John the Baptist

Here now,

What is the percentage of ALL the person's who ever lived, are living or will live, DID Jesus bring back to life. It is estimated that the count of persons how have lived and are living is somewhere near 10 Billion.

So what is the number you can count on the fingers of one hand of persons that Jesus brought back to life against their will?

How many do you think would be more than willing to be brought back from where they await judgment, so that they could have another opportunity to change their minds about God?

 

How many have been named Lazarus?

Why was it only this one that came?

 

Diane said: "Scriptures are clear that the will of God is that none perish"

Does anybody realize how ridiculous this statement is? Everybody knows in the end very few are saved, these are the ones who travel the narrow road and enter the narrow gate to salvation, all others take the wide road that leads to destruction. God's will cannot be usurped by anyone, including powerful angels yet you have those headed for destruction defying God's will. According to Diane, God is not sovereign over all things, he is a feeble and impotent God unable to ensure "that none perish." Hello!

The "bride" in this passage is the heavenly New Jerusalem (21:2,9-10) at the beginning of the eternal state of the new heavens and new earth following the Millennial reign of Christ. The "water of life" is the crystal clear river "proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb" (v.1). Those who are thirsty and invited to "take the water of life freely" are all the saints dwelling in the New Jerusalem. This passage has nothing to do with the present Church age.

 

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

 

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us , not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

I previously explained in a post that the "us" above refers to those in Christ and not all people. The personal pronoun "us" points to the antecedent "beloved" in verse 8 and 1, which are those "that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ" (the elect)(1:1). "God is not willing that any (of the elect) should perish but that all (of the elect) should come to repentance."

Do you understand the above? I flunked English and understand it, definitely you should be able to.

 

Diane quote
1 Tim 2:4

"4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."

I have a 1961 KJ and is has:

4. Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.


Are they ever going to correct the mistakes in the only Godly inspired KJ Bible. This is pathetic.

 

Why would God's "longsuffering" be for those who already have faith in Him? His longsuffering is for those who do not yet have faith in Him. He waits for the unbelievers to gain the knowledge necessary for faith to spawn in the unbeliever that makes him a believer. The church is not going to the mountain and telling the good news. The church is not bringing them in, harvesting the fields that are white unto harvest. The unbeliever remains an unbeliever because of the church's silence!

[ July 12, 2005, 01:18 PM: Message edited by: Pastor Larry ]

 

Waiting for an affirmative response from Diane.

"Truth is simple and profound. Error is mysterious and complicated. The farther truth is pursued the easier it is to maintain, while error multiplies its weaknesses and eventually crushes the ones who support it."

 

Well I made A's in English and took OT and NT at Bessie Tift Baptist College plus What Baptists Believe and other courses at Moody Bible Institute and I've been is SBC churches since 2 weeks of age under great pastors/ preachers.

Our interpretation differs so, no, I will not affirm your translation and hope you'll refrain from ugliness toward me in your replies. It doesn't become a brother in Christ.

Diane

 

Amen TCassidy. More like they will "not admit their Soteriology could be so wrong," pride is the reason why.

 

Proverbs 16:18 Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall.

Luke 6:37 "Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

Matthew 7:1 "Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you. 3 And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye'; and look, a plank is in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye. 6 Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces.

John 13:35 By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another."

1 Corinthians 3:18 Let no one deceive himself. If anyone among you seems to be wise in this age, let him become a fool that he may become wise. 19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, "He catches the wise in their own craftiness"; 20 and again, "The Lord knows the thoughts of the wise, that they are futile."

Job 21:22 Shall any teach God knowledge? seeing he judgeth those that are high. 23 One dieth in his full strength, being wholly at ease and quiet. 24 His breasts are full of milk, and his bones are moistened with marrow. 25 And another dieth in the bitterness of his soul, and never eateth with pleasure. 26 They shall lie down alike in the dust, and the worms shall cover them.

1 Corinthians 13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. 3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, 5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; 6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; 7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. 9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. 10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. 11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things. 12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. 13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

James 1:22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. 23 For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror; 24 for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was. 25 But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it, and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does. 26 If anyone among you thinks he is religious, and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this one's religion is useless. 27 Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.

