HisWitness
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amen brother---that we can agree on--it is ALL about Truth :thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
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Michael being Jesus
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amen brother---that we can agree on--it is ALL about Truth :thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.Can I ask how you know that Michael is one of the created angels ???
Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Hebrews 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
HisWitness
New Member
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Hebrews 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
Great scriptures--but still didn't answer my question
Where does it say Michael was an angel to begin with ??
HisWitness
New Member
Still waitin for some answers to those questions.
what answers ??
also what bible translation do you use.
Do you believe in eternal conscience torment called hell
also for michael being an angel.
Jude 1:9 - Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
HisWitness
New Member
also for michael being an angel.
Jude 1:9 - Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
what do you think Archangel means ???
what do you think Archangel means ???
archangel
ARCHAN'GEL, n.
1. An angel of the highest order; an angel occupying the eighth rank in the celestiai hierarchy.
Source: http://av1611.com/kjbp/kjv-dictionary/archangel.html
Surely you admit that Christ created all things. I will post those verses again for your benefit. He is the Creator. All things, including angels were created by Him.Great scriptures--but still didn't answer my question
Where does it say Michael was an angel to begin with ??
Now concerning angels, and Michael in particular, the Bible says:
Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
Revelation 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
--Michael and his angels are created beings, for the angels are created being. Michael is as much a created being as Lucifer is. Lucifer fell and Michael did not. Lucifer is the leader of "his angels" as well, now known as demons.
Here again are the Scriptures that are very clear on creation; that Christ created all things including ALL the angels, including Michael. Only God himself is eternal, immortal.
Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Hebrews 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
Fred's Wife
Member
Doesn't matter how you "slice" it...Michael is an archangel, "an ANGEL of the highest order..." (Jude 1:9)
Angel means "messenger." An angel is a supernatural being created to serve God. The Bible speaks of two major groups of angels-good and evil. One group of angels rebelled against God and followed Satan (Matthew 25:41).
Angel means "messenger." An angel is a supernatural being created to serve God. The Bible speaks of two major groups of angels-good and evil. One group of angels rebelled against God and followed Satan (Matthew 25:41).
HisWitness
New Member
question for this topic were on-------------------------------
Could Christ be called an Angel ???
Could Christ be called an Angel ???
HisWitness
New Member
Doesn't matter how you "slice" it...Michael is an archangel, "an ANGEL of the highest order..." (Jude 1:9)
Angel means "messenger." An angel is a supernatural being created to serve God. The Bible speaks of two major groups of angels-good and evil. One group of angels rebelled against God and followed Satan (Matthew 25:41).
ill ask you this---can Christ be called an Angel ??
Fred's Wife
Member
My answer to you is an emphatic NO! Angels were created by Jesus Christ:ill ask you this---can Christ be called an Angel ??
Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Isaiah 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;
Jesus Christ, the Creator, did not create Himself! He is God and He is eternal...no beginning or ending...Alpha and Omega. He(Jesus Christ) is the Jehovah of the OT.
Isaiah 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
Isaiah 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Revelation 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
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Not in the NT.question for this topic were on-------------------------------
Could Christ be called an Angel ???
In the OT he was referred to as the Angel of the Lord, which was commonly recognized as a "Christophany." Most students of the Bible can recognize between a Christophany and an actual angel. It is no reason to confuse Michael with Christ.
Now it is your turn.
Answer my post.
HisWitness
New Member
Not in the NT.
In the OT he was referred to as the Angel of the Lord, which was commonly recognized as a "Christophany." Most students of the Bible can recognize between a Christophany and an actual angel. It is no reason to confuse Michael with Christ.
Now it is your turn.
Answer my post.
why could he not be considered an angel in the NT ???
Angel means Messenger
Christ came in the flesh--he was a messenger with a message
So in that sense he could be called an angel
Men were called angels in the NT
God was called the ANGEL of the Lord in the OT
Does that mean that Christ/God was created beings---NO
its ok if you want to label Michael an angel---but the question is Just because Christ/God was called an Angel and it didn't mean they were created beings-------Then I ask you with Michael being called an angel---why do you assume he has to be a created being ????
