Is Satan, Lucifer and the Devil differing names for the evil one?

[saturneptune]

So the question becomes, is the serpent in the Garden, the entity addressing God in the first Chapter of Job, the being that tempted Christ in the desert, the being thrown in the Lake of Fire and loosened for 1000 years in Revelation, and Lucifer falling to earth, are they all the same?

 

[convicted1]

So the question becomes, is the serpent in the Garden, the entity addressing God in the first Chapter of Job, the being that tempted Christ in the desert, the being thrown in the Lake of Fire and loosened for 1000 years in Revelation, and Lucifer falling to earth, are they all the same?

Thank you Brother!! That's exactly how I wanted to word the OP's question(not about the serpent in the Garden, or the Great Red Dragon in Rev. 12, but about Lucifer and Satan), but I didn't know how to word it this way. I always thought Lucifer in Isaiah 14 WAS Satan and Lucifer was Satan. IOW, I thought they were one and the same. TBS, after doing some digging, I am not qo sure I was correct in that assessment.

 

[saturneptune]

Thank you Brother!! That's exactly how I wanted to word the OP's question(not about the serpent in the Garden, or the Great Red Dragon in Rev. 12, but about Lucifer and Satan), but I didn't know how to word it this way. I always thought Lucifer in Isaiah 14 WAS Satan and Lucifer was Satan. IOW, I thought they were one and the same. TBS, after doing some digging, I am not qo sure I was correct in that assessment.

Well, in simple terms which is how I think, which of the two? would be the one we picture as being the leader of evil in the universe, the "father of all lies" or the master in hell? Which also brings up the question, what is the position of the other one?

 

[convicted1]

Well, in simple terms which is how I think, which of the two? would be the one we picture as being the leader of evil in the universe, the "father of all lies" or the master in hell? Which also brings up the question, what is the position of the other one?

I see Satan as the "father of lies" as well as being the Great Red Dragon of Rev. 12. Rev. 20 bears that out.

Are you thinking that Satan is in hell now? Well, Satan isn't omnipresent like God is, so he has his minions doing his works for him. So I honestly don't know if Satan is in hell now or not.

 

[HisWitness]

So the question becomes, is the serpent in the Garden, the entity addressing God in the first Chapter of Job, the being that tempted Christ in the desert, the being thrown in the Lake of Fire and loosened for 1000 years in Revelation, and Lucifer falling to earth, are they all the same?

MEN were referred to as Serpents in the new testament-not an entity
there was NO entity addressing God in Job it was MEN--adversaries of Job
NO being that tempted Christ--it was MEN(High Priest and his angels)
Lucifer falling to earth is a symbolic statement of the King of Babylon(Nebby)
losing the power and majesty that God gave him before the people and nations--

Simply it was MEN in every case--Men has always been God's enemies and have set theirselves against God to do evil

 

[percho]

MEN were referred to as Serpents in the new testament-not an entity
there was NO entity addressing God in Job it was MEN--adversaries of Job
NO being that tempted Christ--it was MEN(High Priest and his angels)
Lucifer falling to earth is a symbolic statement of the King of Babylon(Nebby)
losing the power and majesty that God gave him before the people and nations--

Simply it was MEN in every case--Men has always been God's enemies and have set theirselves against God to do evil

Who was the man deceiving Eve in the garden?

 

[HisWitness]

Who was the man deceiving Eve in the garden?

Adam was the man--he was the serpent

when jesus referred to your father the devil to the jews--he was referring to adam--he was a murderer and thief from the beginning (beginning of creation)

Men were referred to as Serpents in the new testament

No where do you find an entity in the scriptures--theres always MEN behind it

 

[Aaron]

Well I be kicked and dragged through a bucket o' lard.

We got us a real live Sadducee here!

 

[HisWitness]

Well I be kicked and dragged through a bucket o' lard.

