DrJamesAch
New Member
No doubt God really appreciates you explaining His inner workings to Him.
Don't you have a few planets to populate?
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No doubt God really appreciates you explaining His inner workings to Him.
Don't you have a few planets to populate?
No, I am fond of Earth. However, there are some openings on Uranus for you.
And I'm quite sure that planet would discard determinist feculence with magnanimous regularity
And I'm quite sure that planet would discard determinist feculence with magnanimous regularity
I never took Latin, but notice the ring around Uranus in the picture. That is a sure sign of an Arminian population.
I never took Latin, but notice the ring around Uranus in the picture. That is a sure sign of an Arminian population.
Since you are so fond of parables, here is the meaning of the above statement. Free will theology does not follow a logical sequence of events as in Scripture, but goes in circles.
Saturn, Neptune, Earth Wind & Fire, what a combinationYes...around Uranus _oh ha ha ha...that's rich:thumbs:
Saturn, Neptune, Earth Wind & Fire, what a combination:godisgood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5iok1NvWws
"You misunderstand the situation. You're visualizing that God is standing at the door of heaven, and men are thronging to get in the door, and God is saying to various ones, 'Yes, you may come, but not you, and you, but not you, etc.' The situation is hardly this. Rather, God stands at the door of heaven with His arms outstretched, inviting all to come. Yet all men without exception are running in the opposite direction towards hell as hard as they can go. So God, in election, graciously reaches out and stops this one, and that one, and this one over here, and that one over there, and effectually draws them to Himself by changing their hearts, making them willing to come."
From http://www.reformationtheology.com/2006/02/election.php
No misunderstanding at all:
"III. By the decree of God, for the manifestation of His glory, some men and angels[6] are predestinated unto everlasting life; and others foreordained to everlasting death."
Westminster Confession
Calvinists just need to be honest and tell sinners God doesn't love them unless they are elect, and since there's no way to determine whether ones elect or not, tell them just hope that God elected them.
No, I am fond of Earth. However, there are some openings on Uranus for you.
You're a universalist. God is not.
The Calvinist believes God offers salvation to people he has no intention of saving.
The non-cal believes this exactly as much as the Calvinist does.
The non-cal believes that God never had any intention of saving any person who would refuse his whole life to receive Christ as Savior. God has never intended, regardless of how much he wants to, God has never INTENDED to save people who do not repent.
Both Cals and "non-cals" believe together that there are millions of people God knew would exist that God never intended to save.
Do you see?
The non-cal believes God has no intention of saving a man who dies refusing to receive Christ.
Both Cal and non-cal believe God does not intend to save everybody.
Non-cals pretend that this is just a Calvinist problem. It is not. The non-cal has to deal with the fact that God creates billions of people who he KNOWS will never repent- people who he KNOWS will die in their sins and go to hell- yet he creates them in their mother's wombs anyway. Why? Because God is willing that some should perish. Now, as for the elect, God is patient to USward, not willing that ANY of the elect should perish but that ALL of the elect should come to repentance.
The point is this: this is a problem for us. Why would God offer salvation to people who he has no intention of saving? But it is not any MORE our problem than it is the non-calvinist's problem. The God of the non-calvinist knows he will not save a particular unrepentant sinner. Yet, God makes him anyway. God offers him salvation KNOWING he will never accept it. That is EXACTLY the same problem the Calvinist has.
Van said:If He credits a lost person's faith as righteousness, then He sets them apart in Christ, causes them to be born anew, and seals them in Christ with the Holy Spirit forever.
That is not true. God has every intention of saving all. That all does not get saved is not God's fault; it is man's. Don't blame God for the rebelliousness of man's heart. Man has the opportunity to choose Christ. He rebels. God knows about the hardness of man's heart before he chooses.
God is not willing that any should perish. His will is clearly stated.
God so loved the world--That does not express "no intention of saving." You are wrong.
The non-Cal believes in the omniscience of God. He knows ahead of time who will reject him and who will receive him. That has no bearing on God's intentions. You are attributing evil motives to God.
"All day long I have stretched forth my arms to you but you would not."
The Lord is longsuffering to all of us, including to those whom he knows will not repent. Some die without Christ having been raised in a Christian home and sat under sound preaching every week. God indeed was longsuffering with them.
Yes, he knows. He knows all things. However you, the Cal, deliberately attribute evil intentions to God, making him a monster, a sinful being. God has no sin. He is not the author of sin. He did not intend that any should go to Hell. They of their own will chose to reject him.
Apparently you don't know what the non-Cal believes and deliberately misrepresents his beliefs. The Bible states God's intentions clearly:
"He is not willing that any perish."
"He is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."
That is his intention. That it is not accomplished is the fault of man who continues to rebel against God, of his own will.
Because they refuse to accept the truth about God.
Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Why misquote the Bible, and deliberately so?
God allows the sun to shine upon those who believe and those who don't.
God allows the rain to fall upon those who believe and those who don't.
He extends his mercy and longsuffering to all. Proof of that is the fact that you are alive this day. Do you deserve to be?
He offers it to all. He intends all to be saved. It is man who rejects God, not the other way around.
God saves to the uttermost. It is man that must respond to God. This, the Calvinist has a problem with. Now, God calls all men everywhere to repent.
The non-Cal has no problem with the omniscience of God; why should the Calvinist. We don't mix and confuse omniscience with intention. One has to do with the attributes of God; the other has to do with motive. Attributing an evil motive to God is sinful.
DHK's is a good answer because it does not attempt to seek false agreement. Calvinism and Arminianism are not compatible theologies. We may agree on certain big picture doctrines but we view core beliefs differently. Scripture is bluntly clear that the sinner cannot and does not want to seek God (Romans 8:7; 1 Corinthians 2:14; Ephesians 2:1 et al.). The Arminian cannot agree with this. That is fine. Blurring the lines of distinction between us is a disservice to those honestly seeking the truth.
My motto is, "Disagreement without malice."
Saving faith is faith God credits as righteousness, our faith cannot be righteous of itself, because our works of righteousness are as filthy rags. It is God who turns the pig's ear of our faith, into the silk purse of righteousness.Saving faith is not merely believing Jesus is the Son of God, but trusting in Jesus alone to save you.
DHK's is a good answer because it does not attempt to seek false agreement. Calvinism and Arminianism are not compatible theologies. We may agree on certain big picture doctrines but we view core beliefs differently. Scripture is bluntly clear that the sinner cannot and does not want to seek God (Romans 8:7; 1 Corinthians 2:14; Ephesians 2:1 et al.). The Arminian cannot agree with this. That is fine. Blurring the lines of distinction between us is a disservice to those honestly seeking the truth.
My motto is, "Disagreement without malice."
You have got to love the "et al." Why there are lots more verses I could cite, but folks lose interest if my post gets too long. LOLScripture is bluntly clear that the sinner cannot and does not want to seek God (Romans 8:7; 1 Corinthians 2:14; Ephesians 2:1 et al.)