Jesus is the Reason for Calvinism

[Humble Disciple]

Irresistible (Enabling, Efficacious) Grace

Mark 9:24
Immediately the father of the child cried out and said with tears, “Lord, I believe; help my unbelief!”

Luke 17:5
And the apostles said to the Lord, “Increase our faith.”

 

[George Antonios]

There are numerous Bible verses and quotations from the church fathers supporting the five points of Calvinism. The doctrines of grace are simply a convenient way of articulating what’s already revealed in the Bible.

It’s only called “Calvinism” because John Calvin popularized the doctrines of grace, he did not originate them. It’s the same doctrines that Augustine taught against Pelagius and Luther taught against Rome.

Most importantly, since Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith (Hebrews 12:2), we should look to the words of Jesus and see if they support the doctrines of grace.

Calvinism is important to me because it's supported by the Bible, and also because of its great benefits. I have never felt more loved by Jesus in my entire life, and I've never felt more secure in my salvation. I am so thankful, that it makes me want to live in love and obedience to Jesus.

To believe that Jesus chose me from before the foundation of the world, based on no merit on my part whatsoever, not even my free-willed efforts to believe or disbelieve, and that He will safely lead me to ultimate salvation and never abandon me, no matter how many times I might fall, is very liberating and also very humbling.

Here are just a few verses from the Gospels:

Total Depravity

Matthew 7:18
A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit.

Matthew 15:19
For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies.

Mark 10:18
Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.

John 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

John 3:19
And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil.

John 8:34
Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin.

John 8:44
You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires.

Unconditional Election

Matthew 11:27
All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.

Matthew 22:14
For many are called, but few are chosen.

John 6:65
And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”

John 15:16
You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you.

John 15:19
If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.

Limited Atonement

Matthew 1:21
And she will bring forth a Son, and you shall call His name Jesus, for He will save His people from their sins.

John 11
11 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
26 but you do not believe because you are not my sheep

John 17:9
I am praying for them. I am not praying for the world but for those whom you have given me, for they are yours.

Irresistible (Enabling, Efficacious) Grace

Matthew 19
25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”
26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

John 3:8
The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.

John 6
37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws (Greek helkó, "to drag") him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

John 10:16
And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

Preservation/Perseverance of the Saints

John 5:24
Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

John 6
35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.
36 But I said to you that you have seen Me and yet do not believe.
37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will [a]by no means cast out.

John 10
27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.

I believe in eternal security with all my heart and rejoice in that blessed doctrine, and I reject all 5 points of Calvinism with all my heart.

 

[Humble Disciple]

I believe in eternal security with all my heart and rejoice in that blessed doctrine, and I reject all 5 points of Calvinism with all my heart.

Isn't eternal security the fifth point of Calvinism? Also, how do you expect to never lose your salvation without God's irresistible grace?

Irresistible grace doesn’t mean that God’s elect will never rebel, but that God’s grace is powerful enough to overcome the elect’s rebellion, transform their wills and desires, and lead them to ultimate salvation.

 

[George Antonios]

Isn't eternal security the fifth point of Calvinism?

No, it isn't, not really. If it were, I'd accept it.

Also, how do you expect to never lose your salvation without God's irresistible grace?

By God's grace. "irresistible" is a word you added to the words of the living God.

"grace" is all over my Bible. "irresistible grace" never is.

 

[Humble Disciple]

"grace" is all over my Bible. "irresistible grace" never is.

The term "irresistible" is only used for the purposes of the acronym TULIP. A more appropriate term might be "enabling grace" or "efficacious grace."

Irresistible grace doesn’t mean that God’s elect will never rebel, but that God’s grace is powerful enough to overcome the elect’s rebellion, transform their wills and desires, and lead them to ultimate salvation.

Do you believe that you have saving faith entirely due to your free-willed choice alone?

 

[Van]

I believe that four of the 5 points of Calvinism are false doctrines.

T = Total Spiritual Inability, being dead in our sins means we are unable to receive the gospel in a manner that would result in Salvation. This is false doctrine, the parable of the four soils, Matthew 13:1-23 tells us that some folks lost their limited spiritual ability to understand the gospel by the practice of sin which harden there heart and they became like the soil next to the path. The other soils did respond to the gospel, so they had limited spiritual ability. Therefore Total Spiritual Inability does not fit with scripture.

