Is There Such A Thing As A Just War?

[Andy T.]

Great points, HankD.

 

[JustChristian]

JC

You are just "shucking and jiving" trying to cover for your "dear leader".

What does this have to do with anything? Completely useless post.

 

[JustChristian]

Look,

Obviously when the time comes to obey God rather than man I would obey God.

But let it be known, as old as I am, I would still go and defend the lives of American citizens if called upon by my government to fight a just war such as Vietnam and our present war on radical Islam.

You can create all the scenarios you want, but to fight the present here-and-now terrorism of radical Islam is a just war.

To fight the spread of godless murderous communism is a just war.
Remember Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge massacre of 2,000,000 innocents?



http://www.unitedhumanrights.org/Genocide/pol_pot.htm

This slaughter followed directly after we pulled out of Vietnam.
IMO, the peaceniks which demonstrated against the Vietnam war are partially responsible for the blood of these people and the demonstration of this godless and satanic blood lust.

Had we stayed in Vietnam and been allowed to fight the war in the manner in which these murderers deserved, the spread of communism to Cambodia would have certainly been squelched.

Once we left they were free to reap satan's harvest.

Our current president proved on February 17th, 2009 that he will support the war against the terrorism of radical Islam.
At least he has that to his credit.

Radical Islam which says strap a bomb on yourself, set it off and murder as many people as you can: men, women and children. Even other Moslems in the name of their deity.

Usually in a place where they know more innocents will be killed than military.

Where is your outrage for those acts resulting in "collateral damage"?



HankD

If we had never repeated the mistake of the French by going into Viet Nam this blood letting when we left would never have occurred. The same is true if there is a Civil War in Iraq when we pull out. It never would have occured if we had never invaded.

I'm not saying that Hussein was an admirable leader. He was a despot. But he was a despot that the United States supported during the Iran-Iraq war. We supported him when it was politically expedient and then turned on him when it was politically expedient. That's the way international politics works. Let's not fool ourselves in thinking that the U.S. is always doing things for the best of reasons because that's not true.

Our country has certain strategic objectives. Christians have other objectives. When there's a clash between these true Christians will not support their country's action such as unjustr wars.

 

[OldRegular]

Originally Posted by OldRegular
JC

You are just "shucking and jiving" trying to cover for your "dear leader".

Retort Posted by JC
What does this have to do with anything? Completely useless post.

Not at all JC. It gives the motive for most of your posts.

 

[Andy T.]

If we had never repeated the mistake of the French by going into Viet Nam this blood letting when we left would never have occurred.

Wrong. Quite wrong. Any support for this?

When there's a clash between these true Christians will not support their country's action such as unjustr wars.

There's the JC we all know and love. Enough with that mushy relativism - we're back to questioning others' salvation and calling them murderers. Frankly, I would rather see that than the mushy-headed relativism. But the fact is, you have no Biblical leg to stand on.

 

[matt wade]

Talk about "shucking and jiving"!

Once again, how about actually answering the question OldRegular. I've bolded it again so that you can see it clearly. When the US invaded Afghanistan, should the Christians in that country fought in a war against the US?

Hey OldRegular! You are still shucking and jiving on this question. How about answering it?

 

[JustChristian]

Wrong. Quite wrong. Any support for this?


There's the JC we all know and love. Enough with that mushy relativism - we're back to questioning others' salvation and calling them murderers. Frankly, I would rather see that than the mushy-headed relativism. But the fact is, you have no Biblical leg to stand on.

Nice ad hominem if there is such again. Actually, you have to decide what you believe and what you think Christians should do in times of moral ambiguity for yourself. I have to decide for myself. We both have to explaijn our decisions to Jesus on Judgment Day.

 

[JustChristian]

Not at all JC. It gives the motive for most of your posts.

Another wasted post. Why bother if you're not going to say anything except insults?

 

[OldRegular]

Originally Posted by matt wade
Talk about "shucking and jiving"!
Once again, how about actually answering the question OldRegular. I've bolded it again so that you can see it clearly. When the US invaded Afghanistan, should the Christians in that country fought in a war against the US?
Hey OldRegular! You are still shucking and jiving on this question. How about answering it?

I am not shucking and jiving I am ignoring an asinine question that is not designed to elicit information but create discord.

I have given you what the Scripture states about the duty of the citizen. I believe you indicated that there was one Christian in Afghanistan. I would assume that being a Christian he would have made the correct decision, unlike many on this forum.

