Salvation In the Millennial Kingdom?

[Me4Him]

Originally posted by OldRegular:
Me4Him
You are being disingenuous to say the very least. You cannot show one passage of Scripture that states that Jesus Christ will reign on earth for 1000 years. You simply evade the issue by being silly!

Do you know what bible verse you remind me of??

Lu 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Isa 4:2 In that day shall the branch (Jesus) of the LORD be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the earth shall be excellent and comely for them that are escaped of Israel.

3 And it shall come to pass, that he that is left in Zion, and he that remaineth in Jerusalem, shall be called holy, even every one that is written among the living in Jerusalem:

4 When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.

5 And the LORD will create upon every dwelling place of mount Zion, and upon her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day, and the shining of a flaming fire by night: for upon all the glory shall be a defence.

6 And there shall be a tabernacle for a shadow in the daytime from the heat, and for a place of refuge, and for a covert from storm and from rain.

Zec 8:3 Thus saith the LORD; I am returned unto Zion, and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and Jerusalem shall be called a city of truth; and the mountain of the LORD of hosts the holy mountain.

4 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; There shall yet old men and old women dwell in the streets of Jerusalem, and every man with his staff in his hand for very age.

5 And the streets of the city shall be full of boys and girls playing in the streets thereof.

Isa 11:6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.

8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.

10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, (Jesus) which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious. (7th day of rest)

Heb 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

Heb 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.

9 There remaineth therefore a(nother 7th day of) rest to the people of God.

 

[Hope of Glory]

The idea that we go to heaven when we die and spend eternity there with the Lord has much less support than the earthly reign of the Lord.

Yep, yep, yep!

If only more saw beyond tradition and looked at what the Scriptures say, they too would see this truth.

 

[Brother Bob]

James_Newman (quote)

Do we just ignore 'I will come again'? The second coming is the obvious frame of reference here.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please add the rest to it (to receive you unto myself that where I am there you may be also).

Why would he go back to the Father to build us a mansion if we never was going up there to it?

 

[James_Newman]

The answer to that question is easy. The mansion is coming here.

Revelation 22:12
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

 

[Brother Bob]

He said (in) my Fathers house. There were some mansions already up there.

 

[OldRegular]

Originally posted by Me4Him:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by OldRegular:
Me4Him
You are being disingenuous to say the very least. You cannot show one passage of Scripture that states that Jesus Christ will reign on earth for 1000 years. You simply evade the issue by being silly!

</font>[/QUOTE]Me4Him
You are still being disingenuous to say the very least. You still cannot show one passage of Scripture that states that Jesus Christ will reign on earth for 1000 years. You still simply evade the issue by being silly!

 

[James_Newman]

Originally posted by Brother Bob:
He said (in) my Fathers house. There were some mansions already up there.

No argument here.

 

[Mel Miller]

OldRegular:
_______________________________________________
“Can you show me a passage of Scripture that shows that Jesus Christ will reign on earth for 1000 years”?
_______________________________________________

You are asking the wrong question after assuming there will NOT be a 1000-year reign. The matter is beyond whether "Survivors to the End will reign over the nations on earth”. It deals with Martyrs who will "Serve God and Reign with Christ in the Temple of heaven". Rev.7:15-17.

The Martyrs' 1000-Year Reign with Christ (Rev.20:4) will NOT occur on earth!! The subjects of that reign will “serve God in heaven and reign there with Christ for 1000 years”!
They will “serve God day and night for 1000 years in heaven's Temple”! Rev.20:4; Rev.7:15.

This cannot possibly refer to the New Heavens
and Earth when there will be "no more Temple"!

The Lamb will “lead the Martyrs to living fountains of waters at the same time God dwells among them” while it is still day and night on the earth!! The Martyrs begin to reign before the “resurrection" of their bodies; while
they are still referred to as "souls". That's why their service is in the present tense!!

But their actual service does not begin until the Day Christ comes in glory.

They come out from under the Altar on the Day Christ comes in glory!!!!

They cannot “enter the Temple until the last plague empties on the Day Christ comes in glory”. The last Plague must empty in the air and the smoke of God’s glory and power must clear the Temple before the Martyrs come out from under the Altar and begin to serve God day and night in heaven for 1000 years. Rev.15:8.

James above comes close to the truth when he claims the events of Revelation are presented in the past tense AS OF THE DAY CHRIST COMES IN GLORY. It is the aorist tense, indicative mood used over and over of things that “have come” on the Day Christ returns in power and great glory!

The things included as “having come” on the Day Christ comes in glory are the Resurrection (the appointed time to judge the dead); the Rewards
for every Believer (rewarded on the day Christ comes as He promised in Matt.16:27; Rev.22:12) and the total destruction of the wicked. The appointed (kairos) time for each of these three things “has come” (haylthen) as of the Day Christ comes in glory! Rev.11:18.