We got us a real live Sadducee here!

really ?? what scripture do you base it on

 

[convicted1]

Adam was the man--he was the serpent

when jesus referred to your father the devil to the jews--he was referring to adam--he was a murderer and thief from the beginning (beginning of creation)

Men were referred to as Serpents in the new testament

No where do you find an entity in the scriptures--theres always MEN behind it

So, lemme see here.......Adam deceived Eve and then she, in turn, deceived Adam, and he died spiritually? What caused Adam to sin prior to partaking of the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

 

[preacher4truth]

Adam was the man--he was the serpent

when jesus referred to your father the devil to the jews--he was referring to adam--he was a murderer and thief from the beginning (beginning of creation)

Men were referred to as Serpents in the new testament

No where do you find an entity in the scriptures--theres always MEN behind it

Not even close there sir. :thumbs:

Whomever has hoodwinked you did a mighty fine job. Wonder, was it a man or an entity? Remember the god of this world that blinds the minds of men, wonder which dude he is since in your theology it is nothing but a man? That one that tempted Jesus in the wilderness, since it wasn't an entity, which dude was he?

 

[DrJamesAch]

Adam was the man--he was the serpent

when jesus referred to your father the devil to the jews--he was referring to adam--he was a murderer and thief from the beginning (beginning of creation)

Men were referred to as Serpents in the new testament

No where do you find an entity in the scriptures--theres always MEN behind it

If you read Genesis 3, there were separate judgments pronounced on the woman, on the man, and on the serpent. Three different judgments. If Adam was the serpent, there would have been only 2 judgments.

Jesus also called the Pharisees 'whited sepulchers' in Matthew 23. So does that mean they were made out of concrete and stone?

Adam was provided redemption for his sin in Genesis chapter 3, whereas Satan has been judged and will spend eternity in the lake of fire. Rev 20:10.
Regardless of what you think the 'lake of fire' means (from your previous arguments on this issue), it is clear that Satan is eternally separated from God. You can't say that about Adam. Adam was made human, Satan was made as a cherub. Two entirely different "entities".

 

[HisWitness]

Not even close there sir. :thumbs:

Whomever has hoodwinked you did a mighty fine job. Wonder, was it a man or an entity? Remember the god of this world that blinds the minds of men, wonder which dude he is since in your theology it is nothing but a man? That one that tempted Jesus in the wilderness, since it wasn't an entity, which dude was he?

High Priest and his angels of that day--who blinded the minds of the people--High Priest was the god of that world

 

[HisWitness]

If you read Genesis 3, there were separate judgments pronounced on the woman, on the man, and on the serpent. Three different judgments. If Adam was the serpent, there would have been only 2 judgments.

Jesus also called the Pharisees 'whited sepulchers' in Matthew 23. So does that mean they were made out of concrete and stone?

Adam was provided redemption for his sin in Genesis chapter 3, whereas Satan has been judged and will spend eternity in the lake of fire. Rev 20:10.
Regardless of what you think the 'lake of fire' means (from your previous arguments on this issue), it is clear that Satan is eternally separated from God. You can't say that about Adam. Adam was made human, Satan was made as a cherub. Two entirely different "entities".

There you go again adding some fallen angel in there--you can prove NO where in the scripture that that event even happened in scriptures--totally your speculation :godisgood::godisgood:

Seperated from God ??? you believe God 's presence is not there at the lake of fire--here is a verse to show you different friend.....

Revelation 14-10:: The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God,which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation;and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone IN THE PRESENCE OF THE HOLY ANGELS AND IN THE PRESENCE ON THE LAMB--Christ and his angels presence is there at the lake of fire--so therefore they are not separated from God--He's there and they can see him

 

[HisWitness]

Not even close there sir. :thumbs:

Whomever has hoodwinked you did a mighty fine job. Wonder, was it a man or an entity? Remember the god of this world that blinds the minds of men, wonder which dude he is since in your theology it is nothing but a man? That one that tempted Jesus in the wilderness, since it wasn't an entity, which dude was he?

maybe not close to your view of things--but as I ask in other posts--show me the event in scripture where a angel sinned and was cast from God's abode--its not there--you will offer scriptures out of context and throw in your entity god in there--but it doesn't belong:godisgood::godisgood:

 

[HisWitness]

If you read Genesis 3, there were separate judgments pronounced on the woman, on the man, and on the serpent. Three different judgments. If Adam was the serpent, there would have been only 2 judgments.