 

[matt wade]

I am not shucking and jiving I am ignoring an asinine question that is not designed to elicit information but create discord.

I have given you what the Scripture states about the duty of the citizen. I believe you indicated that there was one Christian in Afghanistan. I would assume that being a Christian he would have made the correct decision, unlike many on this forum.

Do you honestly believe he was the only Christian in Afghanistan? You are sadly mistaken.

OK..so from your response I can infer that you think the Christian in Afghanistan should have fought against the US and sided with the Taliban. Thanks for the info. It's sad that you say Christian's should side with the side of hate and terrorism.

 

[HankD]

Do you honestly believe he was the only Christian in Afghanistan? You are sadly mistaken.

OK..so from your response I can infer that you think the Christian in Afghanistan should have fought against the US and sided with the Taliban. Thanks for the info. It's sad that you say Christian's should side with the side of hate and terrorism.

That is exactly what happened under the reign of the Third Reich. Many German Christians sided with Hitler in his hate and terror. It's not that they should have but that they did. Obviously they shouldn't have but they were mesmerized by Hitler and mis-placed patriotism which turned into a blood lust from satan. They should have know. Hitler made know the "Final Solution" in his book Mein Kampf (My Struggle) in 1925.

As for Saddam Hussein, we supported him because we wanted him to continue his war effort with Iran. Remember? they held the hostages under the Carter administration and let them go the first day of the Reagan administration.

Today they have openly declared that Israel must be removed from the face of the earth.

While it's not the most noble method it was true then and still it's still true now (politically speaking):
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
But yes, Saddam proved to be a mass murderer as well.

War is hell as has been repeated many times and it sounds like the present complaining comes from those who haven't experienced it apart from books.

When the bullets come whistling by (and it might happen here on the soil of our beloved nation) or one of your family members has his/her head sawn off of their body or killed in an kamikaze suicide mission here on the homefront then you might change your mind about whether a war is "just" or not.

3000 American citizens have died here on the homefront along with hundreds of others overseas at the hands of these fanatics.

Since some of you can't let it go then I will repeat myself as well.

The war against the terrorism of radical Islamic is a just war.
Those nations who side with them will pay the price.

Now, even President Obama concurs with Mr Bush on that premise as he recently sent the order to deploy 17,000 additional troops to Afghanistan. This adds to the 36,000 already there by almost 50%.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/washington/18web-troops.html

They/we are going there for the express purpose of killing those who want to remove our heads.

As a nation we have that Scriptural right given in Genesis 9 and Romans 13.

As an individual, you have the right to decide for yourself according to your conscience and the leading of the Spirit in your involvement in any of our present wars.

If you pay your taxes then you are supporting first hand the war in Iraq/Afghanistan along with President Obama and his executive order.

Of course one could refuse to pay their taxes as some pacifists have done and face the consequence of that decision. Prison.


HankD

 

[JustChristian]

That is exactly what happened under the reign of the Third Reich. Many German Christians sided with Hitler in his hate and terror. It's not that they should have but that they did. Obviously they shouldn't have but they were mesmerized by Hitler and mis-placed patriotism which turned into a blood lust from satan. They should have know. Hitler made know the "Final Solution" in his book Mein Kampf (My Struggle) in 1925.

As for Saddam Hussein, we supported him because we wanted him to continue his war effort with Iran. Remember? they held the hostages under the Carter administration and let them go the first day of the Reagan administration.

Today they have openly declared that Israel must be removed from the face of the earth.

While it's not the most noble method it was true then and still it's still true now (politically speaking):
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
But yes, Saddam proved to be a mass murderer as well.

War is hell as has been repeated many times and it sounds like the present complaining comes from those who haven't experienced it apart from books.

When the bullets come whistling by (and it might happen here on the soil of our beloved nation) or one of your family members has his/her head sawn off of their body or killed in an kamikaze suicide mission here on the homefront then you might change your mind about whether a war is "just" or not.

3000 American citizens have died here on the homefront along with hundreds of others overseas at the hands of these fanatics.

Since some of you can't let it go then I will repeat myself as well.

The war against the terrorism of radical Islamic is a just war.
Those nations who side with them will pay the price.

