1689Dave
Well-Known Member
If you understood Jesus, we would not be having this discussion. Was Peter wrong for baptizing in the name of Jesus Christ? This is what you are suggesting. Yikes!
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My Position as a Baptist Believer
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Now you are switching topics again to one where you denied the orthodox Trinity doctrine by denying that Christ is "completely God, completely human".
You are lost in the sauce, brother. I think you'd do much better to abandon the creeds for awhile and just study Scripture.
This is something that is problematic in our Christian culture. Information is readily at hand which is great, but sometimes there is too much information and we end up with "self-made scholars" like yourself. This is also the problem with word studies. People get lost in the literal meanings of words that they ignore the context of what is going on (they miss the forest for the trees).
Again, you are confused.
You believe Jesus was misguiding the Disciples when he told them to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit????? Yikes!!!!!!!!!!!
I never said anyone was wrong for using the words "Jesus Christ". Neither are they wrong for using the words "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit". They are not wrong to use the words "Father, Son, and Holy Ghost". They would not be wrong to use the words "into Christs death, burial and resurrection".
What were Peter's exact words when he performed the baptism? Quote them.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Was Peter wrong? When he baptized in Jesus' name? Why would the Catholics take credit for abolishing the practice if they did not? Wouldn't they defend themselves from developing such a false doctrine if they did not?
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
You can say anything you want. But proving it is impossible.
I'm not Catholic. Since they did not exist in the second century I suspect that they were reaching back to justify their method of "baptism". I do not believe that they even "baptize" by definition.
What makes you think we accepted their method. Could be they accepted OUR method.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Catholic = universal and evolved from Rome. They became Antichrist and you take their word over the bible in this matter.
Proving it is easy. Read the Bible. Jesus said to "baptize in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit". You claim Jesus lied to the Disciples and the Holy Spirit corrected this doctrine. You are wrong.
Baptizing in the name of does not mean using certain words. You are confused. It is the same baptism (the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit and the name of Christ).
You have no evidence Peter even used the words "I baptize you in the name of Jesus Christ". Scripture provides the act, not what was saved. And the act is the same regardless of the words spoken.
You are way too Catholic in your beliefs, way too ritualistic, way to dogmatic, and way to ignorant of Baptist theology and Christian history.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
The bible is not your method. Their's is.
The Catholic Encyclopedia, II, page 263:
"The baptismal formula was changed from the name of Jesus Christ to the words Father, Son, and Holy Spirit by the Catholic Church in the second century."
Acts 2:38, "And Peter said to them, 'Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."
Acts 10:48, "And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days."
Acts 19:5, "And when they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus."
Oh, I get it now - Matt 28 is not truly part of Scripture!
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Acts 2:38, "And Peter said to them, 'Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."
Acts 10:48, "And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days."
Acts 19:5, "And when they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus."
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
You don't understand it. That's the problem.
Matthew 28:18-20
18 And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
19 "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."
Are you calling Jesus Christ the Antichrist?
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Acts 2:38, "And Peter said to them, 'Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."
Acts 10:48, "And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days."
Acts 19:5, "And when they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus."
EXACTLY. Are you starting to understand now????? The words are not an incantation over a baptism.
Jesus said to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And the disciples baptized in the name of Christ. This is the same thing - into his life, death, and resurrection.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Here are some more.
(Acts 8:14-16) "Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them:
15 Who, when they came down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit:
16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)"
(Acts 10:47-48 Peter) "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit as well as us?
48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days."
(Acts 19:4-5) "Then Paul said, John indeed baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying to the people, that they should believe in him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus."
Again, you are missing the point.
No member here has advocated NOT baptizing in the name of Jesus Christ.
You have taken a Onness position in your theology and have rejected Scripture (implying that the Holy Spirit corrected Jesus' words in Matthew). The only person that has rejected Scripture is you. You argue against including the Father and Holy Spirit in baptism under the pretense those who do exclude Jesus Christ.....but that is a false claim and you know it.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
(Acts 8:14-16) "Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them:
15 Who, when they came down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Spirit:
16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)"
(Acts 10:47-48 Peter) "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, who have received the Holy Spirit as well as us?
48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days."
(Acts 19:4-5) "Then Paul said, John indeed baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying to the people, that they should believe in him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus."
Well done. That should end 1689Dave's ridiculous straw man argument and distracting assertion that Baptists adopted the Catholic's verbiage.
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