Christ/God was called an Angel--were NOT created beings
Michael called an angel--why do you label him as a created Angel
I understand that the angelic host that God created are a created host of God
Could Michael be the name of Christ in His original state--before he came in the flesh--Jesus was ONLY his earthly name.
Point is Just because Michael is labeled an Angel in the bible doesn't mean he was a created being---Christ/God was called an Angel and they weren't created--is it possible Michael could indeed be Christ and just be called an Angel--not just a Angel but the Chief-First-Foremost-Greatest of all the angels and really not be a created being after all ?????????
HisWitness
New Member
Not in the NT.
In the OT he was referred to as the Angel of the Lord, which was commonly recognized as a "Christophany." Most students of the Bible can recognize between a Christophany and an actual angel. It is no reason to confuse Michael with Christ.
Now it is your turn.
Answer my post.
answer what ?
HisWitness
New Member
why could he not be considered an angel in the NT ???
Angel means Messenger
Christ came in the flesh--he was a messenger with a message
So in that sense he could be called an angel
Men were called angels in the NT
God was called the ANGEL of the Lord in the OT
Does that mean that Christ/God was created beings---NO
its ok if you want to label Michael an angel---but the question is Just because Christ/God was called an Angel and it didn't mean they were created beings-------Then I ask you with Michael being called an angel---why do you assume he has to be a created being ????
Christ/God was called an Angel--were NOT created beings
Michael called an angel--why do you label him as a created Angel
I understand that the angelic host that God created are a created host of God
Could Michael be the name of Christ in His original state--before he came in the flesh--Jesus was ONLY his earthly name.
Point is Just because Michael is labeled an Angel in the bible doesn't mean he was a created being---Christ/God was called an Angel and they weren't created--is it possible Michael could indeed be Christ and just be called an Angel--not just a Angel but the Chief-First-Foremost-Greatest of all the angels and really not be a created being after all ?????????
another question for this topic--------------------------------
How did John know that in Revelation when he saw Michael and HIS Angels
that that was indeed Michael that he saw--he had never seen Michael before---had he ??--How did he know what Michael even looked like--if he didn't know who it was when he first saw him--he would have asked who it was that he had seen--but it appears that he knew right away who it was ???
Now a thought John knew BOTH what Jesus looked liked in his earthly form and also in his Glorified form---so could Michael have been Jesus in Rev. ??
Steadfast Fred
Active Member
How much longer is HW going to be allowed to slander our Lord by claiming He is Michael?
This doctrine, along with many others that HW teaches, is clearly not Baptist doctrine and would not be taught by any who hold to the Baptist tenets.
This doctrine, along with many others that HW teaches, is clearly not Baptist doctrine and would not be taught by any who hold to the Baptist tenets.
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Steadfast Fred
Active Member
another question for this topic--------------------------------
How did John know that in Revelation when he saw Michael and HIS Angels
that that was indeed Michael that he saw--he had never seen Michael before---had he ??--How did he know what Michael even looked like--if he didn't know who it was when he first saw him--he would have asked who it was that he had seen--but it appears that he knew right away who it was ???
Now a thought John knew BOTH what Jesus looked liked in his earthly form and also in his Glorified form---so could Michael have been Jesus in Rev. ??
What a stupid question.
Jesus revealed to John the things which must be hereafter. Jesus revealed Himself to John in the first chapter. It is clear He is known as Jesus in Heaven. He revealed Michael in the twelfth.
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HisWitness
New Member
What a stupid question.
Jesus revealed to John the things which must be hereafter. Jesus revealed Himself to John in the first chapter. It is clear He is known as Jesus in Heaven. He revealed Michael in the twelfth.
don't think I have ever called anyone stupid here--and never intend on so doing
Brother may the Lord bless your heart :jesus::jesus:
if it is stupid---maybe you have a quick and simple answer for it ???
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