Kingdom Exclusion

[J. Jump]

We can lose the rewards, but we will never lose our inheritance.

Can you please share the Scripture that says an inheritance is something that can not be lost or forfeited.

 

[Linda64]

Do you consider SS Craig, Robert Govett, DM Panton, Watchman Lee, AE Wilson, GH Peters, WF Roadhouse, Zane Hodges, & Charles Stanley to be "far from the mainstream"? All of them believe(d) it to some degree.

When someone teaches such a doctrine that splits up the Body of Christ in such a way as to send believers to hell for 1,000 years, it IS "far from the mainstream." It is downright unbiblical. BTW, there is no such person as "Watchman Lee." You either mean "Witness Lee" or "Watchman Nee." Two different people--both Chinese.

Wasn't the Roman catholic Church the MAIN STREAM for 1000 very dark years? This argement proves nothing on either side. (Except that it is not "my" doctrine.)

The Roman Catholic Church is an APOSTATE Church which "Christianized" paganism -- not only for 1,000 dark years-- it is still apostate and in the dark. If you are following the doctrine (in this case, Kingdom Exclusion) it is your doctrine--no matter where it originated.

I predict a continued revival of the Kingdom truths.

Mt 24:14 -
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

lacy

Jesus spoke of great "deception"--not revival, in the last days before His coming. We are certainly witnessing this "deception" -- i. e. this false doctrine of "Protestant Purgatory" that you call "Kingdom Exclusion".

And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? (Matthew 24:3)

And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. (Matthew 24:4)

Matthew 24:14 states that there will be worldwide preaching of the kingdom message, which is the announcement of the impending kingdom of God and the divine demand to repent. This occurs during the last 3 1/2 years of the Tribulation before Jesus comes back to this earth with His Bride/Body (Rev. 19:14), to set up His Millennial Kingdom in Jerusalem, where He will reign on this earth for 1,000 years.

 

[Lacy Evans]

Watchman Lee? who is that?

That's ole' Typo Mee's brother!:tongue3:

Lacy

Son of Wong Kee! (Oh I just Kill myself sometimes!)

 

[Linda64]

Can you please share the Scripture that says an inheritance is something that can not be lost or forfeited.

From Way of Life Encyclopedia: INHERITANCE

Christians are heirs of God's riches in Jesus Christ (Ac. 20:32; 26:18; Eph. 1:11,14,18; Col. 1:12; Heb. 9:15; 1Pe. 1:4).

The Christian's inheritance is not through the law, but through grace (Ga 3:18).

The Christian's inheritance is preserved in Heaven for him (1Pe 1:4).

The Christian himself is sealed and kept until he receives the full inheritance (Eph 1:12-14; 1Pe 1:3-5).

To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, (1 Peter 1:4)

 

[J. Jump]

Jesus spoke of great "deception"--not revival, in the last days before His coming.

I would agree with that statement, but if you will compare Scripture with Scripture the deception is going to come from mainstream Christendom not from a teaching on the kingdom.

Again one just need to read the letter to the Laodicean church just to name one place to see that mainstream Christianity is not the correct answer. Those that continue to say that you must be in the mainstream to be "right" are just further proving the accuracy of Bible prophecy in Revelation 3.

Christ is on the outside knocking to get back into the mainstream.

Again why do so many people put so much trust in man instead of God? Who cares if it's mainstream or not. If it's Truth believe it and if it's not then don't regardless of who or who is not "on your side."

If God be for me, who can stand against me? No one. It doesn't matter who else believes what.

 

[J. Jump]

Christians are heirs of God's riches in Jesus Christ (Ac. 20:32; 26:18; Eph. 1:11,14,18; Col. 1:12; Heb. 9:15; 1Pe. 1:4).

The Christian's inheritance is not through the law, but through grace (Ga 3:18).

The Christian's inheritance is preserved in Heaven for him (1Pe 1:4).

The Christian himself is sealed and kept until he receives the full inheritance (Eph 1:12-14; 1Pe 1:3-5).

To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, (1 Peter 1:4)

I guess context doesn't matter as long as it fits the doctrine we want to hold to huh?