....... Love, Joy, Peace, Patience, Kindness, Goodness, Faithfulness, Gentleness and Self- control

 

I wouldn't boast to much about grades in English. Or if you went and took a couple of courses at Bible colleges. And being under GREAT pastors is completely subjective. I would strongly suggest a Church HISTORY class and GREEK not English to help understand the Bible, since that is what God used for the NT.

But you can use basic English to help understand verses though, I wish people would use them. i.e. 2 Pet 3.9 refers to the ELECT, BELOVED... follow the PRONOUNS. We know that the pronouns HAVE TO BE LINKED to find WHO is the OBJECT. BOTH Letters by Peter are talking to THE ELECT. That God is waiting for the completed number of His chosen to be saved (His purpose) will come to pass.

i.e. 1 Timothy 2.1 Prayers and supplications should be given for ALL men.... but what comes immediately AFTER that? A comma and then a FOR ... That for EXPLAINS who and why we should PRAY... Was Paul instructing Timothy to take out the phone book and pray for EVERY person in the world?... NO... The FOR connects and completes the thought. FOR KINGS and those in AUTHOURITY... all represents ALL kinds of classes. We should not only pray for the poor and the oppressed but also those who are rich and the oppressors. IN CONTEXT Paul is saying God desires not just the poor, persecuted church members and people in lower class but also the rich and the oppressors He will also include. Paul was not allowing them to be myopic and respectful of persons thinking God was only on "their" side, but wants ALL men, poor, KINGS and those in authority.

Have all TYPES of men accepted Christ.. Yes...
Why? Because it is God's WILL and He perfectly accomplishes His will.

HAVE all PEOPLE accepted Christ... NO...
Why? It is not His Will. God accomplishes what He DESIRES. If this verse be taken universally, it contradicts the Decretive Will of God, for He does ALL that He DESIRES.

 

This has been pointed out several times to the Arminians on the BB, but to no avail. They understand it, but just can't admit their Soteriology could be so wrong. Unfortunately the Christian character needed to admit such a theological error is sadly lacking in many Christians, and especially among the "self saved" variety. </font>[/QUOTE]If you are educated, cassidy, you know there is no such thing as a "self saved Christian". ALL of us uneducated commoners know that, why don't you?

 

Self saved Christian is a slang for synergists which by the way you are Wes. God has done EVERYTHING including the salvation for His sheep.
He didn't do just 99% and you HAVE TO DO the 1%, THAT'S self saved Christianity. In order for YOU to be saved YOU have to, with YOUR understanding choose God, and He is there powerless, wringing His hands hoping that you will choose Him since he can't do anything else for you.

 

OOH Goody!! Another Calvinist assigned label. Now I'm a synergist! I guess that is better than the other labels you've assigned such as sinnergist!

All of us common ordinary CHRISTIANS know that there is no such thing as "self saved" Christians. One cannot be a Christian at all if they think they are self saved!

It is only muddle minded Calvinists that think in terms of "self saved".

 

From the confusing and disoriented contents of your posts, I'd say you're the one with a muddled mind. As I've said before, I'm not going to try and "untangle this mess."


"Truth is simple and profound. Error is mysterious and complicated. The farther truth is pursued the easier it is to maintain, while error multiplies its weaknesses and eventually crushes the ones who support it."

 

Prophecynut said:

and yet some Calvinists keep giving their pat answer...
It's a mystery! Then they use the term 'you can't use logic' or emotions or feelings, etc. Does that mean....????

 

"Mystery" is an excellent choice of words to describe the understanding Calvinist have concerning God's will in salvation. "Mystery" is a previously hidden truth unveiled by God's revelation as in Eph. 1:9; "and he made know to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ,..." This mystery is God's good pleasure to purpose in Christ to "bring all things in heaven and on earth" under His headship. It is God "who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will (v.11). "All things" and "everything" conforms to his will, this is 100% not 99% God and 1% human. This mystery has been revealed to and accepted by those who know the will of God. Apparently you are lacking in this understanding because you still are trying to please God with your 1% effort.