Jesus also called the Pharisees 'whited sepulchers' in Matthew 23. So does that mean they were made out of concrete and stone?

Adam was provided redemption for his sin in Genesis chapter 3, whereas Satan has been judged and will spend eternity in the lake of fire. Rev 20:10.
Regardless of what you think the 'lake of fire' means (from your previous arguments on this issue), it is clear that Satan is eternally separated from God. You can't say that about Adam. Adam was made human, Satan was made as a cherub. Two entirely different "entities".

How wrong are you on using Satan as a name for 1 person in every text and statement you make--the scriptures does no such thing--Satan was never a name but a WORD with adversary as the meaning--which could apply to anything--do you think that Peter was Satan also ?--do you think peter was possessed by the evil entity(according to your view)--then does the entity have power to possess saints anytime he chooses--you are giving glory and honor and power to some fallen entity that the scriptures never speak about friend.

Now the truth of the matter concerning Peter--all the disciples and jews had thought Christ would come and set up a earthly kingdom at that time--so when jesus said he was gonna be taken and put to death--then the TRUTH conflicted with what peter and the jews believed--therefore Peter rebuked Jesus because of the matter--Jesus said to Peter Satan(adversary) get thee behind me--Peter was being the adversary with his false tradition against the truth---NO where does it imply a entity possessing Peter and taking control of his voice--utter foolishness :jesus::jesus::jesus:

 

[DrJamesAch]

There you go again adding some fallen angel in there--you can prove NO where in the scripture that that event even happened in scriptures--totally your speculation :godisgood::godisgood:

Seperated from God ??? you believe God 's presence is not there at the lake of fire--here is a verse to show you different friend.....

Revelation 14-10:: The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God,which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation;and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone IN THE PRESENCE OF THE HOLY ANGELS AND IN THE PRESENCE ON THE LAMB--Christ and his angels presence is there at the lake of fire--so therefore they are not separated from God--He's there and they can see him

"And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he [SINGULAR]was cast out into the earth, and his [SINGULAR] angels were cast out with him" Revelation 12:9

"In that day the Lord with his sore and great and strong sword shall punish leviathan the piercing serpent, even leviathan that crooked serpent; and he shall slay the dragon that is in the sea." Isaiah 27:1

"Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down? ....His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal....Out of his nostrils goeth smoke, as out of a seething pot or caldron...His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth...He beholdeth all high things: he is a king over all the children of pride" Job 41.

"Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created." Ezekiel 28:13

Was the king of Tyre ever in the Garden of Eden?? Don't think so.

Quite a bit of difference between Satan and Adam. It is you who is doing the speculating because every reference you have made is an appeal to your own understanding while ignoring what the Bible says in black and white.

 

[HisWitness]

"And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he [SINGULAR]was cast out into the earth, and his [SINGULAR] angels were cast out with him" Revelation 12:9

"In that day the Lord with his sore and great and strong sword shall punish leviathan the piercing serpent, even leviathan that crooked serpent; and he shall slay the dragon that is in the sea." Isaiah 27:1

"Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down? ....His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal....Out of his nostrils goeth smoke, as out of a seething pot or caldron...His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth...He beholdeth all high things: he is a king over all the children of pride" Job 41.

"Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created." Ezekiel 28:13

Was the king of Tyre ever in the Garden of Eden?? Don't think so.

Quite a bit of difference between Satan and Adam. It is you who is doing the speculating because every reference you have made is an appeal to your own understanding while ignoring what the Bible says in black and white.

just as I posted above--taking scriptures out of their context and adding a fallen angel into them--your are doing exactly what God said NOT to do at the end of Revelation--adding and taking away from scriptures

King of Tyre was a MAN read the first couple of verses at the beginning of that chapter--it plainly says he was a MAN--the same language was used for the king of Babylon(Nebby) he was a MAN

only scripture it seems that folks here have to go to prove their beloved Satan was an angel fallen from heaven is that Dragon text.

again taken out of context --but since you will argue on and on with the same ole nonsense does me no good to keep repeating what the scriptures are meaning in their context :love2::love2::love2:

 

