therefore, God judges all who listen to it with that sin.
(those of you who are new to this debate, this is part of an endless cycle of arguments that shift to the next when we answer one)
What then when we see people listening to stately classical music with an air of superiority and looking down their noses at that "juvenile" "jungle" music of the "savages" as one person here is calling it? (i.e. since classical is associated with "high culture", which has its own share of sins, such as pride in being more "civilized"). Is the person judged for the music, or for the sin in their hearts? Are all who listen to it to be judged for that sin? No, of course.