Original Sin Again

the nature of man desired to obey God and please Him, but after the fall, changed to pleasing ourselves and disobeying God!

 

That is not what Scripture testifies of Adam.

That is why there was the Fall.

Because Adam disobeyed.


God bless.

 

All of us were condemned along with Adam in the fall to now have the sin natures, and to be born in a state of rebellion against God...

 

Adam did not seek to obey God before he fell?

 

And that is all of our condition/state after the fall, save for Jesus, who bypassed being corrupted in His humanity via the Virgin Birth!

 

All that matters is that...Adam sinned.

That shows that it was within his nature, just as it is within our own.

What Adam did have that we are not created unto is direct, face to face communion with God, and access to the Tree of Life. Death has come upon all men specifically because Adam was thrust out of the Garden:


Genesis 3:22-24
King James Version (KJV)

22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

23 Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.

24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.


God bless.

 

He also had before the fall a created nature that was sinless in the sense that was morally perfect...

 

Its simply not possible for him to have a "sinless nature" when the entirety of the Bible revolves over the fact that he sinned.

Only God is sinless. That is proved in both the case of Man and Angels. Created beings are after all created beings. Only by the immersion of a created being into God do we see the hope for separation from the penalty, pollution, and presence of sin, and this in the eternal state when we receive that body we groan for.


God bless.

 

jesus was conxceived by the Holy Spirit in Mary, and that allowed him to bypass being affected by the fall of Adam....
ALL of us are born as sinners, so are you saying jesus was born with same nature as that also?

 

Now this raises an interesting point of discussion.

Would we not consider the fact that the flesh the Son of man took upon Himself was not "conceived," but created by God in the womb of Mary, much like God took of the elements of the earth and created Adam's flesh. Secondly, our proclivity towards sin has, as you are pointing out in excellent fashion, nothing to do with a biologically based impetus, but deals primarily with the "thoughts and intents" of the heart, or in other words, is related to our spirit and how we look at things.

That being said, we again go back to the point I made originally, which is that Christ was God manifest in the flesh, therefore incapable, even though having taken on flesh (which holds its own element of importance in regards to sin), of committing sin, though tempted.

And we look at the impact of the flesh on sin. I have often told people, if you do not feel your flesh has control over you...try fasting. And you will soon see how quickly the flesh seeks to drive your actions. Lust is another issue. But would we really conceive of the Son of God...lusting after a woman? Contemplating stealing food because he was hungry? And any other number of scenarios we could create to point out the nature of the flesh in regards to sin?

Just thinking out loud here, and enjoying this discussion immensely. It is helping me out tremendously.


God bless.

 

IF Jesus was not Virgin birthed, conceived by the Holy Spirit within Mary, then he would have been under the fall, a sinner, and not able to save us!

 

when Adan fell, all afterwards, save Jesus, would be experiencing having the sin nature in them now!
Jesus was born in the same human flesh as all of us, save NOT born with a sin nature....But a perfect and Holy human nature!

 

He was born with the same Humanity as Adam was created with, being morally perfect and sinless, so was Human, without a sin nature!IF jesus was born with same nature we all have, he would not qualify to be a Messiah!

 

If having the ability to sin or not having the ability to sin is the sin nature, then Adam had it.

That's not entirely accurate: we are all born to a human father, He was not. Neither any man or Mary contributed to the body which was created in Mary.

He was perfect and Holy, despite being veiled in human flesh.

Again, you continue to make assertions apart from a Scriptural support. Do you think people are just going to take your word for it that you are correct in your assertions? They won't. You need to include Scripture to support your assertions.


God bless.

 

The persons rejected our viewpoints are those whose concept of the sin nature/original Sin/the fall deviate from what the scriptures state to us...