[DrJamesAch]

just as I posted above--taking scriptures out of their context and adding a fallen angel into them--your are doing exactly what God said NOT to do at the end of Revelation--adding and taking away from scriptures

King of Tyre was a MAN read the first couple of verses at the beginning of that chapter--it plainly says he was a MAN--the same language was used for the king of Babylon(Nebby) he was a MAN

only scripture it seems that folks here have to go to prove their beloved Satan was an angel fallen from heaven is that Dragon text.

again taken out of context --but since you will argue on and on with the same ole nonsense does me no good to keep repeating what the scriptures are meaning in their context :love2::love2::love2:

In order to show that something is OUT of context, you have to show where it is IN context. Revelation 12 is IN context with a description of a great red dragon in Revelation 12:3. This dragon is said to be the accuser of the brethren, which fits with Zech 3:1 where Satan stood before the Lord to accuse Joshua, it fits with Job chapters 1-2, and the description of the dragon itself in Revelation 12:9 SPECIFICALLY calls the dragon SATAN and specifically calls the dragon the DEVIL, and uses the singular pronoun "HE" and "HIS" that indicates all of the descriptions of dragon, serpent, Satan and devil are all referring to the same being.

You are now trying to change the issue from claiming that Satan is Adam into one about whether there was a fallen angel. I personally do not believe that angels and cherubs are the same thing, but the Bible still describes Satan as operating AS an "angel of light" in 2 Cor 11. And it hardly fits that a "high priest" is the "god of this world" who is capable of blinding the minds of those around the world. You are giving even the most sinister priest way too much credit.

And nobody said that the king of Tyre was not a man, but often times in the Bible a prophesy or description of a different event or person is described in the middle of a general text. This is done all throughout the Psalms and Isaiah with regards to prophecies about Christ. What you have IGNORED is that Ezekiel 28 said that the person described in verse 13 was IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN.

Eden was sealed and guarded after God removed Adam and Eve. Gen 3:24. So even if the King of Tyre have traveled back in time a thousand years+ to when this actually happened, he still wouldn't have been able to get into the Garden of Eden, so this part of Ezekiel 28 is CLEARLY NOT ABOUT THE KING OF TYRE.

Even though there are great differences among believers on many doctrines, there is at least agreement of a few things. However,you are out in far left field all by yourself on this one.

 

[HisWitness]

In order to show that something is OUT of context, you have to show where it is IN context. Revelation 12 is IN context with a description of a great red dragon in Revelation 12:3. This dragon is said to be the accuser of the brethren, which fits with Zech 3:1 where Satan stood before the Lord to accuse Joshua, it fits with Job chapters 1-2, and the description of the dragon itself in Revelation 12:9 SPECIFICALLY calls the dragon SATAN and specifically calls the dragon the DEVIL, and uses the singular pronoun "HE" and "HIS" that indicates all of the descriptions of dragon, serpent, Satan and devil are all referring to the same being.

You are now trying to change the issue from claiming that Satan is Adam into one about whether there was a fallen angel. I personally do not believe that angels and cherubs are the same thing, but the Bible still describes Satan as operating AS an "angel of light" in 2 Cor 11. And it hardly fits that a "high priest" is the "god of this world" who is capable of blinding the minds of those around the world. You are giving even the most sinister priest way too much credit.

And nobody said that the king of Tyre was not a man, but often times in the Bible a prophesy or description of a different event or person is described in the middle of a general text. This is done all throughout the Psalms and Isaiah with regards to prophecies about Christ. What you have IGNORED is that Ezekiel 28 said that the person described in verse 13 was IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN.

Eden was sealed and guarded after God removed Adam and Eve. Gen 3:24. So even if the King of Tyre have traveled back in time a thousand years+ to when this actually happened, he still wouldn't have been able to get into the Garden of Eden, so this part of Ezekiel 28 is CLEARLY NOT ABOUT THE KING OF TYRE.

Even though there are great differences among believers on many doctrines, there is at least agreement of a few things. However,you are out in far left field all by yourself on this one.

i see that we agree to disagree-:godisgood::godisgood::godisgood:

we will see who really is in far left field on this subject one day and its not gonna be pretty