 

[Lacy Evans]

When someone teaches such a doctrine that splits up the Body of Christ in such a way as to send believers to hell for 1,000 years, it IS "far from the mainstream." It is downright unbiblical. BTW, there is no such person as "Watchman Lee." You either mean "Witness Lee" or "Watchman Nee." Two different people--both Chinese.

OK. fine. But either argue that I'm wrong because "Noone ever taught it and you and your pastor have never heard it" or argue that I'm wrong because I'm "following men." But not both, because it could go on forever!

Hardly anyone is responding the scriptures that we keep posting.

When someone fails to teach the whole counsel of God that he is both a just Father and a severe Father, then it IS "far from the mainstream." It is downright unbiblical.

Lacy

 

[tinytim]

From Way of Life Encyclopedia: INHERITANCE

Christians are heirs of God's riches in Jesus Christ (Ac. 20:32; 26:18; Eph. 1:11,14,18; Col. 1:12; Heb. 9:15; 1Pe. 1:4).

The Christian's inheritance is not through the law, but through grace (Ga 3:18).

The Christian's inheritance is preserved in Heaven for him (1Pe 1:4).

The Christian himself is sealed and kept until he receives the full inheritance (Eph 1:12-14; 1Pe 1:3-5).

To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, (1 Peter 1:4)

You go girl!

You are right. It is a form of purgatory.
I thank God for his salvation from Hell, the lake of fire, or anything else that was created for the devil and his angels.

Those trusting in their works will end up in the lake of fire, for eternity.

This could be a hoax by Satan... If people trust in their works, they go to hell, Satan could trick them and give them false hope then.... Just wait 1000 yrs, God will get you out then!

hogwash.

 

[James_Newman]

You go girl!

You are right. It is a form of purgatory.
I thank God for his salvation from Hell, the lake of fire, or anything else that was created for the devil and his angels.

Those trusting in their works will end up in the lake of fire, for eternity.

This could be a hoax by Satan... If people trust in their works, they go to hell, Satan could trick them and give them false hope then.... Just wait 1000 yrs, God will get you out then!

hogwash.

Where did we ever state that we were trusting in our works for salvation? Rather I notice over and over that the ones who would decry our teaching of accountability of a believer before God are the same ones saying that a true Christian has to have good works to be saved. If they have no hope of salvation through the blood of Christ alone, then who is trusting in their works? The hoax is on either side of the truth. Either you believe that your saved and no matter what you do you are going to get a paper crown at the Pizza Party of Christ, or you believe that you can only truly know you are saved because your filthy rags that you call works are so beautiful to God. I know that I am saved regardless of what I do, by the blood of Christ, but I also know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom. It doesn't take a math major to figure out this equation. But you are going to have to be able to rightly divide some things that have been wrongly joined together, namely the free gift of eternal salvation and the conditional thousand year reign of Christ with His saints.

 

[Diggin in da Word]

I would agree with that statement, but if you will compare Scripture with Scripture the deception is going to come from mainstream Christendom not from a teaching on the kingdom.

Again one just need to read the letter to the Laodicean church just to name one place to see that mainstream Christianity is not the correct answer. Those that continue to say that you must be in the mainstream to be "right" are just further proving the accuracy of Bible prophecy in Revelation 3.

Christ is on the outside knocking to get back into the mainstream.

Again why do so many people put so much trust in man instead of God? Who cares if it's mainstream or not. If it's Truth believe it and if it's not then don't regardless of who or who is not "on your side."

If God be for me, who can stand against me? No one. It doesn't matter who else believes what.

Christ is trying to get into the mainstream? How much more unbiblical can one get to prove a false doctrine? Christ is not trying to get into the mainstream. As a matter of fact, the Word of God tells us to come out from amongst them and be separate if we want to be received of God. Mainstream religion will send a person to hell.

 

[James_Newman]

Jesus spoke of great "deception"--not revival, in the last days before His coming. We are certainly witnessing this "deception" -- i. e. this false doctrine of "Protestant Purgatory" that you call "Kingdom Exclusion".

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

It is going to be revived, even now it is beginning. Those poor who are suffering for the Lord will readily receive it, while those who are rich and in need of nothing will rail against it.