U = Unconditional Election before Creation where God chose foreseen individuals before they did anything such as putting their faith in Christ. This is false doctrine. When are our names entered into the Lamb's book of life? After creation. When are we chosen? After we have lived without mercy. How are we chosen, God credits our faith in Christ and puts us in Christ, the sanctification by the Spirit. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14

L = Limited Reconciliation, Christ died for the elect only. This is false doctrine, Christ paid the ransom for all and became the propitiation for the whole world and God is reconciling the world, one believer at a time, through Christ. 1 John 2:2.

I = Irresistible Grace, the idea that 100% of those drawn by the Father are placed in Christ. This is false doctrine. Matthew 23:13 demonstrates that folks who have been drawn and are entering the kingdom can be turned aside.

P = Perseverance of the Saints, once saved always saved. This is sound doctrine. When we are born again, God keeps us so that we will inherit our reward in heaven by protecting our faith. 1 Peter 1:3-5.

This view was challenged not by addressing the verses cited above, but by citing other verses claimed by Calvinism to support the doctrines. Here is the list:

Total Depravity: John 6:44, 6:65; Romans 3:10-18, 8:6-8; Ephesians 2:1-3
Unconditional Election: John 6:37, 6:39, 10:29; Romans 8:28-29, 9:10-23; Ephesians 1:11
Limited Atonement: John 3:16, 10:11, 10:15, Romans 5:12-19
Irresistible Grace: John 6:44, 10:4, 10:27; Ephesians 2:4-9
Perseverance of the Saints: John 6:39-40, 10:27-29; Romans 8:1, 8:29-30, 8:35-39, 11:29; Ephesians 1:13-14; Jude 24-25

My position is there is no actual support in scripture for the TULI, and there is support for P. So why am I not able to discern the supposed support cited above? Because the supposed support depends on redefining words and adding unwarranted inferences to “create” the support.

Let me just address the cited support for Total Spiritual Inability.

Does John 6:44 say mankind is unable to respond to the draw of the gospel unless altered by irresistible grace? Of course not. Does it say to be drawn by the Father means compelled by irresistible grace? Of course not. It simply says unless you are drawn by the Father, you will not come to Jesus. So the supposed support rests on defining drawn to mean drawn by irresistible grace. And this is demonstrated false by Matthew 23:13 so John 6:44 actually provides no support for Total Spiritual Inability.
Does John 6:65 provide any support? No, again. It says no one can come to Jesus unless granted by the Father. Does this say only the pre-selected elect are granted the capacity to come to Jesus? No. What it actually says is if God hardens your heart, like He did with the non-believing Jews in Romans 11:7;25, then you will not be able to come to Jesus. In John 6:65, Judas is in view, hardened so that scripture would be fulfilled.

Does Romans 3:10-18 provide any support for Total Spiritual Inability? No, of course not. If we start with verse 9, to get the context, we see that Paul is supporting the premise that we all sin, we are all under sin, and therefore whether we are under the Law or apart from the Law, we stand condemned. What Calvinism does is take this perfectly straightforward passage and invent support for spiritual inability. Verse 11 says there are none that understand, which begs the question understand what. Calvinism inserts “the milk of the gospel” claiming folks who have not been regenerated cannot understand the gospel. But that assertion is not found anywhere in scripture, especially here. To the contrary Paul says men in the flesh can understand the milk of the gospel, see 1 Corinthians 2:14-3:3. Men of the flesh and babes in Christ who have not yet learned from their recently indwelt Spirit, understand the milk.

Are there none who seek God? This begs the question, Are there none who seek God at all times, or none who seek God at any time? Since the idea is to support that we all sin, the idea would seem to be we do not seek God when we are sinning. Certainly we all sin, and therefore our way of life is futile outside of Christ. That is Paul’s point, not Total Spiritual Inability.

Note also that the citation stops at verse 18, but if you keep reading to verse 21 you see that Jesus has been “manifested” clearly teaching folks have enough spiritual ability to comprehend the “manifestation.” Bottom line, the passage provides no actual support for Total Spiritual Inability.

Does Romans 8:6-8 provide support for Total Spiritual Inability? No, of course not. This passage makes three points: (1) the mind set on the flesh is death; (2) the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; and (3) the mind set on the flesh is not even able to subject itself to the Law of God. Every one of these points is clear and requires no additional information to understand its message.. What does Calvinism do? They add in that only regenerate folks are able to set their minds on the Spirit or on God or one the spiritual things that can be discerned by the unregenerate (as taught by Paul in 1 Corinthians 2:14-3:3.) So the assertion is without foundation. Next, look at Romans 7:25 where Paul explains that the unregenerate have the capacity to set their minds on spiritual things, but are not able to avoid also serving the law of sin.