On this day the Martyrs begin to serve God in heaven day and night for 1000 years. The only reason for introducing the 1000 years is that it begins with the First Resurrection (literal bodily resurrection of the Martyrs) on the Day Christ comes in glory! That's why the "first
resurrection" is mentioned in conjunction with
the Day the Martyrs begin to "serve God in the
Temple of heaven". This begins ONLY when the
last Martyr has been killed. Rev.6:11.

Until you recognize that the Martyrs will reign in heaven for 1000 years, while survivors to the End will “reign over the nations with an iron rod,” you are walking a treadmill of non-recognition of the great and wonderful rewards
awaiting those who “love not their life unto death”. You are missing the purpose of the 1000-Years which cannot begin until the Last Plague empties in the air and the Martyrs come out from under the Altar and the elder wonders out loud:
“Who are these and from whence did they come”?

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

[OldRegular]

Mel Miller

Classic dispensational doctrine claims that Jesus Christ will return to this present earth at the end of the seven year "great tribulation" period and sit on David's throne in Jerusalem.

Those who enter this "millennial kingdom" will be
1. the glorified Church, those Saints whose bodies were resurrected in the "rapture" before the "great tribulation" and
2. mortal Gentiles and Jews somehow converted during the "great tribulation".

These mortals who enter the "millennial kingdom" will marry and have children and in time die. Their progeny will do the same. My question is: According to dispensational doctrine how are all those who are born in the "kingdom" during the 1000 years saved?

 

[Me4Him]

Originally posted by OldRegular:
Mel Miller

Classic dispensational doctrine claims that Jesus Christ will return to this present earth at the end of the seven year "great tribulation" period and sit on David's throne in Jerusalem.

Those who enter this "millennial kingdom" will be
1. the glorified Church, those Saints whose bodies were resurrected in the "rapture" before the "great tribulation" and
2. mortal Gentiles and Jews somehow converted during the "great tribulation".

These mortals who enter the "millennial kingdom" will marry and have children and in time die. Their progeny will do the same. My question is: According to dispensational doctrine how are all those who are born in the "kingdom" during the 1000 years saved?

No man comes to the father except by me,

What's so hard to understand about that, the sacrifices under the OT only "purified the flesh" they didn't "purge the conscience" of sin to serve God, as Jesus's death does,

only the "DEATH" of a person, (Jesus/Man) will satisfy the requirements of the law.

Folks reject Jesus the last time he came, and some, even seeing him sitting in the temple, still won't believe,

you have to remember that the Jews are expecting a "MAN", much like Moses/Elijah to be the "MESSIAH", not "God in the flesh",

Elijah went to heaven in a "Whirlwind", seeing Jesus return, recognizing him as the "MAN" they crucified still wouldn't convince some Jews they had crucified "GOD".

Get the picture????

 

[Brother Bob]

1000 years is spoken of as in "past tense".

 

[OldRegular]

Originally posted by Me4Him:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by OldRegular:
Mel Miller

Classic dispensational doctrine claims that Jesus Christ will return to this present earth at the end of the seven year "great tribulation" period and sit on David's throne in Jerusalem.

Those who enter this "millennial kingdom" will be
1. the glorified Church, those Saints whose bodies were resurrected in the "rapture" before the "great tribulation" and
2. mortal Gentiles and Jews somehow converted during the "great tribulation".

These mortals who enter the "millennial kingdom" will marry and have children and in time die. Their progeny will do the same. My question is: According to dispensational doctrine how are all those who are born in the "kingdom" during the 1000 years saved?

No man comes to the father except by me,

What's so hard to understand about that, the sacrifices under the OT only "purified the flesh" they didn't "purge the conscience" of sin to serve God, as Jesus's death does,

only the "DEATH" of a person, (Jesus/Man) will satisfy the requirements of the law.

Folks reject Jesus the last time he came, and some, even seeing him sitting in the temple, still won't believe,

you have to remember that the Jews are expecting a "MAN", much like Moses/Elijah to be the "MESSIAH", not "God in the flesh",

Elijah went to heaven in a "Whirlwind", seeing Jesus return, recognizing him as the "MAN" they crucified still wouldn't convince some Jews they had crucified "GOD".

Get the picture???? </font>[/QUOTE]Frankly me4Him, nothing you post makes sense! And you still have not answered the question: How are all those who are born in the "kingdom" during the 1000 years saved?

 

[Me4Him]

Originally posted by OldRegular:
Frankly me4Him, nothing you post makes sense! And you still have not answered the question: How are all those who are born in the "kingdom" during the 1000 years saved?

WHY am I NOT "Surprised"???

Pssss, Hay, I've heard they won't let you in Heaven unless you believe, and they might not let you in the MK unless you believe in it either,

[personal attack edited]

[ March 29, 2006, 03:10 AM: Message edited by: DHK ]

 

[James_Newman]

Originally posted by Me4Him:

Pssss, Hay, I've heard they won't let you in Heaven unless you believe, and they might not let you in the MK unless you believe in it either,

you may be right about that...

