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Featured Propitiation do you know what it means?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Revmitchell, Feb 15, 2022.

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  1. ntchristian

    ntchristian Active Member

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    Of course not. Only those who hold to doctrines invented in 1500 know what the Bible teaches.
     
    #81 ntchristian, Feb 16, 2022
  2. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Don't flatter yourself :Geek

    I have given Scripture references in the other thread where you also participated
     
    #82 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
  3. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Complete HOGWASH :eek:
     
    #83 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
  4. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not really up on this enough to argue but if you all are interested I would recommend "Baptist Theology, A Four Century Study" and "Arminian and Baptist, Explorations in a Theological Tradition". Both argue against any meaningful direct influence of Anabaptism on either branch of modern Baptist practice.
     
    #84 DaveXR650, Feb 16, 2022
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  5. ntchristian

    ntchristian Active Member

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    References which refute it are not accurate. But, yes, we'll have to disagree. I have no desire to fight about it.

    There were two kinds of early Baptists -- the General, which were first, and the Particular. The Generals had a connection to Mennonites; the Particulars did not.
     
    #85 ntchristian, Feb 16, 2022
  6. ntchristian

    ntchristian Active Member

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    They can't prove PSA from church history or from the Bible. I have asked several times to show me in scripture where it says that Jesus paid the penalty for our sins. They cannot because it is not there. Show me where it says that God punished, tortured, and killed Jesus in our place -- again, not there.
     
    #86 ntchristian, Feb 16, 2022
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  7. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

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    You're kidding! Smyth was more influenced by the Mennonites than Thomas Helwys. Helwys and Smith had severe disagreements and Helwys I think even excommunicated Smyths congregation. It is debatable whether Mennonites or Anabaptists had any direct influence on modern day General Baptists. I just haven't had time to really look into it.
     
    #87 DaveXR650, Feb 16, 2022
  8. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    #88 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
  9. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    #89 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
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  10. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Its not the only one. Christus Victor is there, Ransom is there and they are all true. Its not an either or scenario
     
    #90 Revmitchell, Feb 16, 2022
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  11. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    #91 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
  12. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Yep. They'll give you a verse and tell you what they wish it said.
     
    #92 JonC, Feb 16, 2022
  13. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    or you don't like what the verse says!

    Show from Isaiah 53, any other "theory" of the Atonement, than PSA.

    You have your chance to prove those who hold this view as Biblical, to be wrong!
     
    #93 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
  14. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    @ntchristian,
    One major thing Anabaptist and Baptist have in common would be the water immersion. It is my understanding John Smyth's believer's "baptism" for which he and his followers were called Baptist originally did not immerse.
     
    #94 37818, Feb 16, 2022
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  15. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    #95 SavedByGrace, Feb 16, 2022
  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    But there are no verses I have rejected (even if they were not to my liking).

    The point is you have not provided any passages that confirm Penal Substitution Theory. You have provided passages, but then ypu add to them and think that is proof. It is not.
     
    #96 JonC, Feb 16, 2022
  17. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Look like the Apostles knew about in the first 4 chapters of Romans.
     
    #97 Iconoclast, Feb 16, 2022
  18. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Early on they used "living water" (water that was moving.....like a river). But they typically poured the water over the head of those being baptized.

    People argue "baptism" means "to immerse" (it does)....but it also means to marinate or soak. I have not seen any who marinate new Christians in water.
     
    #98 JonC, Feb 16, 2022
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Except it is not actually in the text (it is not "what is written"). I know you belueve it is what is taught, but that cannot stand the biblical test of doctrine.
     
    #99 JonC, Feb 16, 2022
  20. ntchristian

    ntchristian Active Member

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    How does what you say in your first two sentences disagree with what I said? The General Baptists I was talking about were the early ones. But the modern ones are spiritual descendants.
     
    #100 ntchristian, Feb 16, 2022
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