Is there A Baptism In the holy Spirit For today?

[Iconoclast]

Where does it say Acts is just a transition period? Again, no where in scriptures does it say this!

It is taught all through the book.Listen....if you want to remain in error, you can...that is your choice.

If you just want to make it up as you go....go ahead. The whole church has not been wrong since the apostolic church.

The book shows the end of the Ot theocracy, into the Nt church...that is transition. The gospel goes to Jews, then samaritans, then gentiles, that is transition. The teaching goes from Ot/ to NT...that is transition.


That is why signs were given to apostles...read acts 15....should all believers be circumcised.....no...that is transition.

Guess what the word transition is not used....the teaching is in every chapter.

You are not answering to romans 6, eph 4, and 1thess 1....you just ignore what is plainly spoken of.

 

[Iconoclast]

THe promise is the Holy Spirit! It was not just for a few and it was not just for the Jew! He is still here and he works the same way!

IT is till we all come in the unity of the faith! Do you see unity of the faith?

Jude says to contend for the faith that was once for all time delivered to the saints......we have it...you are trying to change it....DHK is telling you correctly.

 

[Iconoclast]

There are numerous documented accounts of healing, miracles, and people being raised from the dead over the past year alone all over the world. It is love that drives these people.

This is not happening anywhere.Some claim it is...but it is not.:thumbs:

 

[DHK]

THe promise is the Holy Spirit! It was not just for a few and it was not just for the Jew! He is still here and he works the same way!

IT is till we all come in the unity of the faith! Do you see unity of the faith?

You may as well command God to speak to you through a burning bush as to claim those Scriptures. That is how bad you are butchering the Scriptures. Look again at the verses you are you using. Here is one of them.

Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Is this what you are doing?
Are you in Jerusalem. Are you waiting in Jerusalem?
You are not to depart from Jerusalem until the Holy Spirit comes.
The promised that the Holy Spirit would come, and that he would come at a specified time and place in Jerusalem?
Are you there, or were you there?

The time and place was at the Temple in Jerusalem on the Day of Pentecost approximately 30 A.D. Were you there at that time?

This is how you are taking Scripture out of context. It does not apply to you. It is a historical event.

Then, when the Holy Spirit did come (chapter two), this is what happened:

Acts 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

Is that what happened to you?

You cannot establish doctrine from historical events?
Does God speak to you through burning bushes as well?

 

[awaken]

It is taught all through the book.Listen....if you want to remain in error, you can...that is your choice.

If you just want to make it up as you go....go ahead. The whole church has not been wrong since the apostolic church.

The book shows the end of the Ot theocracy, into the Nt church...that is transition. The gospel goes to Jews, then samaritans, then gentiles, that is transition. The teaching goes from Ot/ to NT...that is transition.


That is why signs were given to apostles...read acts 15....should all believers be circumcised.....no...that is transition.

Guess what the word transition is not used....the teaching is in every chapter.

I am not making it up...I have shown scriptures to back up everything I believe.

You forgot the uttermost parts of the earth! We are still witnessing the power of the Holy Spirit!

The church age....the Holy Spirit on earth..is still here! Acts is not just transitional! I do not see the Holy Spirit working different now than he did then.

 

[Iconoclast]

I am not making it up...I have shown scriptures to back up everything I believe.

You forgot the uttermost parts of the earth! We are still witnessing the power of the Holy Spirit!

The church age....the Holy Spirit on earth..is still here! Acts is not just transitional! I do not see the Holy Spirit working different now than he did then.

We posted at the same time....you are not answering to the posts dealing with 1thess 1, romans 6, eph 4

Acts is the acts of the Holy Spirit, through the Apostles.

 

[awaken]

Jude says to contend for the faith that was once for all time delivered to the saints......we have it...you are trying to change it....DHK is telling you correctly.

What is this faith? Will God find faith when he comes! Faith is not a one time teaching!

 

[awaken]

We posted at the same time....you are not answering to the posts dealing with 1thess 1, romans 6, eph 4

Acts is the acts of the Holy Spirit, through the Apostles.

Which post are you talking about?

And the Holy Spirit was not just given to the Apostles.
Luke was written about the ministry of Jesus...Acts was written about His continuing ministry through the Holy Spirit. Acts is our best guidebook in understanding the working of the Holy Spirit through the church and in the world.