 

[Me4Him]

Originally posted by James_Newman:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Me4Him:

Pssss, Hay, I've heard they won't let you in Heaven unless you believe, and they might not let you in the MK unless you believe in it either,

you may be right about that... </font>[/QUOTE]Simple, blind, faith, covers a multitude of "Sin", even "ignorance",

I know, I'm saved.

No smart remarks from the the "peanut gallery" either.

 

[James_Newman]

The servant that didn't know his masters will and didn't do it is still beaten with stripes. Jesus gave a commandment to seek first the kingdom of God.

Hebrews 11:6
6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

 

[Mel Miller]

OldRegular,

Your quote:
"My question is: According to dispensational doctrine how are all those who are born in the `kingdom' during the 1000 years saved'"?
______________________________________________

Jesus laid down the condition by which the sheep
nations will be saved during the Millennium.

Those left of the nations on the Day Christ becomes "King over all the earth" must come
annually to Jerusalem to worship at the Feast
of Tabernacles. Zech.14:9,16-21.

In addition Jesus requires that those who fail
to "treat His brothers" as they outwardly had
treated Him would be separated from the sheep and cast into Hell". Matt.25:32-34.

This is NOT the condition for salvation during
the present dispensation. Therefore separating
the goats from the sheep cannot occur until
whole nations form as either sheep or goats
while the Martyrs "serve God and reign with Christ in the Temple of heaven for 1000 years". Rev.20:4-5; Rev.7:15-17.

The KJV speaks of these "saved nations" being
required to "bring their honor and glory into
the New Jerusalem". Rev.21:24-26. Furthermore,
they must enter the New Jerusalem from time to
time to "be healed by the leaves of the tree
of life". This continues a requirement that
exists on earth during the Millennim. Rev.22:
2,14; Ezek.47:12.

Since the 1000 years are required for all the Martrys to "serve God in Heaven's Temple" prior to the New Heaven and Earth, the sheep and goat
nations will be formed on the one hand by true worship of Christ and on the other hand by not showing the love of Christ toward His brothers.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

[Mel Miller]

Brother Bob,

Regarding your statement that the "1000 years
is in the past tense," you are referring to
the Aorist tense, Indicative mood. But that
only refers to what happens on the Day Christ
returns which is only the start of 1000 years!!

Each reference to the 1000 years itself occurs
in the Aorist tense, Subjunctive mood. This
means that whatever relates to the fulfillment
of the Millennial reign of Christ is "future"
to the start of His reign over the earth/and
in heaven as He will shepherd the Martyrs for
1000 years. Rev.7:15-17; Rev.20:4-5.

John changes from using the Indicative mood
to that of the Subjunctive mood to show that
the 1000 years has only begun on the Day the
Beast and False Prophet are cast to Hell and
Satan is cast to the Abyss.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

[OldRegular]

Originally posted by Me4Him:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by OldRegular:
Frankly me4Him, nothing you post makes sense! And you still have not answered the question: How are all those who are born in the "kingdom" during the 1000 years saved?

WHY am I NOT "Surprised"???

Pssss, Hay, I've heard they won't let you in Heaven unless you believe, and they might not let you in the MK unless you believe in it either,

</font>[/QUOTE]Perhaps you can tell me why Saints in Glorified [Resurrected] bodies would want to live on earth in the presence of sinful mortals.

Also my name is not vern. I assume that is meant as a slur so if you refer to me in this manner again and I will object to the moderators.

[ March 29, 2006, 03:11 AM: Message edited by: DHK ]

 

[OldRegular]

Originally posted by Mel Miller:
OldRegular,

Your quote:
"My question is: According to dispensational doctrine how are all those who are born in the `kingdom' during the 1000 years saved'"?
______________________________________________

Jesus laid down the condition by which the sheep
nations will be saved during the Millennium.

Those left of the nations on the Day Christ becomes "King over all the earth" must come
annually to Jerusalem to worship at the Feast
of Tabernacles. Zech.14:9,16-21.

In addition Jesus requires that those who fail
to "treat His brothers" as they outwardly had
treated Him would be separated from the sheep and cast into Hell". Matt.25:32-34.

This is NOT the condition for salvation during
the present dispensation. Therefore separating
the goats from the sheep cannot occur until
whole nations form as either sheep or goats
while the Martyrs "serve God and reign with Christ in the Temple of heaven for 1000 years". Rev.20:4-5; Rev.7:15-17.

The KJV speaks of these "saved nations" being
required to "bring their honor and glory into
the New Jerusalem". Rev.21:24-26. Furthermore,
they must enter the New Jerusalem from time to
time to "be healed by the leaves of the tree
of life". This continues a requirement that
exists on earth during the Millennim. Rev.22:
2,14; Ezek.47:12.

Since the 1000 years are required for all the Martrys to "serve God in Heaven's Temple" prior to the New Heaven and Earth, the sheep and goat
nations will be formed on the one hand by true worship of Christ and on the other hand by not showing the love of Christ toward His brothers.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

Since I disagree with everything in the above post any attempt at reply would be futile.