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Pastor compensation

Luke2427

Active Member
Exactly. And giving my best may be more or less than another person's best. I don't see how we can pay someone for something that cannot be measured.

Because that is not how we do anything else in life. I just this hour wrote a check to my mechanic for four hundred and five dollars and fifty-nine cents- not for doing his best, but for results.
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Hey!! I just found out the median household income in our town is over $100,000!!

I think it's time for a large raise!!!
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Because that is not how we do anything else in life. I just this hour wrote a check to my mechanic for four hundred and five dollars and fifty-nine cents- not for doing his best, but for results.

But that is something that can be measured.

How do you pay a pain doctor? By how much pain he takes away? How do you measure that?

How do you pay a teacher? For how many college graduates he produces? Or how about how high the test scores are? That might work!
 

Luke2427

Active Member
I think the best thing to do is to pay the pastor the median income of the area he's ministering in. That way all is equal.

We don't pay our president based on the the average salary of the US citizen. We don't pay our mayors that way either. This is because their position is very valuable. So is the pastor's. We should pay him what he is worth as best we can; not relegate his salary to what the average member makes. That may sound spiritual and noble to do- but it is not wise nor logical.
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Sure, and commendations on starting that new work!

I just want you and all of us to think big. I hope that you will go to this place praying like John Knox who said, "Give me Scotland or I die"! I pray your attitude is that of George Whitefield, who prayed, "O Lord, give me souls or take my soul"! or like Henry Martyn that you mourn when you see others trapped in false religion and cry out, "I cannot endure existence if Jesus is to be so dishonored"!

God bless you for your willingness to serve the Master!

Thanks!!

We're going into the largest town in Suffolk County with the largest school district on the Island. Over 50% of the homes have children under 18 which means that it's a much younger population than what we have in our town. Less than 1% of the residents in the town go to a church that could be labeled "evangelical" (we looked through statements of faith for each church in the town to be able to identify them) so that leaves us 99% to work on. 99% of half a million people (as of 2000).

We're definitely thinking big.
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
We don't pay our president based on the the average salary of the US citizen. We don't pay our mayors that way either. This is because their position is very valuable. So is the pastor's. We should pay him what he is worth as best we can; not relegate his salary to what the average member makes. That may sound spiritual and noble to do- but it is not wise nor logical.

It's a good measuring stick though. You're not going to get a "you're paid too much" when it is the median income. And if it's the median income, OTHERS are living on that so the pastor can too.
 

jaigner

Active Member
If a man works twenty hours a week and doubles the church attendance and the people are growing spiritually and the offerings are through the roof and missions giving is doubled- pay the man what he is worth.

If he works 80 hours a week and the church is drying up and dying on the vine- pay the man what he is actually worth to the ministry there- not based on how many hours he works or how much sweat he devotes.

Wow. This sounds like a business model. The pastor isn't a CEO and looking at growth isn't always a good way to determine how good a job someone is doing. Ministry should be liberated from the "success syndrome." (Check out the good book by Hughes).
 

Luke2427

Active Member
Thanks!!

We're going into the largest town in Suffolk County with the largest school district on the Island. Over 50% of the homes have children under 18 which means that it's a much younger population than what we have in our town. Less than 1% of the residents in the town go to a church that could be labeled "evangelical" (we looked through statements of faith for each church in the town to be able to identify them) so that leaves us 99% to work on. 99% of half a million people (as of 2000).

We're definitely thinking big.


What a great opportunity!! Praise God for you guys!
 

Luke2427

Active Member
Wow. This sounds like a business model. The pastor isn't a CEO and looking at growth isn't always a good way to determine how good a job someone is doing. Ministry should be liberated from the "success syndrome." (Check out the good book by Hughes).

God deliver us from small thinkers and shallow dreamers and visionless, passionless occupiers of positions whose work is characterized by activity without productivity, too.
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
God deliver us from small thinkers and shallow dreamers and visionless, passionless occupiers of positions whose work is characterized by activity without productivity, too.

But do you think that pastors that are putting in 80 hours a week and still do not see growth in their church - but they are big thinkers, deep dreamers, have a massive vision of what can be and have a passion for the Gospel of Jesus Christ - do not deserve their wages?

I guess you haven't tried to church in NY.
 

jaigner

Active Member
God deliver us from small thinkers and shallow dreamers and visionless, passionless occupiers of positions whose work is characterized by activity without productivity, too.

I'm not talking about them. I'm talking about people who faithfully serve God and desire to see God's Kingdom increased.
 

abcgrad94

Active Member
A pastor's job is to feed the sheep. It's not his fault if the sheep refuse to come eat, if they fail to reproduce, etc. He is to be faithful. He should not be paid according to his sheep's behavior.
 