Now, even President Obama concurs with Mr Bush on that premise as he recently sent the order to deploy 17,000 additional troops to Afghanistan. This adds to the 36,000 already there by almost 50%.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/washington/18web-troops.html

They/we are going there for the express purpose of killing those who want to remove our heads.

As a nation we have that Scriptural right given in Genesis 9 and Romans 13.

As an individual, you have the right to decide for yourself according to your conscience and the leading of the Spirit in your involvement in any of our present wars.

If you pay your taxes then you are supporting first hand the war in Iraq/Afghanistan along with President Obama and his executive order.

Of course one could refuse to pay their taxes as some pacifists have done and face the consequence of that decision. Prison.


HankD

Obama added to the troops that Bush had left in Afghanistan because he believed that that was where bin Laden was and that it was a priority to actually attack and take into custody the "terrorists." Personally I'm not sure I agree with him because I believe the real terrorists were in America not Afghanistan. But that's another story.

 

[HankD]

Obama added to the troops that Bush had left in Afghanistan because he believed that that was where bin Laden was and that it was a priority to actually attack and take into custody the "terrorists." Personally I'm not sure I agree with him because I believe the real terrorists were in America not Afghanistan. But that's another story.

The "why" of It doesn't matter, President Obama has proven he is a man of war. For that he deserves credit.
He has sworn to uphold the Constitution and protect this nation from all enemies foreign and domestic and he is doing just that with this troop deployment.

He also supports our close relationship with Israel and their defense:

My view is that the United States' special relationship with Israel obligates us to be helpful to them in the search for credible partners with whom they can make peace, while also supporting Israel in defending itself against enemies sworn to its destruction.

Found online in the public domain at:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/...ontrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=1&listSrc=Y&art=1

Now Iran knows that he is both willing and able to use the might of the US Armed Forces by the deployment of the troops to Afghanistan.

They will think twice (even thrice) about an attack upon Israel knowing that he is no pacifist and that he has used strong words about supporting Israel in defending itself against "enemies sworn to its destruction".

Again, to his credit.

HankD

 

[HankD]

Double post.

 

[JustChristian]

The "why" of It doesn't matter, President Obama has proven he is a man of war. For that he deserves credit.
He has sworn to uphold the Constitution and protect this nation from all enemies foreign and domestic and he is doing just that with this troop deployment.

He also supports our close relationship with Israel and their defense:



Found online in the public domain at:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/...ontrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=1&listSrc=Y&art=1

Now Iran knows that he is both willing and able to use the might of the US Armed Forces by the deployment of the troops to Afghanistan.

They will think twice (even thrice) about an attack upon Israel knowing that he is no pacifist and that he has used strong words about supporting Israel in defending itself against "enemies sworn to its destruction".

Again, to his credit.

HankD

You're claiming the "why" of war doesn't matter?

 

[HankD]

You're claiming the "why" of war doesn't matter?

Of course not in every case JC and I believe that you know that.

In this particular case NO, it doesn't matter.

Radical Islam wants your head removed from your body simply because you are not a worshipper of their deity.

If I were still a US soldier under orders to kill them, I would wield the sword of Romans 13 as a minister of God to execute wrath upon these evil doers.

As an individual under certain circumstances (if they were in the execution of the deed), I would do so as well to protect the lives of the innocent.

It is the Christian obligation to protect the innocent by legal means as well as the duty of every man.

In the circumstance of imminent danger of death, using legal deadly force in self defense of one's person, family or fellow citizens who are in mortal danger, is just that, self defense, not a crime and IMO not a sin.

If that makes those of us who subscribe to that principle bad Christians, so be it, we will answer to God.


HankD

 

[JustChristian]

Of course not in every case JC and I believe that you know that.

In this particular case NO, it doesn't matter.

Radical Islam wants your head removed from your body simply because you are not a worshipper of their deity.

If I were still a US soldier under orders to kill them, I would wield the sword of Romans 13 as a minister of God to execute wrath upon these evil doers.

As an individual under certain circumstances (if they were in the execution of the deed), I would do so as well to protect the lives of the innocent.

It is the Christian obligation to protect the innocent by legal means as well as the duty of every man.

In the circumstance of imminent danger of death, using legal deadly force in self defense of one's person, family or fellow citizens who are in mortal danger, is just that, self defense, not a crime and IMO not a sin.

If that makes those of us who subscribe to that principle bad Christians, so be it, we will answer to God.


HankD

On that we can certainly agree. We will all answer to God on that Great Day.