How about Ephesians 2:1-3, does this provide actual support for Total Spiritual Inability? No, of course not. This passage makes two very important points: (1) Before we were made alive together with Christ – by God putting us spiritually in Christ – we were dead in our sin, unable to do anything to save ourselves just as a dead person is unable to act in their own behalf. And (2) everyone starts out in this unregenerate condition, by nature children of wrath. Here Calvinism tried to claim being outside of Christ makes us unable to understand the milk of the gospel. But that is nowhere to be found. And we know from Matthew 23:13 that unregenerate folks can be entering heaven, but have not actually entered and therefore have not yet been made alive together with Christ.

This concludes the analysis of the support cited by Calvinism to assert Total Spiritual Inability, and what we have found is none of the passages actually provide any support whatsoever. If you look at the other verses or passages cited for the other doctrines I believe are false, I believe you will find the same thing, only by changing the meanings of words or adding unwarranted inferences can you create support for Calvinism’s other points, except P.

May God Bless

 

[Van]

Why is it hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom? If the bogus doctrine of "irresistible grace" (no matter how many different names they give it) a poor man and a rich man would both have no difficulty due to being compelled by "compelling grace."

 

[Van]

Why does 2 Thessalonians 2:13 say people are chosen for salvation through or by reason of "faith in the truth" if election is unconditional?

 

[thomas15]

I have no intent to convert other people to Calvinism. I took philosophy and religion classes in college, and one can discuss things to their logical conclusions without needing to force someone to the other side.

I have more interest in understanding why people believe what they believe than convincing them to be on my side. Oftentimes, people reject certain points of Calvinism without fully understanding or being able to articulate why.

There is no question that Calvinist can quote verses of Scripture that seem to back up the claim. There are also many highly respected and highly educated theologians that pitch Calvinism.

The problem is and speaking just for me is that there are also passages of Scripture that are at odds with Calvinism. Some of those passages very plainly contradict it. For many years I accepted Calvinism without question because most of my commentaries and systematic theologies teach it, most of the sermons I heard supported it and just about everyone makes fun of the alternate views or throws rocks at those who disagree.

There came a day in my life when I realized that trusting in God meant just that, trusting God's Word, plain and simple and then letting the chips fall where they may. I do not see it as my life's mission to convince anyone on the internet that what I believe is pure Bible. Quoting a long list of verses is not the same as demonstrating that those verses teach what the person quoting them claims it teaches. In my limited view, if Calvinists really believe that they have a divine mission to rid the believers of doubt in Calvinism then they would do well to ditch the sledgehammer and the will to deploy it.

I'm not saying those who defend Calvinism on this board haven't studied the alternatives but repeating verbatim what guys like Riddlebarger or Sproul or the like minded have to say isn't going to work because those men are just not interested in being fair and oddly enough I have studied them in detail. I personally don't care if I'm not a hit at the water cooler.

 

[Humble Disciple]

The problem is and speaking just for me is that there are also passages of Scripture that are at odds with Calvinism.

Are there any verses, in particular, that you think I should study?

There came a day in my life when I realized that trusting in God meant just that, trusting God's Word, plain and simple and then letting the chips fall where they may.

Yes, and that's exactly the reason why I am a Calvinist today rather than an Arminian.

The only reason why it's called "Calvinism" is because John Calvinism popularized the same Biblical doctrines that were already taught by Luther against Rome and Augustine against Pelagius.

Before I believed in the inerrancy of God's Word, I was staunchly anti-Calvinist. Reading Romans 9 without modernist eyes for the first time really opened things up for me.

In my limited view, if Calvinists really believe that they have a divine mission to rid the believers of doubt in Calvinism then they would do well to ditch the sledgehammer and the will to deploy it.

I am not here to rid you of your doubt of Calvinism, but instead of any prejudice you might have against Calvinism.

If you are an Arminian who loves Jesus, that’s awesome. As the slogan of the Reformation goes, “In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity.”

1 Corinthians 8:2-3
Anyone who claims to know all the answers doesn’t really know very much. But the person who loves God is the one whom God recognizes.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Why does 2 Thessalonians 2:13 say people are chosen for salvation through or by reason of "faith in the truth" if election is unconditional?

That verse is saying we are predestined unto faith, not predestined because of faith.

 

[Humble Disciple]

Why is it hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom? If the bogus doctrine of "irresistible grace" (no matter how many different names they give it) a poor man and a rich man would both have no difficulty due to being compelled by "compelling grace."