Acts gives us a profound understanding of the nature and mission of the church.

The day of Pentecost is the day the church was anointed with Power for her mission. This parallels the experience of Jesus himself. At his baptism, thirty years after his birth, Jesus was anointed by the Holy Spirit for his Messianic mission!

 

[awaken]

This is what Spirit baptism does for all believers....Jesus died a covenant death for the elect.When he died, they died in him, we he rose, we rose in Him.
The church as the Nt temple was Spirit baptized at pentecost. We were not born yet. The Spirit when we are born from above,makes it effectual to us....Not many Spirit baptisms...one Baptism eph4,1 cor 12:13

I found it! I will agree that is is one baptism. But they each were baptized in Acts 2, 10 19 etc. It did not just come down on that day and that was it! Jesus baptizes each of us!

 

[awaken]

You may as well command God to speak to you through a burning bush as to claim those Scriptures. That is how bad you are butchering the Scriptures. Look again at the verses you are you using.

God did not promise the day of Pentecost that he would speak to us through a burning bush! (Even though burning bush...tongues of fire...maybe something to look into...just kiddding!)

Here is one of them.

Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Is this what you are doing?
Are you in Jerusalem. Are you waiting in Jerusalem?

Where in the Bible after the day of Pentecost does it tell you to tarry for the baptism? It does not! They were waiting for the Day of Pentecost to come, because that is when the Holy Spirit was poured out upon the church. Once it was poured out, you do not see anywhere that you have to wait! It is already here!

You are not to depart from Jerusalem until the Holy Spirit comes.
The promised that the Holy Spirit would come, and that he would come at a specified time and place in Jerusalem?
Are you there, or were you there?

Get real! Where does it say we had to be there to receive? Once Jesus poured out the promise of the Holy Spirit it is available to all who BELIEVE..."as many as the Lord our God shall call"

The time and place was at the Temple in Jerusalem on the Day of Pentecost approximately 30 A.D. Were you there at that time?

This is how you are taking Scripture out of context. It does not apply to you. It is a historical event.

I can not believe what I just read! you are telling me that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is not available to me!

Then, when the Holy Spirit did come (chapter two), this is what happened:

Acts 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

Is that what happened to you?

Is that what happen to Cornelius? What about the certain disciples in Acts 19?

You cannot establish doctrine from historical events?
Does God speak to you through burning bushes as well?

You are wrong if you think that the baptism is not for the church today! And you have not shown that we cannot experience this!

 

[DHK]

The baptism of the Holy Spirit as an historical event.

First, it was a definite promise to the Apostles. He would come at a definite time:

[FONT=&quot]John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]John 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The command to wait:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
They go to Jerusalem as commanded, and they wait there.


[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They go to an upper room and pray (probably in the Temple somewhere).
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:13 And when they were come in, they went up into an upper room, where abode both Peter, and James, and John, and Andrew, Philip, and Thomas, Bartholomew, and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus, and Simon Zelotes, and Judas the brother of James.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

Then on the next day, the Day of Pentecost comes:
[FONT=&quot]Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.[/FONT]
--This is a historical event never again to be repeated in history.

There was a promise specifically given to them in the gospels.
There was a command in Acts 1 to wait in Jerusalem.
Finally, on the Day of Pentecost, according to the promise given, and the command obeyed, the Holy Spirit came, as the Lord said He would.

This will never again happen in history; never again happened in the Book of Acts. It is a one time event. Similar events happened in Acts 10 and 19, but nothing like this ever happened again in all of history.

 

[awaken]

The baptism of the Holy Spirit as an historical event.

First, it was a definite promise to the Apostles. He would come at a definite time:

[FONT=&quot]John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]John 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The command to wait:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
They go to Jerusalem as commanded, and they wait there.


[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They go to an upper room and pray (probably in the Temple somewhere).
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Acts 1:13 And when they were come in, they went up into an upper room, where abode both Peter, and James, and John, and Andrew, Philip, and Thomas, Bartholomew, and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus, and Simon Zelotes, and Judas the brother of James.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

Then on the next day, the Day of Pentecost comes:
[FONT=&quot]Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.[/FONT]
--This is a historical event never again to be repeated in history.