 

[Diggin in da Word]

Where did we ever state that we were trusting in our works for salvation? Rather I notice over and over that the ones who would decry our teaching of accountability of a believer before God are the same ones saying that a true Christian has to have good works to be saved. If they have no hope of salvation through the blood of Christ alone, then who is trusting in their works? The hoax is on either side of the truth. Either you believe that your saved and no matter what you do you are going to get a paper crown at the Pizza Party of Christ, or you believe that you can only truly know you are saved because your filthy rags that you call works are so beautiful to God. I know that I am saved regardless of what I do, by the blood of Christ, but I also know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom. It doesn't take a math major to figure out this equation. But you are going to have to be able to rightly divide some things that have been wrongly joined together, namely the free gift of eternal salvation and the conditional thousand year reign of Christ with His saints.

When I accepted Christ, I was clothed in His righteousness. When He sees me, He sees the blood. That is why I am guaranteed acceptance with open arms into the kingdom!

Paul sinned even after His conversion on the Damascus road. As a matter of fact, in 1 Timothy 1 Paul stated 'Christ came to save sinners, of whom I am chief.' He did not say, 'I was chief,' but 'I am chief.'

Paul continued to have battles with the flesh and by this verse and similar passages found in Romans 7, he gave in to the flesh occasionally.

Yet Paul said he had a crown waiting for him. Praise God for His infinite mercy and abounding grace for those who place their trust in His Son!

 

[Diggin in da Word]

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

It is going to be revived, even now it is beginning. Those poor who are suffering for the Lord will readily receive it, while those who are rich and in need of nothing will rail against it.

Matthew 24:14 is not a revival, James. It is just a preaching of the gospel of the Kingdom... that's it.

Revival begins in the heart, not in the pulpit. Revival is a refreshing of the Spirit of God in man, not the preaching.

One can hear the preaching of the Word of God every day of the month, but if it does not stir up the embers of the heart as an eagle stirs up her nest, the preaching is of none effect to the hearer.

If one read verses 15-17, one will see it is not a revival. People are fleeing in fear, not rejoicing.

The gospel of the Kingdom is being preached as a witness against those who rejected it before the rapture.

 

[J. Jump]

Christ is trying to get into the mainstream? How much more unbiblical can one get to prove a false doctrine? Christ is not trying to get into the mainstream. As a matter of fact, the Word of God tells us to come out from amongst them and be separate if we want to be received of God. Mainstream religion will send a person to hell.

Again go back and re-read the letter to the Laodiceans. Christ is not amongst mainstream Christianity, but knocking the the door and only individuals answer the knocking in the affirmative, not the majority.

Broad is the way that leads to destruction. That's mainstream Christendom right there. But narrow is the way that leads to life and few there be that find it. That is the ones that answer the knocking in the affirmative.

And this isn't talking about saved and unsaved, because this is addressed to saved people not unsaved people.

 

[J. Jump]

When I accepted Christ, I was clothed in His righteousness. When He sees me, He sees the blood. That is why I am guaranteed acceptance with open arms into the kingdom!

Paul sinned even after His conversion on the Damascus road. As a matter of fact, in 1 Timothy 1 Paul stated 'Christ came to save sinners, of whom I am chief.' He did not say, 'I was chief,' but 'I am chief.'

Paul continued to have battles with the flesh and by this verse and similar passages found in Romans 7, he gave in to the flesh occasionally.

Yet Paul said he had a crown waiting for him. Praise God for His infinite mercy and abounding grace for those who place their trust in His Son!

Again you are taking things that Paul says and making them a blanket statement that includes everyone, when he himself didn't say that. What makes you think that it applies to everyone?

Paul was also a believer in the Lordship of Christ and was confessing his sins according to I John 1:9. Paul also knew that it was possible for him to be disqaulified as he said he didn't want to be a castaway in the end and that he didn't want to be found disqaulified himself eventhough he had been preaching the good news.

You can't take statements and then just automatically assume it means all of Christendom will experience these things.