What did Jesus say about the rich young ruler after he'd left?

Matthew 19
25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”
26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

Irresistible grace doesn’t mean that God’s elect will never rebel, but that God’s grace is powerful enough to overcome the elect’s rebellion, transform their wills and desires, and lead them to ultimate salvation.

 

[Humble Disciple]

I believe that four of the 5 points of Calvinism are false doctrines.

T = Total Spiritual Inability, being dead in our sins means we are unable to receive the gospel in a manner that would result in Salvation. This is false doctrine, the parable of the four soils, Matthew 13:1-23 tells us that some folks lost their limited spiritual ability to understand the gospel by the practice of sin which harden there heart and they became like the soil next to the path. The other soils did respond to the gospel, so they had limited spiritual ability. Therefore Total Spiritual Inability does not fit with scripture.

U = Unconditional Election before Creation where God chose foreseen individuals before they did anything such as putting their faith in Christ. This is false doctrine. When are our names entered into the Lamb's book of life? After creation. When are we chosen? After we have lived without mercy. How are we chosen, God credits our faith in Christ and puts us in Christ, the sanctification by the Spirit. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14

L = Limited Reconciliation, Christ died for the elect only. This is false doctrine, Christ paid the ransom for all and became the propitiation for the whole world and God is reconciling the world, one believer at a time, through Christ. 1 John 2:2.

I = Irresistible Grace, the idea that 100% of those drawn by the Father are placed in Christ. This is false doctrine. Matthew 23:13 demonstrates that folks who have been drawn and are entering the kingdom can be turned aside.

P = Perseverance of the Saints, once saved always saved. This is sound doctrine. When we are born again, God keeps us so that we will inherit our reward in heaven by protecting our faith. 1 Peter 1:3-5.

Calvinists would contend that, in the parable of the sowers, the good soil represents the elect's ability to accept the Gospel, due to God's enabling race. It's entirely because of God's grace, and not any merit on their own part.

Regarding unconditional election, how do you interpret Romans 9? I'm sorry if you've already answered this question.

Regarding limited atonement, Christ's death was sufficient enough to pay for an innumerable amount of people's sins, but it's applied to only the elect. There are numerous Bible verses which demonstrate this.

Matthew 23:13 says that the Pharisees attempt to put obstacles in the way to salvation, but God's elect, through His enabling grace, are able to overcome those obstacles.

Regarding perseverance of the saints, how do you expect that God will be able to preserve you in salvation without his enabling grace?

Irresistible grace doesn’t mean that God’s elect will never rebel, but that God’s grace is powerful enough to overcome the elect’s rebellion, transform their wills and desires, and lead them to ultimate salvation.

 

[Iconoclast]

I believe in eternal security with all my heart and rejoice in that blessed doctrine, and I reject all 5 points of Calvinism with all my heart.

Rejecting the truth of God...With all your heart, is not a good idea

 

[Humble Disciple]

Rejecting the truth of God...With all your heart, is not a good idea

I don't believe that Arminians reject God's truth. They just might be inconsistent in how they interpret it.

 

[Iconoclast]

I don't believe that Arminians reject God's truth. They just might be inconsistent in how they interpret it.

you can view it as you wish.
I just quoted Georges post.
He said he rejects all 5 bible truths known as Calvinism.

 

[Humble Disciple]

you can view it as you wish.
I just quoted Georges post.
He said he rejects all 5 bible truths known as Calvinism.

An Arminian could say that you reject all 5 Bible truths known as Arminianism. What's the difference? Historically, the five points of Calvinism were written in response to the five points of Arminianism, at the Canon of Dort.

 

[Iconoclast]

An Arminian could say that you reject all 5 Bible truths known as Arminianism. What's the difference? Historically, the five points of Calvinism were written in response to the five points of Arminianism, at the Canon of Dort.

I know the history my friend.
A jw can deny the trinity.
A catholic can insist Mary is a co mediatrix.
Arminians can deny truth.
What matters is what Is the faith once taught to the saints.

 

[Humble Disciple]

I know the history my friend.
A jw can deny the trinity.
A catholic can insist Mary is a co mediatrix.
Arminians can deny truth.
What matters is what Is the faith once taught to the saints.

This is assuming that Arminians aren't Christian. I'm not going down that road.

 

[Iconoclast]

This is assuming that Arminians aren't Christian. I'm not going down that road.

No... I am not making that assumption but I wouldn't rule it out either.
Both are not true, they are not equal.