There was a promise specifically given to them in the gospels.
There was a command in Acts 1 to wait in Jerusalem.
Finally, on the Day of Pentecost, according to the promise given, and the command obeyed, the Holy Spirit came, as the Lord said He would.

This will never again happen in history; never again happened in the Book of Acts. It is a one time event. Similar events happened in Acts 10 and 19, but nothing like this ever happened again in all of history.

I have said over and over this event is a one time fulfilment of prophesy. IT was the promise of the Holy Spirit! He is here now for all to receive!
Acts 10 and 19 is an example of how we can receive it now! ONce the Spirit is here we can all receive!

"I will pour my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy..."

 

[DHK]

God did not promise the day of Pentecost that he would speak to us through a burning bush! (Even though burning bush...tongues of fire...maybe something to look into...just kiddding!)

God never promised anyone outside of those 120 on the Day of Pentecost that they would ever have that same experience. He never made that same promise to anyone else, never!

Where in the Bible after the day of Pentecost does it tell you to tarry for the baptism? It does not! They were waiting for the Day of Pentecost to come, because that is when the Holy Spirit was poured out upon the church. Once it was poured out, you do not see anywhere that you have to wait! It is already here!

Exactly right! Therefore you need to admit you are entirely in the wrong to use verses like Acts 1:4; 1:8 to try and prove your case. You are using Scripture out of context. In Acts 1:8, for example, "you shall receive power after that the Holy Spirit shall come upon you," it refers to the Day of Pentecost, not you being a witness. It referred to them tarrying in Jerusalem. That "part" of the verse is not applicable to you.

Get real! Where does it say we had to be there to receive? Once Jesus poured out the promise of the Holy Spirit it is available to all who BELIEVE..."as many as the Lord our God shall call"

It is a historical event. What happened has already happened. You are looking for a subsequent experience based on an historical event. It won't happen. One gets all of the Holy Spirit he needs on the day he gets saved. He gets indwelt, baptized, and set apart. The only other action the Holy Spirit will take is to fill the believer when the believer totally submits to Him in obedience for His service.
[quote\I can not believe what I just read! you are telling me that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is not available to me! [/quote]
No, you were baptized of the Holy Spirit when you were saved. There is no subsequent mystical experience called the baptism of the Spirit, apart from salvation itself.

Is that what happen to Cornelius? What about the certain disciples in Acts 19?

You are wrong if you think that the baptism is not for the church today! And you have not shown that we cannot experience this!

You have not shown that we can, and you cannot even begin to demonstrate this doctrine without the book of Acts, a book of history, a book where the church is in transition, where the church is in its infancy. The only other time it is mentioned is in 1Cor.12-14, and even then it is not in a positive light. It is not spoken of in any other epistle.

Both the events with Cornelius, and with the disciples in Acts 19 have already been explained. They were signs for the Jews.

 

[DHK]

I have said over and over this event is a one time fulfilment of prophesy. IT was the promise of the Holy Spirit! He is here now for all to receive!
Acts 10 and 19 is an example of how we can receive it now! ONce the Spirit is here we can all receive!

"I will pour my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy..."

You continue to yank Scripture out of context. The above Scripture is for the Jews only. What tribe do you belong to?

Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

Acts 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
--That is the house of Israel.

 

[awaken]

God never promised anyone outside of those 120 on the Day of Pentecost that they would ever have that same experience. He never made that same promise to anyone else, never!

THen you deny Acts 2:39!

Exactly right! Therefore you need to admit you are entirely in the wrong to use verses like Acts 1:4; 1:8 to try and prove your case. You are using Scripture out of context. In Acts 1:8, for example, "you shall receive power after that the Holy Spirit shall come upon you," it refers to the Day of Pentecost, not you being a witness. It referred to them tarrying in Jerusalem. That "part" of the verse is not applicable to you.

Acts 2:39 says that it is! Because God has called me! Acts 2: 17 says it will be poured out on ALL flesh! That includes me! I am walking in the power of the Holy Spirit!

It is a historical event. What happened has already happened. You are looking for a subsequent experience based on an historical event. It won't happen. One gets all of the Holy Spirit he needs on the day he gets saved. He gets indwelt, baptized, and set apart. The only other action the Holy Spirit will take is to fill the believer when the believer totally submits to Him in obedience for His service.
[quoteI can not believe what I just read! you are telling me that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is not available to me!

