My thoughts and questions on "Ten Reasons Primitive Baptists Are Not Calvinists."

[Martin Marprelate]

I assure you anyone who visits or attends a PB church will hear the gospel, and, there's always 'an invitation' (short to the point) to anyone who wishes to have a home in the church.

Why, if it makes no difference?

Fatalism - no one, not one soul, is going to hell on account of any act of commission or omission on my part. Christ placed no such burden on any of us. Not even those under the yoke of the law had that burden.

Amos 6:1-8; Esther 4:13-14.

Keep your Fullerism, I had plenty enough of it growing up.

Not enough of it, it seems.

 

[kyredneck]

Why, if it makes no difference?

??? Haven't a clue what this quip is about.

Amos 6:1-8; Esther 4:13-14.

6​	Wherewith shall I come before Jehovah, and bow myself before the high God? shall I come before him with burnt-offerings, with calves a year old?
7​	will Jehovah be pleased with thousands of rams, or with ten thousands of rivers of oil? shall I give my first-born for my transgression, the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?
8​	He hath showed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth Jehovah require of thee, but to do justly, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with thy God? Mic 6

28​	Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29​	Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30​	For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Mt 11

Not enough of it, it seems.

In your nosey, busybody, Fullerite opinion.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

??? Haven't a clue what this quip is about.

Come on, man! Think! If the elect are going to get saved whatever they do and the reprobate are going to be lost whatever they do, why preach? Why have a church? Why witness? Why pray? Why not sin all the more so that grace may abound>

6​	Wherewith shall I come before Jehovah, and bow myself before the high God? shall I come before him with burnt-offerings, with calves a year old?
7​	will Jehovah be pleased with thousands of rams, or with ten thousands of rivers of oil? shall I give my first-born for my transgression, the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?
8​	He hath showed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth Jehovah require of thee, but to do justly, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with thy God? Mic 6

Not to witness is not to be kind, not to love your neighbour and not to walk humbly with your God who commands you to 'Preach the Gospel to every creature.'
'...And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations....'

28​	Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29​	Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30​	For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Mt 11

One who is saved does not find outreach and witnessing a burden. 'His commandments are not burdensome.'

In your nosey, busybody, Fullerite opinion.

I'd rather be a nosey, busybody Fullerite than an idle, self-satisfied Hyper-Calvinist.

 

[kyredneck]

Come on, man! Think! If the elect are going to get saved whatever they do and the reprobate are going to be lost whatever they do, why preach?

What a stupid question. "Feed my lambs, tend my sheep, feed my sheep". The REAL "Great Commission".

I'd rather be a nosey, busybody Fullerite

You're doing an excellent job at it.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Come on, man! Think! If the elect are going to get saved whatever they do and the reprobate are going to be lost whatever they do, why preach? Why have a church? Why witness? Why pray? Why not sin all the more so that grace may abound>




I'd rather be a nosey, busybody Fullerite than an idle, self-satisfied Hyper-Calvinist.

However it’s your responsibility to love the Hyper Calvinist, at least if you want to honor Christ. You are aware that Fullers teaching destroyed many churches in America don’t you, so was that Gods intent?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

However it’s your responsibility to love the Hyper Calvinist, at least if you want to honor Christ.

Indeed, though that doesn't mean that I have to agree with them. Also, some are easier to love than others. But your point is taken.

You are aware that Fullers teaching destroyed many churches in America don’t you, so was that Gods intent?

No. I'm not aware of it. I can only speak with knowledge on the churches in Britain, and I know that Hyper-Calvinism destroyed some churches and enfeebled many more. It appears that Christianity in the USA, which has been so strong for so many years, is fading away. If the Hyper-Calvinism exhibited on this board is typical of the nation as a whole, I have to say that I'm not surprised. Look at post #104. "Us four, no more; shut the door." That's not Christianity, much less real Calvinism.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Think for a second, allDoctrines of Grace would have unified under a Salvation via Grace mantel vs being ripped apart because of Andrew Fullers myopic focus of shaming Hyper Calvinists. Then you would have a United bulkwork against todays apostate churches that doesn’t even believe in scripture as a central point. Good work Andy, your accomplishments have destroyed churches all up and down the US coast thus opening the doors for the UMC, PCUSA, Carismatics etc.

 

[DaveXR650]

Think for a second, allDoctrines of Grace would have unified under a Salvation via Grace mantel vs being ripped apart because of Andrew Fullers myopic focus of shaming Hyper Calvinists.

Do you have evidence for that or is that your opinion?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Indeed, though that doesn't mean that I have to agree with them. Also, some are easier to love than others. But your point is taken.

No. I'm not aware of it. I can only speak with knowledge on the churches in Britain, and I know that Hyper-Calvinism destroyed some churches and enfeebled many more. It appears that Christianity in the USA, which has been so strong for so many years, is fading away. If the Hyper-Calvinism exhibited on this board is typical of the nation as a whole, I have to say that I'm not surprised. Look at post #104. "Us four, no more; shut the door." That's not Christianity, much less real Calvinism.

My wife has made the decision to attend a local UMC over the last couple of Sundays.. OK I’m attending with her. I’m telling you there is zero scriptural readings…but plenty of games, socialization of trivial things, cookie swaps, gossip, politics… everything except Christ!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Do you have evidence for that or is that your opinion?

