steaver said:
↑
I am trying to see if we do actually differ on the point of "non essential
for salvation". You keep letting off the "
for salvation" part. Are you doing this for some deceptive purpose?
BobRyan said:
↑
Rebellion against God is not 'for salvation" as we probably both know.
For example - I do not believe that Catholics are all lost because they all bow down before images and promise to serve those they represent even though this clearly violates the Commandments of God. (As I have said in the past) -- "to him that knows to do right and does it not - to him it is sin".
James 4:17
so then your "non essential for salvation" could be worked into a lot of scenarios trying to get all of scripture to be "non essential".
I also believe that
Romans 2:13-16 - says that gentiles with no access to scripture at all - are in some cases saved because they experience the New Birth - via the Holy Spirit.
This does not mean that as Christians we should ignore the Bible or should bow down before images or should not know who Christ is... Or should view all of that as "not important" for Christians.
all of your games aside "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12.
the text remains true no matter how many "yes no" games you would like to engage in as we probably both agree.
BobRyan said:
↑
Rev 14:12 is neither confused or misspoken -- and we both know it.
"The saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12
Neither is my quote of
James 4:17 "the one who knows to do right and does it not - to him it is sin"
The point remains
Steaver said:
↑
Now either you misspoke or you are confused about your SDA beliefs?
Hint: you don't rebel against something you don't know about.
Obviously.
So then back to that statement -- and then you show me where you are having difficulty with the concept.
===============================
==
Rebellion against God is not 'for salvation" as we probably both know.
For example - I do not believe that Catholics are all lost because they all bow down before images and promise to serve those they represent even though this clearly violates the Commandments of God. (As I have said in the past) -- "to him that knows to do right and does it not - to him it is sin". James 4:17
so then your "non essential for salvation" could be worked into a lot of scenarios trying to get all of scripture to be "non essential".
I also believe that Romans 2:13-16 - says that gentiles with no access to scripture at all - are in some cases saved because they experience the New Birth - via the Holy Spirit.
This does not mean that as Christians we should ignore the Bible or should bow down before images or should not know who Christ is... Or should view all of that as "not important" for Christians.
all of your games aside "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12.
the text remains true no matter how many "yes no" games you would like to engage in as we probably both agree
you "seem" to want to fall on your sword demanding that Rev 14:12 and James 4:17 can't BOTH be true. Why keep doing that as if that is "helping" your argument???
Rebellion against God is not 'for salvation" as we probably both know.
For example - I do not believe that Catholics are all lost because they all bow down before images and promise to serve those they represent even though this clearly violates the Commandments of God. (
As I have said in the past) --
"to him that knows to do right and does it not - to him it is sin". James 4:17
so then your "non essential for salvation" could be worked into a lot of scenarios trying to get all of scripture to be "non essential".
I also believe that Romans 2:13-16 - says that gentiles with no access to scripture at all - are in some cases saved because they experience the New Birth - via the Holy Spirit.
This does not mean that as Christians we should ignore the Bible or should bow down before images or should not know who Christ is... Or should view all of that as "not important" for Christians.
all of your games aside
"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12.
the text remains true no matter how many "yes no" games you would like to engage in as we probably both agree
Who are these who are ignorant???
I just gave the example above of Catholics bowing down before images and promising to serve those that they represent. You read that right?
By contrast Romans 1:18-32 is about pagans who have no access to the Bible at all - their only access to truth - is nature itself.
Romans 1:18–32
[18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. [19] For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. [20] For
his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world,
in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. [21] For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. [22] Claiming to be wise, they became fools, [23] and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.
[24] Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, [25] because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.
[26] For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions... [32]
Though they know God's righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.