No, you were baptized of the Holy Spirit when you were saved. There is no subsequent mystical experience called the baptism of the Spirit, apart from salvation itself. [/quote] So you believe it all happens at once! THat is fine! Cornelius is a good example of that! But there are other examples that is happened seperate..what are you going to do with those scriptures?

You have not shown that we can, and you cannot even begin to demonstrate this doctrine without the book of Acts, a book of history, a book where the church is in transition, where the church is in its infancy. The only other time it is mentioned is in 1Cor.12-14, and even then it is not in a positive light. It is not spoken of in any other epistle.

Funny, those in Corinthians are walking in the manifestation of the Holy Spirit.

Both the events with Cornelius, and with the disciples in Acts 19 have already been explained. They were signs for the Jews.

How was 19 a sign for the Jews?

 

[awaken]

You continue to yank Scripture out of context. The above Scripture is for the Jews only. What tribe do you belong to?

Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

Acts 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
--That is the house of Israel.

So now you are saying only Jews can manifest the Holy Spirit?
Who are those that are afar off? Gentiles? (Eph. 2:13)
All Flesh is ALL flesh!!

 

[DHK]

So now you are saying only Jews can manifest the Holy Spirit?
Who are those that are afar off? Gentiles? (Eph. 2:13)
All Flesh is ALL flesh!!

Acts 2:19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:

Why didn't these events happen yet?
They won't happen until the Millennial Kingdom has come or is about to come, and when that time comes then, as the Lord says:

"I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,"

But not until then.

Pentecost was about 30 A.D. The church at Ephesus was in existence only about 20 years later. That cannot be considered "afar off," as you are pointing to. It is hardly even one generation. Thus the reference to Ephesians doesn't even make sense.

 

[awaken]

Acts 2:19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:

Why didn't these events happen yet?
They won't happen until the Millennial Kingdom has come or is about to come, and when that time comes then, as the Lord says:

"I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,"

But not until then.

Pentecost was about 30 A.D. The church at Ephesus was in existence only about 20 years later. That cannot be considered "afar off," as you are pointing to. It is hardly even one generation. Thus the reference to Ephesians doesn't even make sense.

Acts 2:16 "But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;" What is this? and what is that?

Eph. 2:13 "But now In Christ Jesus ye (Gentiles) who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ"

 

[DHK]

THen you deny Acts 2:39!

1. Acts 2:39 has nothing to do with the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
2. Acts 2:39 has nothing to do with speaking in tongues.
3. Acts 2:39 speaks of salvation, and has nothing to do with the 120 speaking in tongues at all. Their experience, as I said, was a one-time experience never again to be repeated in history. What has that to do with Acts 2:39??

Acts 2:39 says that it is! Because God has called me! Acts 2: 17 says it will be poured out on ALL flesh! That includes me! I am walking in the power of the Holy Spirit!

Now your experience dictates what the Bible teaches. Is experience more important than doctrine. Satan teaches doctrine too. Many Charismatics have spoken in tongues through the power of demons. I hope you realize that.
God's Spirit has not been poured out on all flesh. That is a prophesy that has not yet been fulfilled, just like the signs and wonders in the heavens have not yet been seen. Thus, no, it does not include you. Plus the fact it was a promise written to the Jews. If the Spirit had been poured out on all flesh then 100% of the world's population would be saved. Is it?

So you believe it all happens at once! THat is fine! Cornelius is a good example of that! But there are other examples that is happened seperate..what are you going to do with those scriptures?

Examine the Scriptures in their context. See what each one is teaching. The Bible does not contradict itself.

Funny, those in Corinthians are walking in the manifestation of the Holy Spirit.

No they weren't; Paul had to rebuke them.

How was 19 a sign for the Jews?

Those that were baptized, and then spoke in tongues and prophesied were Jews. It was a sign to them and those around them, that both Paul and his message were of God. They, previous to that time, had only known of John the Baptist's message. They needed authentication. That is what tongues were for--a sign to authenticate an apostle; to be a sign to the Jew that this was from God.

 

[DHK]

Acts 2:16 "But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;" What is this? and what is that?

Eph. 2:13 "But now In Christ Jesus ye (Gentiles) who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ"

So it is the same English phrase!
That makes no difference. They are used in different context.
In Acts 2 Peter is speaking to Jews. And those Jews that he is speaking to are not even saved.