 

[Diggin in da Word]

God is not a respector of persons. If He had a crown stored up in heaven that fades not away for Paul, even though Paul was the chief of sinners and gave into the flesh occasionally, then He will certainly do the same for all who place their trust in Jesus Christ and the shed blood.

 

[tinytim]

Again go back and re-read the letter to the Laodiceans. Christ is not amongst mainstream Christianity, but knocking the the door and only individuals answer the knocking in the affirmative, not the majority.

Broad is the way that leads to destruction. That's mainstream Christendom right there. But narrow is the way that leads to life and few there be that find it. That is the ones that answer the knocking in the affirmative.

And this isn't talking about saved and unsaved, because this is addressed to saved people not unsaved people.

what makes you think that the letter to the Laodiceans was a letter to mainstream Christianity... Laodicea was just one of the many churches that existed then. Let me guess, you have fallen into the bad teaching that the seven churches represent the history of the church age? If so, prove it.

Jesus told John to write to the seven churches. He mentioned nothing of church history... that is eisogesis not exegesis, which makes for bad doctrine.

"Broad is the way".... is not talking about mainstream Christianity.. It is talking about the lost.

Are you saying that only a few really, know the truth.. If so, then that is another reason I feel this idea of Christian purgatory feels cultic.

Let's see in this thread:
1. is a teaching that is very unorthodox to Christianity through the ages.
2. and the belief that only a true remnant believes this.

Those are 2 characteristics of a cultic teaching.

 

[DHK]

OK. fine. But either argue that I'm wrong because "Noone ever taught it and you and your pastor have never heard it" or argue that I'm wrong because I'm "following men." But not both, because it could go on forever!

Hardly anyone is responding the scriptures that we keep posting.

When someone fails to teach the whole counsel of God that he is both a just Father and a severe Father, then it IS "far from the mainstream." It is downright unbiblical.

Lacy

I have been preaching and teaching for 30 years and I have never heard of your "Baptist Purgatory" doctrine until I read it on this board. It is a new doctrine, and has a new following just like any other cult does. What shall we call it? "Faustism?"
When folks followed the teachings of Miller they were called Millerites. Because of his doctrine they were then called Adventists. When Ellen G. White entered the picture with her emphasis on the Sabbath they were called SDA. You also will be tagged with a name outside that of Baptist.

It isn't Biblical. It is outside the realm of historic Christianity. And the verses you have posted can be refuted easily--every one of them. You take Scripture out of context and apply them to your unscriptural doctrine, and then say that the orthodox view is wrong. You have gone contrary to Scripture with your own "private interpretation," a mark of a cult. You refuse to be objective or corrected by the Scriptures, even when the Scriptures prove you to be wrong. It is like arguing with a J.W. They also refuse to be corrected. Your mind is made up. You will not change no matter how much Scripture is shown to you, or no matter how many times one shows you that the Scripture you are using is out of context. You have taken on new doctrine like most cults and are following it. That in itself should be the biggest red flag to you that it is wrong. Are all Christians up to just a very few years ago wrong? Can you demonstrate this doctrine through the the standard commentaries that have stood the test of time such as Barnes, Matthew Henry, John Gill, Jamieson, Faucett and Brown, etc. Or must you resort to some off the wall commentaries who believe in other heresies as well? Commentators such as Watchman Nee? Your positon is indefensible.
DHK

 

[tinytim]

Who is Watchman Nee?

Some link please.

 

[James_Newman]

“The question is frequently asked, Who are represented by the daughters
of Jerusalem? They are clearly not the bride, yet they are not far removed from her.…They have forgotten the warning of our LORD in Luke xxi. 34-36;
and hence they are not ‘accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall
come to pass, and to stand before the SON of Man.’ They have not, with Paul,
counted ‘all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of CHRIST
JESUS the LORD,’ and hence they do not ‘attain unto’ that resurrection
from among the dead, which Paul felt he might miss, but aimed to attain
unto. We wish to place on record our solemn conviction that not all who are
Christians, or think themselves to be such, will attain to that resurrection
of which St. Paul speaks in Phil. iii...."

J. Hudson Taylor, Union And Communion With Christ (London: China
Inland Mission, Ninth Impression, 1929), Appendix: “Daughters Of Jerusalem”.