Yea, the adoption of laxity, coupled with lack of doctrine as center posts, etc. in the NE it is most evident. in NYS it’s now a ghost town where it was once a center of PB churches and/or Reformed Doctrine. I cannot find one PB church in the whole of NJ. And that negative momentum had a very deliberate agenda for targeting every Baptist church, be it missionary or non missionary. Baptists are not popular and most have changed their names and adopted either liberal agendas, or become Charismatic.

 

[Silverhair]

It’s Gods job to provide, not any human being.

Do you do nothing to point people to God? If so why are you on this board?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Yea, the adoption of laxity, coupled with lack of doctrine as center posts, etc. in the NE it is most evident. in NYS it’s now a ghost town where it was once a center of PB churches and/or Reformed Doctrine. I cannot find one PB church in the whole of NJ. And that negative momentum had a very deliberate agenda for targeting every Baptist church, be it missionary or non missionary. Baptists are not popular and most have changed their names and adopted either liberal agendas, or become Charismatic.

Why would anyone bother to plant a church in New Jersey when it's such hard work and since he can say, "no one, not one soul, is going to hell on account of any act of commission or omission on my part." So don't you dare complain!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Why would anyone bother to plant a church in New Jersey when it's such hard work and since he can say, "no one, not one soul, is going to hell on account of any act of commission or omission on my part." So don't you dare complain!

Well I just don’t want to become a mess like your country is… nor do I want to participate in the arrogance of positioning myself as Gods little soldier when God is quite competent in bringing the elect into His kingdom.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Do you do nothing to point people to God? If so why are you on this board?

OH come on, that question is sooo darn obtuse that I can scarcely stop laughing! Now why are you on it is the more serious question. All I’ve observed of you is that you creating enemies of yourself…what a clever way to have people brought to Christ….you are a frigging genious LoL

 

[David Lamb]

The DoG have removed faith as a requirement as they have a person saved prior to trusting in God. Remember it is your calvinists theologians that say God has to give you faith and this after you are saved.

I would say, as Ephesians 1:3-6 say, that Christians were chosen before the foundation of the world. The salvation becomes a reality for the individual sinner when they believe on the Lord Jesus Christ with God-given faith. The apostles said to the Philippian jailer: "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved," not "You are saved because God chose you before the foundation of the world. Now believe!"

The calvinist theology has it backwards from what we see in scripture. You are holding to a man-made theology that has it's roots in pagan philosophy. How many times have you seen on this board that the elect were chosen before the foundation of the world. Everyone else would be damned with no hope of salvation. That theology flies in the face of scripture.

Many times have I seen, not only on this board, but in Ephesians that the elect were chosen before the foundation of the world. But nobody who ends up in hell will be able to say to God, "Well, I wanted to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be saved, but I wasn't among the elect." If somebody savingly believes on the Lord Jesus Christ, that shows that they are among the elect.

I do not question the faith of anyone on this board but I do question the theological views that they present.

I would echo that.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I would echo that.

Well you are English… but not a Briton I’m thinking

 

[David Lamb]

Well you are English… but not a Briton I’m thinking

I am English, yes, so I am also British, though not an Ancient Briton! However, I'm not sure what that has to do with what I wrote, unless I used some British English word or phrase that seemed odd to Americans. Incidentally, I have just edited my post, because most of it had been hidden among the words of the post to which I was replying, so it looked as though my whole post was just, "I would echo that."

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I am English, yes, so I am also British, though not an Ancient Briton! However, I'm not sure what that has to do with what I wrote, unless I used some British English word or phrase that seemed odd to Americans. Incidentally, I have just edited my post, because most of it had been hidden among the words of the post to which I was replying, so it looked as though my whole post was just, "I would echo that."

Ahh, I am ancient …in many ways…but now specifically American (Welsh, English, Scots, Slavic, Italian, German, Swiss, Native American). My people fought and died for our freedom, both religious and political so I’m sensitive to having foreigner’s commenting on my beliefs.

 

[DaveXR650]

Yea, the adoption of laxity, coupled with lack of doctrine as center posts, etc. in the NE it is most evident. in NYS it’s now a ghost town where it was once a center of PB churches and/or Reformed Doctrine. I cannot find one PB church in the whole of NJ. And that negative momentum had a very deliberate agenda for targeting every Baptist church, be it missionary or non missionary. Baptists are not popular and most have changed their names and adopted either liberal agendas, or become Charismatic.

I mean any evidence that Fuller caused this. You probably live where at one time there was the old white Anglo-Saxon Protestant dominance. That fell apart years ago. But out in fly over country conservative Christian groups thrived for a while. But since the 80's the idea of being a Baptist has fallen out of favor and many Baptist churches in this area are shying away from the name "Baptist". My take on it is that the WASP churches gave up their beliefs on their own 100 years ago. My fundamentalists went into politics, not just the right or wrong of issues, but partisan politics and lost some focus. The Calvinist resurgence, mainly driven by Baptists, quicky went woke and is falling apart.

I don't blame PB churches. But I don't blame Fuller either.

 

[Silverhair]

OH come on, that question is sooo darn obtuse that I can scarcely stop laughing! Now why are you on it is the more serious question. All I’ve observed of you is that you creating enemies of yourself…what a clever way to have people brought to Christ….you are a frigging genious LoL

Did you not understand the question?

The reason that people get annoyed with me is that I ask them questions they do not want to answer.

I could quote calvinist texts and calvinists/reformed/PB's still say I do not understand their view.