Dale-c

Active Member
One of the worst things we can do is pay our pastors according to business standards.
I don't see any specifics in scripture that tell us exactly what we should pay a pastor.
It should be up to each congregation to do as they can and what they believe is best in their situation.

Many pastors are underpaid because their congregation can't afford anymore.
That is fine. I do think though that if a church can pay a pastor enough so that he does not have to be concerned with finances and can put all of his effort into study and pastoring that is best.

An underpaid pastor in a church that can afford more is a shame.
Some churches just can't afford more.
 

freeatlast

New Member
One of the worst things we can do is pay our pastors according to business standards.
I don't see any specifics in scripture that tell us exactly what we should pay a pastor.
It should be up to each congregation to do as they can and what they believe is best in their situation.

Many pastors are underpaid because their congregation can't afford anymore.
That is fine. I do think though that if a church can pay a pastor enough so that he does not have to be concerned with finances and can put all of his effort into study and pastoring that is best.

An underpaid pastor in a church that can afford more is a shame.
Some churches just can't afford more.

Then they don't need a full time pastor.
 

matt wade

Well-Known Member
Then they don't need a full time pastor.

No, maybe they just need a pastor that is more concerned about doing God's will than making money?

I for one am thankful for all the pastors and missionaries who make numerous sacrifices in their lives to do the work of God. It's interesting how most of those willing to make the sacrifices I speak of are the "unlearned". Those with M.Div.'s don't want to "waste" their education.

As William Borden wrote....No Reserves. No Retreats. No Regrets.
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
No, maybe they just need a pastor that is more concerned about doing God's will than making money?

How about being able to live? Being a pastor is usually a full time job - moreso in a small church where he might be the only employee. In our church, we have numerous pastors and so the responsibility is spread across more shoulders so it makes each person's job slightly easier (but it also frees them to increase their area of ministry to larger influence than a single pastor most likely would be able to do).

But sacrifice we have. My husband was a well established computer engineer (doing both hardware and software) in the audio industry. His programs and equipment are used for Broadway plays, movie production, large concerts and the like around the world. But he gave that up to go into the ministry - and our salary has been cut in less than half. When he entered the ministry, we had 4 children at home but now we have 2 in college. But God has blessed us greatly and multiplied the loaves and the fishes. We're certainly not comfortable and there are lots of home things that we've had to put off because we just don't have the money but we're happy. We're blessed that we have a home, that we have some cushion and we can downscale any time we need to and we're willing to do that. We've sacrificed a lot of lifestyle and financial peace in order to be in the ministry but we'd not change it for the world.
 

John Toppass

Active Member
Site Supporter
How about being able to live? Being a pastor is usually a full time job - moreso in a small church where he might be the only employee. In our church, we have numerous pastors and so the responsibility is spread across more shoulders so it makes each person's job slightly easier (but it also frees them to increase their area of ministry to larger influence than a single pastor most likely would be able to do).

But sacrifice we have. My husband was a well established computer engineer (doing both hardware and software) in the audio industry. His programs and equipment are used for Broadway plays, movie production, large concerts and the like around the world. But he gave that up to go into the ministry - and our salary has been cut in less than half. When he entered the ministry, we had 4 children at home but now we have 2 in college. But God has blessed us greatly and multiplied the loaves and the fishes. We're certainly not comfortable and there are lots of home things that we've had to put off because we just don't have the money but we're happy. We're blessed that we have a home, that we have some cushion and we can downscale any time we need to and we're willing to do that. We've sacrificed a lot of lifestyle and financial peace in order to be in the ministry but we'd not change it for the world.

I have many pastor friends and I think most are underpaid. One of my dearest pastor friends was listening to me talk about what I gave up when I started going to church and serving the Lord. He looked at me, smiled and said "Wow, what if Jesus had to give up that much."
From that point on I realized I could never give up enough for what I had already received.
 

freeatlast

New Member
No, maybe they just need a pastor that is more concerned about doing God's will than making money?

I for one am thankful for all the pastors and missionaries who make numerous sacrifices in their lives to do the work of God. It's interesting how most of those willing to make the sacrifices I speak of are the "unlearned". Those with M.Div.'s don't want to "waste" their education.

As William Borden wrote....No Reserves. No Retreats. No Regrets.

My statements were never about over paying a man, but about paying one what is due for what he is doing. How about the members being concerned about doing God's will rather then keeping the money for themselves? They could start sacrificing and giving more. Eat less and different, don't eat out, don't by the new car, don't go on vacation, give up your retirement, and so on. Why expect the Pastor to be the one doing all the scarifying? And I am with what you wrote about William Booth. the church members might try and practice that if they want a full time Pastor.
 
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